On the Acceptance of Unsteady Ground
Throughout this whole dive into turtle world, I've been very conscious of just how LITTLE access to information I have. I'm relying so heavily on English translations and platforms, and most of these are from turtles, so I'm fully aware I'm getting a biased perspective.
I've tried to read stuff from solos or even just neutral third-parties. The neutral parties don't have much depth of information, though, and I found solos heavy on accusations and declarations but light on actual...evidence. And they sometimes use some really nasty rhetoric against the idea that gg and dd might be gay.
Don't get me wrong, turtles get weird too. There's plenty of clearly false rumors, deceptively edited videos, silly stretches of logic, weird ideas of what how people in a relationship would act, etc. But there's at least enough English-speaking turtles that I can find some who are giving open and, as far as I can tell, accurate information (honestly, I find tumblr turtledom better at that then other platforms). I haven't really found a similar pocket of solo fans.
I'm also aware that there's always going to be a limit on how much I can know. I don't speak the language, so I'm always relying on translators. I have limited access to Weibo (even putting aside the language barrier, I'm in text confirmation limbo in actually getting an account), and I have little familiarity with the culture. I don't get a lot of the jokes or references, and stuff may strike me, an English-speaking American, differently than it would someone in China.
Add on top of that the fact that I'm trying to find out purposely obscured information about two celebrities, and, yeah, I'm fully aware that I'm on unsteady ground here. I can do my best, but I'm never going to know anything for certain.
But I've become okay with that.
It took a while. The dissatisfaction with the unknown (and unknowable) is what drove a lot of my early fixation and subsequent fall into the turtle pit. But now, especially after laying out my thoughts, I've reached a zen place with it. I'm 100% certain ggdd were together during filming/promo, and I'm 95% certain they're still together (I had this at 85% originally, but then the whole dd being sick and gg changing his schedule thing happened and I'm just...welp, guess I'm in this confidence interval, then).
Just having that certainty means I can enjoy updates from them without anguishing about "proof" or uncertainty. Oh, gg took the day off on dd's birthday? That's really sweet! I'm not gonna fuss about if it's coincidence ENOUGH to convince me, because I'm already convinced. It's a good place to be.
I typically don't care about celebrities. In fact, I've long been bewildered by celebrity culture here in the US, and I've often been actively annoyed when people assume/expect me to have opinions on things celebrities do. I'm the nerd who doesn't get why the actors get all the attention when the writer or director would be much more interesting.
So the fact that I've gone all fangirlish over two celebrities is bizarre to me, and I appreciate the irony. Well done, me. I attribute some of it to just being able to watch the bts and see their early interactions play out like a story. I find stories compelling, and both gg and dd are charismatic, attractive and have great chemistry. Whatever disdain I have for celebs, I do love a romance.
In my foray into the ggdd world, though, I've also had to learn more about c-ent, and y'all. It's nuts. Like, US entertainment is nuts too, but c-ent ratchets it up to 11. I've been in fandom a long time, and I thought I'd seen some weird stuff, but it's got nothing on c-ent. Just wrapping my head around the culture these guys are in took a lot of learning.
But I appreciate being able to dive into this culture and this country, because I knew very little about China beyond the antagonistic politics. It's been refreshing to get a view on life on the ground in China to humanize the folks there and get a clearer picture of the country.
I started this thing bc I had been spending so much time on Youtube watching clips, and I had thoughts and opinions and nowhere to put them. I already had a tumblr that I use to lurk on some fandoms and I had started following turtles too. I figured tumblr would be a decent place to splurge out my thoughts, so I set up a throwaway account to do so.
I get the vibe that a lot of new turtles come to bjyx through the same route I took? They watch The Untamed on Netflix. They get curious about the show and start watching some clips on YT. Next thing you know, they have 3 playlists full of purported "proof of love" and they need a whiteboard to connect everything together and their wife thinks they've gone completely bonkers supports them in all their oddities.
Like, I was really confused by turtles at first. I was just trying to watch bts videos on YouTube and I didn't know what bjyx meant, but the videos with the label were weird and had strange disclaimers that they were "only for turtles" and I had no clue what that even meant.
My confusion continued as I tried to read more. The fake story disclaimer convention is hella confusing as an outsider, and my first impression was that turtles were kinda crazy. The videos I saw gave overviews of candies without context, and some of them explicitly said they were proof of Yizhan love while still having that fake story disclaimer. Basically, it was a big confusing environment, and it's why I resisted buying into bjyx so hard for so long. It all seemed delulu.
But in reading more, I guess part of that is the point? Recognizing that gg and dd are in a vulnerable position should their relationship ever come out, having so much noise to muddy the waters makes a twisted, clownish sense. I don't know who came up with that convention or if it just kinda happened (is it a normal thing in c-ent? I don't know enough about celebrity fandoms), but hats off, I guess.
With the supertopic recently hitting 4 million active fans, there's something heartening about such a depth of support for the guys. I'm not naive enough to think all 4 million (plus international fans) are allies to LGBT folk in general, but it surely means something to ggdd to have that sort of support for their relationship. Honestly, it means something to me, as a random gay chick on the other side of the world, to see a gay couple get that kinda of support behind them.
I started watching the bts because I was afraid there'd be a lot of cynical homophobia on the set or some evidence of all the male cast being icked out by the whole thing. Instead, I got gg, who was so passionate about WWX being gay. I love that everybody knew they were telling a love story with as explicitly as they could get away with. I love that the guys wanted more Wangxian scenes and that the cast and crew made "everyday is everyday" jokes in a non-mocking way. I'm glad that the whole shoot seemed like such a positive environment for the cast and crew to being themselves and tell a type of story that they may not be able to be involved with ever again.
So, yes, this is my zen turtle place. When I set up a soapbox for myself, I didn't think too much about the fact that people would respond, but I'm so grateful to have had a chance to talk to some other turtles! Everybody is lovely and thank you for sharing my enthusiasm.
Like I said in the beginning, I don't have the time to keep super-active in the long-term. I had intended to write up my thoughts and poof away. But I do also plan to keep up with gg and dd and turtles, so instead I'm just gonna leave off with the potential for further posts down the line.
I'm not gonna be incredibly active, so please don't expect frequent updates or interactions from me. But if I have more Yizhan thoughts I'll pop up again with a post (I mean, I do have lots more thoughts, but nothing energizing enough to write about), or I'll leave a comment somewhere if I have something I simply must say. I'm also open to responding to asks about the timeline or anything else. And if I ever do stumble across anything groundbreaking with regards to the timeline, I'll probably add that in, because I'm particular about things being complete.
So thanks for being so welcoming! It's been a joy to clown around and make up completely fictional stories with everybody here. 🤡🐢🙇🏼
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having sally yell at baby percy feels so fundamentally wrong. i didn't mind when she got frustrated with him in the pool because that was just one instance of sally losing her temper but now it's like oh. this is just how the show version of her is.
like. idk. one of sally's defining traits was that she never got mad at percy. that didn't mean she was weak. that was her strength. that she could pull through tough times by putting a smile on her face, so that she didn't scare percy, so that she could protect him.
i just feel like it would have been a much more well-defined scene if we got to see how sally manages to talk percy out of the car by. being nice?? coaxing him??? explaining the situation in a way he would understand instead of just saying "there are things i have to do that you don't understand" (if you say that to a kid they are 100% not going to listen to you bc. yeah they don't understand!! so you have to explain it in a way they WOULD understand!!)
if sally had already been dating smelly gabe at this point, she could have leveraged this. she could have put a funny spin on it and said "i'm just trying to get you away from smelly gabe's stinky gym shorts." if she wanted baby percy to not feel like she was abandoning him and separating him from the rest of society, she could have said "the kids in there are just like you." she could have given him a keepsake, to show she will always be with him. there are SO many ways the writers could have spun this and they just didn't. they went the easy way out.
all of these flashback scenes are painting a very unfortunate picture that percy didn't actually have a good relationship with his mom. and i know that's not the vibe the show is trying to go for, but they've got to understand!! that not everyone who's watched the show has the read the books! we don't all automatically know that sally and percy have the bestest mother-son relationship ever! if you only show sally being frustrated at baby percy, we start to think oh dang, maybe this whole time percy doesn't actually have a good relationship with his mom!
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Trigun Thoughts Vol. 1 Pt. 2
So now that I've finished with volume 1, I just wanted to write down a couple thoughts I've had and neat things to point out so far
When I was watching Stampede, I took note of a few kind of textbook avoidant behaviours Vash engages in, and lo and behold, here he is in the manga displaying even more of them. I'll list out a few here.
In order, we have:
Casually asking for a time limit on the interaction (ie. "How long do I have to keep this up before I can leave?")
Attempting to lose people in a crowd
Leaving without saying anything (and as a bonus, dreading being recognized in public)
Over-indulging or over-involving oneself in social events to create a viable excuse to leave suddenly (in this case, he uses alcohol as a reason to "pass out")
Sleeping to avoid unwanted conversation
Escaping to the bathroom to get away for a bit (and also to grumble about it haha)
Playing off sincere reactions by deliberately allowing them to be misinterpreted to avoid personal questions
It's really obvious, even this early in the manga, that Vash is intentionally avoiding prolonged interaction with people, and only involving himself in situations by necessity. He doesn't like attention on himself - the only reason he intentionally draws it is to divert it away from others.
The reason for this is a bit muddy though. It does seem that Vash doesn't particularly enjoy being caught up in drama, and it is also very likely he wishes to get in and out of places as quickly as possible to avoid them getting caught up in his drama too. It may even be that he finds prolonged socializing kind of tiring; that he needs a certain amount of time to himself.
But then there's also this bit, shortly after the celebration, where he pretends to pass out.
This brings in a bit of a guilt aspect to it. It likely has to do with July, or maybe it's due to something else (at this point, we can't say), but I think it's notable that Vash cuts things off shortly before they become intimate. He can play along to make others happy and to share in their joy for a bit, but the second things get too personal or focused on him, he will quietly slip away. Now this is specifically an instance of physical intimacy, but I think it'd probably hold for emotional intimacy as well, given the continuous avoidance and misdirection he does to prevent too many questions.
I made some commentary on Stampede Vash's self-punishing behaviours - specifically, the way he denies himself food. I don't want to get too into it because I don't know if everyone reading this has seen Stampede, but food is framed as something to be shared in the show - so, denying himself food is denying himself the right to share with others, which is denying himself belonging, which is denying himself any semblance of intimacy. (It means other things too, as food-sharing is associated with Rem, but I don't want to get too into it here.)
Vash in the manga doesn't seem to have the same issues with eating, but this is a similar premise - he's denying himself intimacy out of a sense of not being deserving of it.
So, then, there are probably many interwoven reasons for Vash's avoidance - he's sick of the chaos that follows him around, he doesn't want others getting hurt, he gets tired from having to "play it up" all the time, and he seems to also feel that he doesn't deserve that closeness. I'm intrigued to see how Vash's avoidance will be tackled going forward (I'm assuming it will?), and I suspect, more than there being one right reason for it, that all these reasons are actually true to an extent.
On a completely different note, this panel here is the biggest mood. I feel it in my bones.
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Could you elaborate on what the yanli-jc wwx conspiracy is?
They are just generally in cahoots re: making sure he's safe and bringing him home, sometimes in defiance of their parents or society or just the likely fact of his death. The first time Wei Wuxian runs away Jiang Cheng wants to follow him because he's worried he'll get hurt. Jiang Fengmian says no, and when Jiang Cheng sneaks out in defiance of his father's wishes with his little rucksack in hand, Yanli is waiting at the gates to support him and tell him to bring Wei Wuxian home safe, implicitly siding with him against their dad in the matter of whether Wei Wuxian might be in real trouble and if so, whether Jiang Cheng's help might be valuable.
The second time is during the sunshot campaign while Wei Wuxian is missing- she comes in when he's brooding over Wei Wuxian's sword and tells him how grown up he is, fusses over him a bit and asks him to bring him back. Jiang Cheng fervently agrees, and looks actively relieved and pleased she's asking this of him- it's blatantly obvious he was going to do it anyway, but her support and faith mean a lot to him which I think is significant because he's usually so worried about failure and he knows Wei Wuxian has been thrown in the burial mounds and is almost certainly dead, but he's not actually frightened he'll fail her, he's just glad they're on the same page. He gets extra support this round because Lan Wangji is also refusing to believe Wei Wuxian is dead and taking joint missions to Yiling with Jiang Cheng and his own turn at sword brooding.
Breaking the pattern, in CQL she was originally going to go with him to talk to Wei Wuxian after he takes the Wens to the burial mounds but he kind of sneaks off without her when he sees her with Zixuan and then doesn't manage to bring Wei Wuxian home to her; she has a sad prophetic dream about it. The conspiracy is broken!
Until! They conspire to bring Yanli to Yiling so Wei Wuxian can see her wedding clothes. I personally think it's implied by the response to Zixuan's request for Wei Wuxian to be allowed at Jin Ling's hundred days ceremony that they were in on that together- either way they're both playing their part, because everyone from the Lan to the JIn know Jiang Cheng would happily take Wei Wuxian back and Yanli misses him. Whether they planned it or just moped really obviously is debatable buy money is on them being in on it together with Zixuan and maybe even Lan Wangji.
And then of course there's Nightless City, where Jiang Cheng notably does not try to get to Wei Wuxian but Yanli does, and then he finds him and loses him all over again so he can have a much more prolonged and less emotionally supportive round of refusing to believe Wei Wuxian is dead.
Bonus Round: The only time Yanli sends Wei Wuxian after Jiang Cheng it's when he's been captured by the Wen because he was already on top of the send Wei Wuxian home safe to Jiejie agenda.
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