Hello there!
I’m here cause I’ve just woken up and I need to talk to y’all about the dream I’ve had about the series finale.
On Tuesday (before ep 14 aired) I dreamed that everyone died on Tantiss and I was a mess (the Kiner’s cryptic tweet messed with my psyche).
Some things are slipping away from me, but I swear it was SO GOOD.
.
The dream starts with CX-2. He is at Tantiss and there is a clone rebellion going on. I don’t know if Rex got there with some of the boys, but the place is a mess.
He realises that there is something he needs to do, so he grabs Scorch and Wolffe and takes them to the top of the mountain.
There, he is having an identity crisis and he is trying to explain to them that they are working with the bad guys. Wolffe and Scorch don’t understand so CX-2 removes his helmet…
It’s Tech.
At that moment, in the middle of a panic attack, Omega and Hunter reach the top and they see him. I don’t know why, but I think that’s the only way they can escape Tantiss.
Omega starts crying and Hunter is frozen.
No one moves.
Wrecker arrives.
Then Echo.
And finally Cross.
No one moves.
When Cross sees him he starts crying, apologising. If he had known that Tech had been on Tantiss all this time, he would have never left him behind.
Everyone is too shocked to do something, but at that moment Hemlock (I don’t know how but he is on an Imperial Cruiser, same as Rampart in season 1) starts bombarding Tantiss.
Hunter reacts first. He can feel it coming. He grabs Omega and Tech and hugs them.
Wrecker moves next. He embraces the three of them.
Echo gets to them as well. Then Cross.
They all hug while Tantiss shakes, explosions all around them…
And I “wake up”.
(I know this may seem like an awful ending… but wait because there is more. I’m still dreaming, though at the moment I thought that I wasn’t.)
I “wake up” and I’m extremely happy because I realise 3 things:
1. We were not Delulu. Tech’s alive and we got him back.
2. The episode was 89 minutes long.
3. That can’t possibly be the ending. That’s a cliffhanger and they are about to announce season 4.
I get up, prepare breakfast and my sister comes home. I start crying and telling her about the finale (she is not a star wars fan, hasn’t even watched the movies, but I’m a mess and I need to tell her how the season ended).
She starts recording me while I sob and talk about the season finale and I think: this is nice cause then I can post my reaction online so that I interact with all of you, cause it’s impossible that I’m the only one having meltdown.
That’s when I wake up, for real.
And I realise that:
It’s Friday.
The episode hasn’t aired.
My sister hasn’t recorded me.
And Tech’s gone.
(I won’t give up on him. There is one more episode to go).
I needed to write this down as soon as I woke up cause I was going to forget everything.
I hope that at least I entertained you.
4 days and 20 hours to go.
LET’S GO.
(That group hug cleansed my soul. I swear. You had to be there 😂😂😂😂).
Love y’all. Interacting with you is the best part of this journey. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
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I gotta talk to people so bad so I’m just gonna spout something that’s been on my mind for a while
I see a lot of people always describing Joel and Scott’s rivalry as one sided. Like, Joel just hates Scott and Scott doesn’t care? And while I feel like that statement is technically true, it doesn’t really describe the situation very well.
It sort of implies that Scott’s never out to get Joel, and Joel is just coming after Scott for no reason. I won’t deny that Joel does like to come after Scott without provocation sometimes, but like… we are ignoring the fact that 3/5 Joel final deaths have been at Scott’s hand?
In two seasons, those kills were a result of a deliberate hunt to get rid of Joel specifically. In Last Life, I’ll give him a bit of a pass, since Joel did kind of start the fight with a big explosion and had been the “villain” for the entire season, it makes enough sense to try to end him like that.
But in LIMITED LIFE?? As a Joel viewer I am NEVER getting over the feeling of watching his final episode (not negative, just baffling in a way I find pretty fun lol). Scott randomly says “Joel needs to die” and everyone just agrees I guess? And then Joel is being witch hunted. “Oh but it’s because he was getting so many kills! Duh!” Grian had more. Grian LITERALLY got a quad kill (ON SCOTT FOR THAT MATTER) and Scott’s like “JOEL is the problem, the murderous evil of the server”. LIKE HELLO?? They’re literally allies, Scott could’ve said “we need to get rid of the bad boys” but he was COOL with Grian. He was letting Grian LIVE. Like HELLO??? WHAT DID JOEL DO FR 😭 Joel was literally just trying to survive btw, his fighting back was very defensive rather than offensive, and would back off when not being actively attacked. With the exception of trying to get kills cuz he was on less than ten minutes, of course. But Scott had been hunting him before then.
And then I guess I have to mention Secret Life’s Scott-Killing-Joel. I don’t think that final kill was especially targeted on either of their sides, the battle just turned out that way. I could rewatch to see if there’s more to it but for now this is how I see it.
Okay, I’m turning this into a full analysis of their rivalry, idc, I’m literally obsessed with their dynamic. I’m adding a cut here.
ALRIGHT WHERE WAS I. RIGHT. Finished explaining the final deaths, but there’s stuff before that! Let’s take a look at their rivalry 🥰
Let’s go in order, shall we? 3rd Life!! I am obsessed with them in this season ahahahhaga anyways. Joel comes after Scott unprovoked. Simple, this is how everyone sees their rivalry. HOWEVER. Joel is FULLY WILLING to work with him anyways. Maybe you could excuse the dark oak thing as it was early on and they were just trying to take down a monopoly. But in the finale they reconcile and spend much of the session together. They established early on that Joel had been trying to kill Scott, but they’re both perfectly happy to team up instead (which btw they did because they both happened to be allied with Scar).
Then Last Life. Joel does hate Scott in it, but I’m not sure I would say it’s without reason. Joel being boogey in ep2 was majorly important, and he killed Scott. But that wasn’t targeted. He had attempted multiple times to kill other people. Scott was one of the only (and closest) people who didn’t already know he was boogeyman. Then of course Scott tells Pearl they can fight back and has her kill Joel, sending him to red. Perfectly reasonable for all parties imo, and a good enough reason for Joel to target Scott seeing as being red early on had a huge impact on him.
Of course LL is also where Joel says Scott just looked at him funny one day and that’s why he hates him, which is a great line. I do believe he would bother Scott just for the rivalry, but unlike in 3rd Life, Scott had done things to make Joel never consider stopping.
Then Double Life. Erm. Literally nothing, except that I believe the only reason Scott and Pearl were the last pair is because Joel wasn’t there to kill them, since apparently he’s the only one who can make them lose lives. Wild. They were guaranteed to win ever since the lava portal trap. (obviously I’m joking but like how is he the only outside force to kill that pair). I will clarify for analysis sake that Joel’s first kill on them had nothing to do with Scott, and the second kill was to Scott but it was because of the life colors, not really anything about their rivalry. It was technically targeted at Scott specifically but not cuz he hated him, instead because Pearl had a weird “alliance” with the reds.
Then Limited Life!!! What the heeelll was happening lmao. I already talked about the final moment so before that. Erm. I’m blanking out I’m listening to bad romance it’s distracting me. You know what let’s move on I can’t remember what they did, the final death I explained previously is enough data for now.
Secret Life. Oh boy. I’ll say it again, I was secretly hoping for more Scott/Joel dynamic when it started but I doubted it would happen but we got FED!!! I was so excited when I saw the assassin task (as was Joel). Anyways. Throughout the season Joel was doing the whole hating Scott thing, Scott caught onto the bit and played into it somewhat by talking more about how Joel always hates him for no reason. We SHOULD be able to disregard Joel targeting Scott for the assassin task as it was a task, but to be fair after reading it Joel said “oh my gosh is this my dream?” He was super happy to be assigned to assassinate Scott LMAO. That has to count for something.
I feel like the rivalry was fairly obvious, so I need to point out the outlier moments in SL. While Joel goes on about how Scott should die, he happily trades with him and swapped gifted hearts with zero hesitation. In the final session, he and Scott ended up on the same side. I believe Joel may have been slightly annoyed at being on a team with him but accepts it nonetheless. The only reason Scott ends up killing Joel is because their team won, so they had to turn on each other. As previously stated it wasn’t especially targeted, it was a 2v2.
And then if you noticed from me saying 3/5 games, I’m not counting Real Life, but I’ll bring it up here. Scott literally says “since it’s real life we can be friends now since we’re friends in real life” (one of the many reasons I consider RL noncanon tbh, Scott literally mentions in-universe that this season is different so they can act differently, also what is the in-universe explanation for “friends in real life”). Aside from a reminder that Joel doesn’t actually hate Scott irl and this is just fun game rp stuff, this shows that Scott really did catch onto the rivalry bit, and really does just bring it up more. Joel had just arrived when Scott brought it up. Joel agrees to being friends in Real Life. This holds little relevance to my analysis since I don’t view RL as canon but you can keep it in mind.
Now that I’ve laid out their rivalry in a simplified summary, let me ACTUALLY analyze it! What did I mean all the way back at the start of the post when I said “Scott and Joel’s rivalry being one sided is somewhat accurate but I feel it misrepresents their relationship”?
Well, I believe it’s true that (at least up until Secret Life), Scott didn’t care about the rivalry while Joel did. But that doesn’t mean Scott never targeted Joel, as I said he’s witch-hunted him twice. It’s just it was never personal to Scott. I once saw a post(s) I really enjoyed, an analysis on Scott. Saying that he doesn’t actually value being loyal, he values being fair. Then there was the addition that it’s based on what he thinks is fair. I feel like this is 100% true for his thing with Joel. Scott views Joel as a force that has to be stopped, he’s gone too far, he needs to be stopped, it’s only fair for all the suffering he’s caused. He doesn’t stop to think about how killing is the whole point of this game, how other people are doing the same things, how many times he has killed Joel. Joel hasn’t killed Scott permanently before, he has killed him though, but not as much as Scott has killed Joel. To Scott, that doesn’t matter, Scott kills Joel for a reason, for justice, while Joel kills just for the sake of it. Whether or not that idea is true is up to you to interpret for yourself, but to Scott it’s true. Joel is more of a wildfire that needs to be put out than a rival.
Let’s look at Joel’s side of things. He does hate Scott and target him for no reason. The rivalry is one sided, where Joel sees a rival Scott sees some random danger that needs to be dealt with. I can’t tell you why Joel hates Scott. It’s not really the point of my analysis. I’ve seen ppl say it’s because of previous series they’ve had together (they’ve been rivals for ages!) but for my headcanons they don’t remember those, tho very few feelings from their past lives may linger, so perhaps that does explain it. For the sake of my analysis though we won’t be looking deep into why Joel likes to poke at Scott. It’s cuz he looked at him funny one day remember?
So we establish that Joel needlessly attacks Scott. But if you’ll notice from my summaries, he is fully willing to put aside that hatred. It’s conditional (yes it is the default, but still). If Scott treats Joel kindly, Joel will attempt to reciprocate it. Let’s look at this again:
3L: Joel targets Scott, Scott kind of just gives him a disapproving look every time and doesn’t fight back. Joel ends up feeling somewhat guilty, and in the end has no problems teaming up with Scott.
LL: Scott was the main cause of Joel turning red, Joel targets him constantly. Scott ends up permanently killing Joel to put an end to his madness.
DL: erm. Well it’s worth mentioning Joel never specifically targeted Scott for no reason. ALSO WORTH MENTIONING SCOTT BURNED THE RELATION??? This season was a bit of a switch-up. I need to rewatch to see if Scott had any good reason to do that lmao I don’t really remember, I hardly remembered he was responsible.
LimL: Scott deems Joel to be a server menace who needs to die, Joel (who doesn’t really understand why he needs to die) tries negotiating many times but Scott insists. He kills Joel.
SL: Joel gets task to target Scott, is thrilled. He fails miserably, losing people he cares about in the process. Vows to kill Scott, it’s like his main goal now. Still accepts every peace offering from Scott with little to no hesitation, to the point of eventually teaming with him until they’re forced to go against each other and Scott kills Joel again.
So basically you can see, every time Scott does something to wrong Joel, Joel goes hard on the rivalry, while if he doesn’t and offers peace, Joel will lay off. Secret Life was a weird middle ground, where Scott had done things to wrong Joel, however those things weren’t entirely his fault so when he offered peace to Joel, Joel would still accept. A confusing time for Joel I’m sure.
I will say a disclaimer here, I’m not saying Scott shouldn’t ever fight back against Joel. If he’s targeting you for no reason, it’s your decision if you’ll try to befriend him to make him stop or fight back. I support fighting back. I’m just saying that befriending him is a proven method to work, but I don’t think Scott has exactly noticed that and instead just assumes that Joel will stop at nothing to end him.
Another thing I wanted to talk about but forgot what the natural and intuitive transition into it was gonna be. Scott has permakilled Joel 3 times. Joel has permakilled Scott 0 times.
Joel had started the series off picking on Scott for no reason, and has never succeeded. Scott has won this battle three times. At this point, it’s honestly finally somewhat justified for Joel to come after Scott. That guy has specifically targeted and hunted him out of 2 seasons, and took him out of a 3rd as well. Joel has taken Scott out of 0. At this point, I feel like Joel needs that closure, to finally kill Scott, and who knows if he’ll ever get it. If you look at the fandom, even fans are hoping Joel will kill Scott because of this. So imagine how Joel feels! But obviously Scott wouldn’t just let him (okay. Well. Actually. It’s Scott. He kind of lets people do that all the time. But only allies…). Scott will be waiting for Joel to target him once more, and deal with it the way he always does. But who knows if it’ll turn out different?
Which reminds me that I pinpoint SL as the season Scott finally notices this “one sided rivalry”. We all know Scott loves drama, so when he finally noticed Joel had been hating him the whole time, he kept bringing it up. And it wasn’t just for SL only, he brought it up the moment he saw Joel in RL. I don’t count RL as canon but it does prove that Scott hasn’t let go of the rivalry now that he’s finally realized it. I don’t know if there will be a 6th season, but if so I wouldn’t be surprised if Scott brings up the rivalry. Idk if he would make it a big deal, but he would surely at least mention it.
Anyways, if you think I’m done with my little analysis, you’re wrong!!! I’m done with the things I see as pretty factual, but now we’re gonna get into more fanon headcanony type of territory!!!
…but, maybe I’ll make that its own post. Stay tuned and thanks for reading!
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First thoughts from just one watch under shitty circumstances with bad internet and worse sound:
RAMBLING FRANK vs RUSSIA THOUGHTS
I was very worried about this episode with how sacred the S5 DENNIS System episode is to us all. Didn't want a Thunder Gun 4 situation on our hands and thankfully they avoided it so hard! I think having the plot with Charlie, Frank, the mums, Uncle Jack and chess really helped out to make it feel more than a direct sequel.
SINNED -> DENNIS -> SINNED -> DENNIS — I'm so impressed with this. How did I, a wholeass Sunny fan, miss this for so long?! Three cheers to whoever came up with that inversion, really! Definitely something that happened in the writer's room and made everyone lose their shit for sure. I wonder who it was, could be Meg or another writer too, given how collaborative they all are!
And can I just say, Dennis the Restaurant Manager... oh how I love you so much! The Waitress is Getting Married is a personal favourite of mine and I wasn't expecting a bit of a redux of that whole situation.
I was so worried about all the "Mac getting a boyfriend and it being Ryan Reynolds" theories and I absolutely wanted none of that. Everyone had speculated it to death and it wouldn't have been fun anymore (not to mention I do not care for RR in my Sunny, I'm sure he's fine, but I don't need his and Rob's PR relationship filtering through into my dickandball show no I don't "find them cute" and I won't elaborate here anymore).
I know we'd guessed that Johnny could've been Dennis catfishing Mac, but it definitely felt like we were doing an Insane Fan Speculation more than anything — and for it to turn out to be correct! And in the best way, because we never could've seen the vibrating anal beads coming!! That's the best kind of "called it but it's still unpredictable".
It really broke my mind, this episode did. And don't even get me started on the Macdennis and queer Dennis of it all! As a longtime believer in Bisexual Dennis, I won so hard! All of us Queer Dennis Truthers won so fucking hard!
[Unpopular Take incoming] This is the first Sunny episode credited to Meg for writing that has felt so wholly "Classic Sunny" and super fuckin hilarious to me. I always appreciated her understanding of the characters and she's always a very solid writer, but this is the first time where I felt myself thinking ok, you she write RCG/Hornsby/Marder-Rosell/Chernins-level of an insane chaotic Sunny episode with multiple belly laughs and not just slightly Community-fied versions of the gang.
The closest her writing has felt like true Sunny to me before this was Dee Day, so I'm glad to see her grow and improve too, and I wonder if the podcast rewatch has helped in that regard! Must also help to have a classic S5 structure to play off in The D.E.N.N.I.S. System! (And ofc writing is collaborative, so well done to RCG and all the writers who pitched ideas and rewrites that ended up shaping this episode!)
I knew Heath Cullens directing meant a good chance of some interesting camerawork (and I've gotta say that even The Gang Inflates had some more dynamic shots than we've been getting in some of the later years and it's got to be the Cullens directing), but I wasn't expecting a whole visual callback to Being Frank! Loved it.
And the editing! The DENNIS System has always been great for cutaway gags and fun little inserts, so I loved seeing that carried out here with the cuts to Mac and Dee fucking up their dates and then finally pulling out the Magic Tissue of Mummy Issues (oh the potential for meta especially with the twins!). The pacing was so good!
Sunny pacing needs to feel like Mac crashing Dee's car into a wall while we are all Charlie watching it in real time and screaming when it's over.
Random strings of words because I'm too excited to be coherent:
Glenn's acting. His faces. His eyes. His range in this episode. Glacting. Juilliard. All the hits. All the big ones.
Mac and Dennis have canonically had sex in two different ways now, and yes, I'm including their sex tape/porn viewing sessions where they both masturbate together
Did Dennis pull out Mac's anal beads when he was asleep?
Vibrating fucking anal beads what the ACTUAL FUCK!
How many people did the gang drug again?
Danny DeVito with a vibrating asshole comedy acting 12/10 he's an international treasure for a reason
Dee stealing people's phones she's so stupid and bad at men. Never change Dee.
Uncle Jack though, pls change plz, I'm an IASIP loving degenerate so I laughed in horror at his creepiness ofc as I have since 1x7 but fucking hell man, can he be in his jail era already! Poor Charlie!
Hey, Charlie's got new America's just as we were promised on the pod
Oh I should make a post about everything we saw in this episode and that episode of the pod where they gave us all those hints, especially Meg talking about struggling with this cold open — added to the never-ending list of drafts and posts that will hopefully one day make it onto the blog yeah I'm lying to myself now
Parental issues everywhere this season, especially with the mums. Reynolds kids, I can't wait to lovingly put you under my microscope. Once I've rewatched this episode with good sound.
Also just in general, the SINNED system just says SO much about our babygirl's psychology, does it not? Why did so much of it sound like self-insert speeches, like he's been doing this to Mac or smt? Don't even talk to me about The Gang Chokes!
What does r/iasip have to say about— no, I'm in my happy place, I'm not even gonna go there.
Mrs Mac and Mrs Kelly watching TV together like that, they really are lesbian life partners.
Dennis blue shirt with top-stick between those buttons, my beloved. I am looking, respectfully.
And can we talk about the "opening the ketchup bottle" scene? We have to take about that scene! Dennis... he's ruining me... need to gnaw on him and suck on his fingers wait I'm browning out...
Sidenote: I love whenever the show references news stories which were super fucking big at a very specific time in a very specific niche, especially with my whole family being so chess-obsessed. The cheating scandals and anal bead… never thought I'd see a Sunny crossover but can't say I'm not loving the shit out of it!
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