#What I wanted to say it's that the jc is presented to us - the mean ungrateful man- is very different from the real jc -
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What a plot twist you were. [x]
#Like. The narrator introduces jc to us as the antagonist#Then we got to know him. Not who people think he's. But who he really is#And we saw jc giving wwx a piggyback. Giving him soup. Rescuing him. Putting himself between wwx and any danger (madam yu/wen soldiers)#And even the staged fight. It's yk. Staged#jc wanted to protect wwx at any cost. But wwx wasn't willing to compromise. But jc did#The fight was wwx's idea. Because jc is an enabler (just like jfm and jyl)#jc is ready to bend for his loved ones sake#The point is. Every action jc takes. Is in the name of his loves ones' safety. And surprise. wwx is one of the people jc really cares about#Even after wwx' return. Aside a broken cup. jc isn't doing much to stop wwx or anything. We know that jl was able to free wwx from Zidian#only because jc - Zidian's primary master- wanted it!#And jc fling himself into danger countless times to save wwx even though wwx can't sit still with him for a hot minute#What I wanted to say it's that the jc is presented to us - the mean ungrateful man- is very different from the real jc -#the indulgent uncle who rolls his eyes at his nephew antics. the brother who buries the hatchet for his sister's happiness.#the uncle who kinda wants to help wn to get up from the floor because he was an ass to jc but he helped jl and that's what matters to jc#the sect leader who let two women speak freely their mind in a patriarchy society#People better than me have already said this. shit I can't remember my point lmao#Like. jc is presented as an antagonist but what this man wanted was an apology and an explanation#This post is a mix of a rant I wrote last year (ha) after seeing a bad take. About what I don't remember lmaoo. And me wanting#to make gifs of wzc in this scene. Why does he look so good. It should be illegal. Seriously#jiang cheng#*mgifs
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Did jc kill wwx with his own two hands? No. Is he responsible? Yes, heavily
Was him not personally exploiting the path into the burial mounds during the siege not enough then to mean Jiang Cheng had a hand in leading Wei Wuxian to his death? And does this also somehow not stand that Wen Ning, the man whose family was killed by that exploitation personally, sees Jiang Cheng as the one reason for his family was killed?
The word you use is "responsible", let's focus on that word. Since we have one person in plot who admits to the deaths he caused. Wei Wuxian admits to his part of the killings in war, he admits to himself, Wen Qing and Wen Ning being the cause of using Wen Ning to having killed Jin Zixuan with hefty amounts of regret (despite all circumstance leading to that), and to having justifiably killed the cultivators that set an attack on the Burial Mounds.
Yi Weichun, the middle aged cultivator who proclaimed to have had his leg cut off by him and had to wear a wooden prosthetic from then on, spoke up once more, “The debts of blood you owe to three thousand people will never be repaid, not even if you die over a million deaths!"
Wei Wuxian interrupted him, “Three thousand people? There were indeed three thousand cultivators present at Nightless City, but so too were the leaders, the sects and many of their best. With all of them present, could I have really killed all three thousand people? You are either thinking too highly of me, or are you looking down on them?”
He was only trying to reason fact, but the other cultivator felt as if he was being scorned, and became enraged.
"What do you think we’re talking about here? How could there be bargaining for debts of blood?”
“It’s not that I want to bargain over such a thing, but I would prefer my crimes to not to be exaggerated just because of the words of others. I won’t carry the burdens of what I didn’t do.”
Someone spoke, “What you didn’t do? What is there that you didn’t do?”
“Well, for example, I’m not the one who tore Chifeng-Zun apart. I’m not the one who forced Madam Jin to take her own life at Jinlintai. I’m also not the one who controls all of those corpses you ran into when you rushed up the mountain.”
The cultivators present are a blatant and literal metaphor for Jiang Cheng's own unreasonable grudges for how he blamed Wei Wuxian for all of the tragedies he was met with or, how he used Wei Wuxian as his scapegoat to justify his own lack of loyalty and trust to Wei Wuxian.
On the other hand, Jiang Cheng refused to give up, shouting, “Wei Wuxian, who was the one who broke his promise and betrayed the Jiang Sect first? Tell me. That I’d be the sect leader and you’d be my subordinate, that you’d help me your whole life, that so long as the Gusu Lan Clan had its Twin Jades, the Yunmeng Jiang Clan would have its Two Prides, that you’d never betray me or betray the Jiang Clan—who was the one that said that?! I’m asking you—who was the one that said all of that?! Did just you eat all your fucking words?!”
He got more agitated as he ranted on, “And in the end? You go and protect outsiders, haha! The Wen Sect’s people, even. How much of their rice did you eat?! Defecting with such resolution! What did you take our sect to be?! You did all the best things, yet every time you do the worst ones, it’s involuntary! Forced! With some unspeakable grievances! Grievances?! You told me nothing, you played me for a fool!!!
“Just how much do you owe the Jiang Clan!? Am I not supposed to hate you? Can I not hate you?! Why is it that now it’s like I’m supposed to have wronged you?! Why do I have to feel like I’m a fucking clown all these years?! What am I? Do I deserve to be blinded by all your dazzling splendor?! Am I not supposed to hate you?!”
Even blatant foreshadowing and callbacks, are sadly ignored to say, yes, Jiang Cheng is right to hate and still use his excuses to hate Wei Wuxian no matter the real reasons. Ironic, isn't it?
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Religion in Relation to Jesus Christ Superstar
(CW: Religious trauma, slight stream-of-consciousness, imposter syndrome)
It's no secret now that I love Jesus Christ Superstar. The music, the way the story is presented, the history of the musical, and the talented actors are what drew me to it and kept me interested. Hell, it even made me download TUMBLR just so I could interact with others who enjoy the show (which is lovely, you're all lovely and I'm having such a good time).
Sometimes when I'm doing my wholely unnecessary research on JCS, I find a bad review from a devout Christian, claiming it to be blasphemy of the highest degree. This doesn't particularly bother me, as I am no longer a religious person, and I can easily brush these reviews off as extremists finding things to complain about.
I've found myself researching the book the rock opera was based on. You know the one. It's a fascinating story; I don't think many people disagree with that regardless of what religion they align themselves with. However, as with most things on the internet, it's hard to find information that is unbiased (unless I choose to read the full Bible, which I'm not interested in doing at the moment). I see how passionate these people are about their faith, and how many use that as an excuse to belittle and isolate others. This is something I've always been aware of, and it's something that's affected me personally.
When I come across these kinds of things online, I start to feel a pit of anxiety growing in my chest. I respect anyone of any religion so long as they do not use it as a means to harm others (physically, mentally, psychologically - in any way). But when I am presented with a Christian explaining why everything I believe in and stand for is inherently wrong, I begin to feel as if I'm still a young girl being berated for going against the Lord. To make matters worse, I am queer, though I am well aware that any accusations that this is a shortcoming are without truth.
Part of what drew me into JCS is what I and some others believe to be queer undertones. The intense relationship between Judas and Jesus is captivating to me, and I find it healing to examine the story of Christ this way. I had been avoidant of all Christian-related media for such a long time after I decided to detach myself from the religion. Any mention of it brought back years of shame and fear that, in my opinion, do not align with the morals the Bible depicts. If that is not what I am meant to feel when presented with the power of the Christ, then why should I subject myself to it? But when I found this musical, I was so intrigued that my inhibitions became insignificant. I only notice now how unprepared I was for the feelings that arose within me when re-introduced to my experience with religion.
I think the main issue comes with Christians believing they are entitled to the words and story of the Bible. Against my better judgment, and due to my past, I feel sometimes as if I'm intruding on an aspect of human culture that was not meant for me. In reality, I recognize that all I'm really doing is enjoying a story that I relate to and that inspires me to create and live my life as I want to live it. My learned instinct is to feel repentant when any person says I am wrong, especially when it comes to my experience as a queer woman. I read the relationship between Jesus and Judas in JCS as romantic. I have seldom seen such an intense portrayal of homosexually-charged angst, even if that is not how it was meant to be read. And I relate to it. And it heals a part of me. And I may be reading way too far into this, but I'm already devoting so much of my time to this property, so I may as well get something useful out of it.
I wonder if any other fans of JCS have felt this way. Like we are not allowed to enjoy something simply because it is not a story that is meant to be heard as we are hearing it.
My mother wonders why I haven't since converted back to Christianity after watching Jesus Christ Superstar. But this is the furthest from Christianity I have ever felt. And it the most at peace with Christianty I have ever felt.
#jesus christ superstar#jesus christ superstar 1973#religion#religious trauma#stream-of-consciousness#imposter syndrome#rant#relatability#queer community#lgbtq#jesus x judas#agnostic
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This is a text my dad sent me. I have several thoughts.
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This is the first time he's told me that JC was gay. I knew this but was told a few years ago by my cousins. I met JC several times, he was very friendly, well liked, and played organ for the little congregation my grandparents attended.
One time we drove to his home, but my parents didn't allow us children out of the car, and JC came to the front door but kept it shut behind him so we wouldn't accidentally see his partner. I never saw JC bring his partner to family gatherings or even to church to hear him play the organ, isn't that sad?
Interestingly, in response to someone questioning if JC should be the branch organist, I heard my very Southern conservative grandma say, "What people do in their bedrooms is their business and no one else's." That stuck with me because that's definitely not the LDS way. I was a teenager at the time and having a bishop ask me about masturbation was something that happened a few times a year. My grandma was right, it was none of his business.
What a great thing it would've been if me and my gay cousin had known the truth about JC and able to talk with him about this and understood his life. Instead he had to hide in plain sight.
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I have never spoken with my dad about a desire to have children, and several years ago I put that dream to bed, so for him to randomly bring it up is surprising.
I suppose this is an evolution in his thinking. He recognizes the unfairness of LDS teachings when applied to gay people and has developed this work around. While this seems hopeful and wonderful to him, it's problematic to me.
First of all, why are these children orphans? What traumatic thing happened to their own parents?
Secondly, current LDS practice is children can only be sealed to parents, a husband & a wife. At present, a single parent cannot be sealed to their child. Does he mean I'll also be married to a woman? In other words, he believes I won't be gay?
Third, why do I need to wait to the Millennium? Couldn't I adopt some orphans now? Isn't there a need now for them to be loved and raised?
Fourth, do I have a choice in this arrangement? What about the orphaned children, do they choose who becomes their new family? Or is this type of family arrangement required for all of us?
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When people say that I'll magically be given a family after death, or that I'll be transformed to not be gay in heaven, that feels like the person is absolving themselves of any need to do anything.
There's no reason to make things better in this mortal life because things will be fixed after death. It's not necessary to wrestle with a theology that excludes queer people because queer people will not exist in heaven. It's an easy out for themselves that allows them to ignore the uncomfortable truths. And importantly, these types of comments don't provide comfort to me, the actual queer person who will be impacted by those beliefs.
Being gay is an important part of how I experience life and understand myself. My gender identity also is important for the same reasons. Stripping me of those characteristics would make me someone else, not me. By saying I won't be queer in heaven, it feels like saying they wish I wasn't queer at all, that there's something wrong about it, and they wish they didn't know me but some non-existing version of me. It would be more convenient for them if I wasn't me.
Please love me for me. Please want me to have happiness and joy in this life.
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💥👓💛👻
😍 Specs!! Hi!! I see you with these questions 🕵️♂️
From this Ask Game: Here
💥 What is one canon thing that you wish you could change?
(MDZS) YOU KNOW ME!!! But instead of the super obvious answer about the romantic subplot or whatever, I gotta say like, I really don't think JYL had to literally die for WWX's man-pain. Would the Present Timeline story be drastically different? Yeah, but I think it would have been better. I think it would have forced WWX to confront and resolve his past in more satisfying ways even if MXTX still makes him break off everything with JC-JYL-YMJ. Hottake, but I think it's spicier if he keeps trying to leave everything in the past but his mistakes are still alive and would like a real apology. With JC there's the whole transfer thing, mucking up who might need to apologize to whom, but with JYL it's very clear and very devastating. Where is all the angst this story could have given me??
No, I'm not going to rewrite MDZS about it 😩 I'm just going to suffer in my Yunmeng Trio feels.
👓 What helps you focus when you write?
You're going to use this against me, I know it. I'm gonna be like, "Specs I can't focus." And you're going to go, "Well YOU said this helps you focus so are you doing it???" And I'll be like... "🥺"
Not to be all aging-Millennial on main or anything but a shot of hard liquor, wordless music, a clear idea of a scene, and someone waiting to read what I wrote. It's a hard combo to achieve, let's be real. I have written 5k at a time with that combo though, so it's a big winner. @robinade knows nothing motivates me more than someone on discord going 👐🙏. And then I feed them the snippet and then they grade me with emotes. I'm very rewards based, who isn't? They tell you to write for yourself first, but it's always nice if I have an end goal of entertaining someone else as well, otherwise the ideas just stay in my head la-di-da style.
💛 What is the most impactful lesson you’ve learned about writing?
I got nothing inspirational to say here. I think a game changer for me was doing this thing with "scenes" but like... as a roadmap. So what I do now that helps me figure out what to write is listing off all the scenes I want to write and a little blurb about those scenes (or a lot of blurb depending on how specific I have it in my mind). It's like an outline, but not very high level. Anyone that reads my stuff lately can see I label my scenes with section titles and that's from this process. It sort of fills in the for the writing advice about how, when you get to the end of one scene, make sure to write the first sentence of the next so you don't get stuck on how to start a scene when you get back to it. This format is really working for me and it's not as cumbersome as an outline (even though for big fics I have those too).
👻 What is your wildest headcanon?
HOOOO it's really hard to have a "wild" headcanon in this fandom (MDZS) without someone taking the biggest offense to it. And honestly the word "wild" is doing a lot of work here, it can mean anything.
So basically I have a lot headcanons but what's wild enough for this question???
BAM!! JGS uses women as human cauldrons to further his cultivation. And JGY used that knowledge to kill him.
🧡 😎 Alrighty, I think my work here is done. 🌹 🎩
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2:30 series - echo || part 4
Summary: One too sure, the other not that much. One focused on the present, the other too stuck on the past and afraid of the future. Both of them in love with each other.
Recommended song: Bones by JC Stewart
A/N: hmm :) feedback is always appreciated! feel free to reblog, comment or send me an ask at anytime 😊
“All we are are ghosts
Shadows at the most
Our fingertips, our holding on
To something that we know is gone
And though we are old friends
And drive around the same old bends
We've got our whole lives left
So don't leave your words unsaid “
Jungkook tried to get home as soon as possible after his call, saying goodbye quickly to the members and getting in the car. The last time you texted him like that was the day you broke up, so no, he wasn't confident. You were in a hurry too, rushing out of Mrs. Sunny to Jungkook's house. Jungkook arrived just before you and was waiting for you at the door, sitting down. It was impossible not to check the time every minute. You said you wouldn't be long, so where have you been?
You parked quickly, wasting no time checking that the car was level with the sidewalk. You were in a hurry. Without wasting any more time picking up your phone or your bag, you ran towards Jungkook's house and could see him sitting there, checking his phone for the 17th time. You could barely contain your smile as he sat there, totally oblivious to how handsome and kind and the best man you'll ever know he is. Jungkook sees you running and stands up, not bothering to let the phone fall out of his hand and break the screen. The phone was replaceable. You weren't.
You ran until you were right in front of him, and put your hands on your knees, trying to catch your breath.
"Y-you wanted to talk to me?", Jungkook asked, unsure. "What happened?"
"Yeah.", you breathed deeply, tired from all the running. "I really wanted to see you, Kook, 'cause I have to say something",you signal for him to wait a second while you correct your posture as best you can. "You make me happy, Jungkook. And I want to tell you that I love you and that you're the best person I have ever met, and I don't say that only because I love you, but because you're generous, funny, compassionate, focused, a hard worker, not to say you're cute and hot at the same time", you couldn't stop the words leaving your mouth, and you were in too much hurry to make a pause to breathe. "And I also need to tell you that you didn't pressure me when we were together. I was the one who was too afraid to screw things up to let myself be happy, and now must be too late, but you're alive, and I'm alive, so I can still talk, and I can still say that I love you and how much you mean to me, even if we don't get together ever again. I'm happy someone like you exists in this earth, Kook, and I won't be too heartbroken if you find someone else because you deserve to be happy. The happiest. Whether I’m a part of your life or not.", you took a quick break to catch your breath. "So yeah, thank you for everything, thank you for loving me, and thank you for our moments together. I'm sorry for saying it too late.", you tried to decipher the expression on Jungkook's face, but it was impossible. He was.. serious? Astonished? Happy? Nauseous? You couldn't decipher it.
"I miss you, Kook. I miss going out with you late at night, I miss the way you looked at me, I miss waking up at 2:30 and feel your arms around me, I miss your smile and your laugh… I miss the way you used to look at me. I miss you loving me.", you took a deep breath, trying to catch your breath again.
Jungkook was shocked, to say the least. You never say that many words in so little time. You were never so forward with what you felt. But even now, he still felt like something wasn't adding up. You loved him and thought he was a great guy, and you missed him. So what? Why did you keep pushing him away?
That alone wasn't enough, even if he loved you to and from the moon. He couldn't love for two. What if you changed your mind? What if, in the end, none of this worked out because the love he has for you is too selfish and that's why he keeps insisting? Could it be that at the end of it all, the love he has for you wasn't enough to make you want to stay? You watched Jungkook's face fall as he reached down to pick up the phone he had dropped. He wiped the phone gently, avoiding looking you in the eye. "I don't want to get my hopes up, thinking that we'll ever be together again, YN...", he says almost in a whisper. All Jungkook wanted is run and hug you, but he didn't. He couldn't keep doing that with his heart or with yours.
"Oh...", you nodded, looking at your feet. "I understand. Makes sense."
"Yeah." he said back, his eyes filled with tears. "Let me say just one last thing: you know I loved you. I still do. We're just too hurt to be together right now. And I know you felt guilty for not talking to me and running, and I wanna tell you that none of that ever stopped me from loving you. I didn't love you in spite of your running, I loved you entirely. It didn't matter to me in the end. None of that mattered to me."Jungkook's lips started to tremble. "You hear me? None of it mattered, when all I saw was you." he paused, wiping a tear furiously. "Nothing mattered to me but you, babe."
You had never understood the expression "having your heart broken" until that moment. There, right in front of you, was the man you love most in the world, and for some reason, you're not going to be together. There will be no happy ending. Not with you. Not for you. You start to cry and Jungkook squeezes the phone until his fingers turn white, holding back from hugging you.
"We have to face the truth that love it’s not enough anymore, babe. There are times when no matter how much we love someone, we have to move on. I didn't believe that… I thought we would be the exception, but we weren't, so this is me telling you that is not your fault. I've fallen in love with you, but just like you said: there is no future for us, right? ", Jungkook lies. He lies because he could see your future beside him clear as day, but it had no point if you didn't. If you didn't trust him. There was no point if you didn't want it too. "But I'm glad we met. I'm glad I got to love you.You are the woman of my life, YN. I don't think I can love anyone else but you. Never", Jungkook lets out a cry and covers his face to stop you from seeing him cry. He never did that. Not until today.
You nod, drying your tears, unable to look him in his eyes "It's okay.... thank you.", you said finally. "Thank you for loving me, Kook."
“Down to our bones
I think we both know
I know we're counting the cost
It's better to have lost
Than never have loved at all “
art by gyung studio - not mine
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Something about Vecna's Left Hand 🤔
This post centers around the patterns of handedness in the NINA sequence and Creel flashbacks as it relates to Henward's bloodstains.
Honest to God, though, I'm trying my damnedest to find a good way to organize all the pictures I've annotated about this guy. I decided it was best to just go by jumpsuit, so I'm using Em's current naming system (JA-JE) for cohesion between sources.
I also decided to try to narrow the main shots down to ones that include hand use, since that's what I really care about in this post (even though some others will be included for speculation purposes). I'm not diving into injuries or bodies, even if there are annotations about those topics, because those aren't super applicable in regard to this analysis.
Also, Em just posted his big jumpsuit bloodstain comparison analysis:
HERE!!!
You can find all the details about this stuff on that post.
Here are the background posts for this analysis:
Changing Vecnas
Comparison Of MF And Vecna Suits
Comparison Of Vecna/MF Suits To The 5 Known Massacre Suits
Lefty and Righty vs Henry Creel
First, a TL;DR recap:
Righty (Henry):
Righty (Suspected Henry):
Lefty (Suspected Edward):
Good? Okay, let's get started.
JA.
He's not the Vecna we see in the transformation sequence from 4.07, nor is he the one we see in the Mindflayer shaping sequence.
He's a lefty, though:
JA is associated with El's initial eye blood pattern:
But not with her second eye blood pattern:
He also seems to be the gauntest of our Henwards, especially in comparison to JC:
Which...lots to think about there, considering this:
I won't rule out the possibility of him being a Vecna, of course. He's just not the thicker one we're shown concretely by the transformation sequence in 4.07.
Anyway. Moving on.
JC.
This is our guy. This is the jumpsuit that we're told goes with our main Vecna via the transformation sequence in 4.07.
He's a lefty.
JC is also the only bloody Henward we see doing hands-free moves, interestingly enough.
His Jumpsuit matches Vec-Ward's, as seen here:
JD.
JD's only appearance is at the very end. He does not appear before El slams him through the mirror.
He isn't shown using his hands, but his jumpsuit matches the guy who shaped the Mindflayer (as seen here):
Which means we can say he is also a lefty:
JD is associated only with El's second eye blood pattern:
A Quick Recap:
JA, JC, and JD are all lefties. We have seen no right-handed Massacre-Henwards so far.
The only bloody Henward I have questions about is JE, and that is solely because his sequence is shot through a mirror, presenting a lefty as a righty.
He's holding her chin in his left hand, but the camera choice presents it as his right hand. I can't, of course, rule anything out (especially given all the "mirror/holding up a mirror" stuff with him).
At the end of the day...it is meant to be recognized as his left hand, otherwise they wouldn't show us the mirror at all. They would just cut to him using his right hand normally. So, unless I have reason to think otherwise, I'm assigning him working-lefty.
I also can't concretely assign the bloodless JB suit.
This is because his only move is the hands-free one that we see JC do in the previous shot:
For now, though, I'm also assigning him working-lefty. This is based on the direction of his head tilt, which is the same as our other known lefty:
In conclusion:
Concrete Lefties: 3
Working-Lefties: 2
Concrete Righties: 0
I won't say that we don't have Henries in this sequence, because of course I can't say that. If he is shown on screen, though...he's either JB or JE, one of our two inconclusive lefties.
However: As it stands, we do not have any concrete righties, which would be an indisputable indicator of Henry's status as a mass murderer. If they wanted it to be indisputable, they would have made it that way.
#Production Error Truthers: DNI#i won't entirely rule henry out as a participant in the massacre...but it's NOT looking likely...ykwim?#ESPECIALLY with that no-cracks sequence with baby el...#anyway#henry creel#henry/vecna/001#edward creel#edward/vecna/001#timeline theory#st bloodstain analysis#st nina project#stranger things
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I’ve seen huge numbers of people in fandom who are Lan fans present the idea that Wangxian winding up in Cloud Recesses post-canon is their ideal ending: the ideal ending that MXTX intended. Any dissenting opinions about how Wangxian are treated in Cloud Recesses or the Lans’ past crimes is ignored, and how dare we disagree with Wangxian’s decision or MXTX’s master plan for the novel.
One thing that strikes me about this is that it’s very aggressive towards literary criticism. We can have differing opinions on the novel and interpret the ending in our own ways! On top of that, I’m not even criticising MXTX as an author or her plan for the novel or anything like that...I just have a differing interpretation of what the meaning behind the tensions in Cloud Recesses post-canon is.
I don’t think it’s necessarily meant to be a perfect, uncomplicated happy ending. MDZS doesn’t have those. The sects who committed atrocities are still in power, and WWX has only been replaced with a new scapegoat for the sects to vilify. It’s a very realistic ending, and I also think it should be viewed through the lens of it being a novel written in mainland China, where any stories about wide structural changes or revolution run the risk of being accused of sedition, and where real life structural change probably feels like a pipe dream; all you can do is live your life as best you can following your own principles, as Wangxian do, not change society.
I also think that the lack of real acceptance WWX deals with from the Lans, with LQR encouraging the sect to shun him and he and LXC both seeming to only tolerate him because they know LWJ will choose him if push comes to shove, has a purpose. It’s very reminiscent of how many real gay couples who are accepted by their families are only nominally accepted by them. LQR acknowledges the marriage tacitly by allowing WWX to attend the sect banquet as LWJ’s cultivation partner, but also discourages members of the sect from interacting with WWX (the juniors already have been informed that if they speak with him they will be punished, and so speak with him in private where they won’t be seen). On top of that, the banquet also shows us that many of the other members of the sect, and the elders, disapprove of WWX; WWX takes note of their harsh looks and then ignores them, but he still notices that he is not welcome. LXC never interacts with WWX post-canon, and we never hear about them doing so second-hand, either. LWJ is allowed to have his cultivation partner, these gestures say, but he is not a real member of the family and we will seek to mitigate this disaster as much as we possibly can, since he’s left us with no other choice.
I don’t want Wangxian to be unhappy post-canon or to make extra drama for them; I just see that there are issues with how they are treated by the Lans and want to address and explore them!
The fact that WWX is used to being shunned and treated badly by society, and by the family he lives with in particular, does not make it somehow better! So the way he was treated in Yunmeng Jiang was wrong but not Gusu Lan? It’s a clear bias present in large swathes of fandom.
It doesn’t feel like there’s any room in this fandom for having differing opinions or interpretations of the text. Different corners of fandom have different accepted narratives and if you don’t follow them then you’re out. This doesn’t happen in just one corner of fandom, everyone gets in on it. JC fans, LXC and LQR fans, JGY fans, XY fans...they all have really strict ideas you can’t deviate from. It makes the whole fandom feel really unwelcoming, because any discussion seems to inevitably turn nasty, and I’m left not wanting to engage directly with other people’s posts because I know that disagreeing with them will just lead to us arguing in circles and not actually finding middle ground or having a reasonable discussion.
#mdzs#mdzs fandom#gusu lan#wangxian#a bit more lan salt#sorry but i've been holding it in for a year and it's time to just toss out the whole saltshaker
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I just want to say how much I love your takes on JGY, and other vilified characters. As well as characters put on a pedestal. The depth and nuance of the text, as well as CQL’s adaptation, give us so much to love about these characters. Especially the ones who *struggle*. Anyway, thanks again. Through subsequent watches, I have grown to love JGY, XY, and JC so much, your interesting analyses being no small part of my conversion to JGY-stan. 💕
waaaahhh thank you so much for sending me such a kind message 🥹 it really does mean a lot to me to know that i have helped even one person recognize just how much complexity and depth characters like jgy and sms really do have.
i’ve always been drawn towards ‘bad guy’ characters in books and film and games, even from a very young age, and as i’ve grown older i think i’ve finally figured out why that is. and it isn’t just because they get the coolest outfits or musical numbers (lookin’ at you, scar from the lion king), but because what we choose to code as bad or villainous often reveals so much more about what it really means to be considered ‘good’ or ‘heroic.’ oftentimes the mirror that so-called villainy holds up to so-called heroism presents us with uncomfortable realities about ourselves, and the place we occupy in the world, whether that was the intent of the author or not.
with a character like jgy, i’m not exaggerating when i say that each time i revisit his sections of the novel or the drama, i notice new things—about him, about how he parallels other characters, and how his actions and choices impact the world that holds the story. he’s just one of those characters who always rewards readers who take the time to closely read and pay attention to his arc, and i love that, and i love sharing in that experience with other people so much.
anyway 🥹 thank you!! thank you.
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I always find it amusing how some people seem to be earnestly shocked by how not every viewer falls in love with Ava from the get go or how some don't really like her at all.
Disliking a main character is not a moral flaw, nor is it a novelty in the history of humans reacting to stories. There are no rules pertaining to how an audience must be fond of a protagonist. Different people like different things, as the saying goes, and, regardless of whether the title of the show is "goofy" or not (it was Forbes' Paul Tassi that deemed it so, if memory serves right), some of us were reeled in by it and expected what it says on the tin rather than following a reluctant hero for a handful of episodes while she avoids precisely that same narrative we might have initially signed up for.
It's both a matter of expectations and values; I've said somewhere before that JC's gang is unbearable to me also because I find no common ground with characters who embody a lifestyle I have seen up close and strongly rejected. They remind me of people I loathed and who certainly loathed me back. Subjective? Entirely, even though I also object to them as characters given how mind-numbingly dull and superficial they appear to me, as they are presented in the show (flat characters instead of round, if you want to E.M. Forster it, but so flat, so thin, that they might be ripped apart any moment). JC's speech on institutions is all pretty and commendable, but it sounds empty when the big middle finger he and his companions are giving to a higher social class is... The remarkable "cause" of crashing at their places so kids can get high on drugs in raves around Europe, apparently. His professed idealism doesn't really go beyond words -- and it's hard to sympathise with that.
Of course anyone could say the OCS also boasts of void discourses, ultimately meaningless words that deform reality, obscure it, manipulate it (the halo bearer, the gift, worth, God, grace, faith...) and they would be justified in their protestation seeing as the church's words are proven to be hollow as the story progresses. I won't argue with you there.
Yet this is thematically relevant considering the show's title. That is what I had hoped to see when I first hit play on the initial episode some time in 2021 (I'm neither of the "original" fans who watched WN as soon as it came out nor of the post-s2 crowd). So when Ava momentarily chooses that other lot, that other nucleus over this one, it almost led me to choose another show (and I have friends who did, despite my guarantees that it would pick up the pace quickly enough).
Now, none of this is meant to point fingers or judge people who loved Ava from the start or even those who might have a soft spot for JC's gang. The only thing this little text aims to accomplish is to explain how we all watch the same thing but wearing different pairs of lenses -- and that is a quality rather than a disadvantage. It means Warrior Nun can speak to all sorts of different people with different interests, values and sympathies, and it once more demonstrates how foolish Netflix's decision to cancel a show with so much potential reach was.
And, if you must know, I came round on Ava later on thanks to the powerhouse that is Alba Baptista's portrayal of her, allied with the clever writing I was treated to in season two.
If the power to change a viewer's opinion and feelings over a character she had disliked doesn't speak to the sheer talent of the people involved in a project, on and off-screen, I really do not know what else could serve as a higher compliment to everyone that brought it to life.
#do i want to tag this?#silly blabbering#oh and this isn't a reply to anyone in particular. i wrote this in my physical journal weeks ago and thought i'd type it out#maybe other people feel it resonates with them#oh well here goes nothing. i'm not being unreasonable i don't think. so i don't expect unreasonable responses#warrior nun#before you go telling me that forster sees the use in flat characters well so do i#but i'll quote him: a serious or tragic flat character is apt to be a bore#wasn't it mary who said a sob story would only take you so far...? well then.#and to be fair my issue with s1 isn't pacing. i love obscure european cinema and silences and all of that#whatever critique i have really has to do with the time spent on uninteresting characters#it's not about how ava runs away but /to whom/. her running off to jillian so as to be “scienced” is pretty damn cool#meta fandom talk i guess
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Recently had a dream where I basically rewrote the part in Year 2 when MC had to go into Gryffindor Tower to search for clues about Ben but instead I literally made up ways for MC to enter based on their Houses.
The door portrait was Sir Cadogan and the non-Gryffindor MC has to convince him to let them in and the way to do it is by leaning on their House's strengths.
I can't remember what Ravenclaw and Hufflepuff MCs said but I play as Slytherin so I remember them clearly.
Slytherin!MC says because Ben is "theirs" and Slytherins take care of their people, they want to contribute to the search for him by also looking for clues: more eyes are better, right? MC is Ben's friend so they can know what the others might not. Sir Cadogan finds it "chivalrous" so he lets them in.
When Angelica comes with McGonagall, MC repeats what they said: Ben is their friend, he is "their people" so it's only natural MC would want to help, and they can provide an insight McGonagall might not have as Ben's friend and peer. Besides, Sir Cadogan let them in, and he supervised them too, so that should be alright, shouldn't it be, Madame?
McGonagall lets them off the hook with a slap on the wrist because of extraordinary circumstances and their "noble" intentions, but warns MC that next time, she won't be so understanding.
When I woke up, I felt like I saw into a universe where HPHM was actually good.
To be fair, back I Year 2, HPHM was good. Don’t get me wrong, the whole using-Reducio-to-get-to-the-other-Common-Room plan was a bit silly, but also… it kinda worked. I think the point is that it was silly, and not stupid. I don’t know, I feel there’s a difference, and HPHM used to be pretty good at handling some silliness.
Anyway, I do like your idea, honestly. However, it doesn’t quite work for the things I like about how this plotline was dealt with in the game. And that is the fact that Gryffindors and Hufflepuffs break into the Slytherin Common Room while Slytherins and Ravenclaws into the Gryffindor Common Room. I think it works really well because 1) everyone has a chance to break in somewhere (what would happen with Gryffindors in your idea?), 2) it’s really interesting to think about it from the story's point of view. Like, why there even was another Black Quill in the Slytherin Common room? Why was it implied that Snape was aware of R back in Y2 already, if he’s the one who catches MC? Sure, JC ignored all of that in the end, but it doesn’t mean I’d want to lose it.
Also, the idea of Slytherin loyalty towards Ben is actually kind of present in the game already. If I recall correctly, MC uses very similar arguments when confronted with McGonagall, and even earlier in Y2. Admittedly, it’s not exactly addressed as a Slytherin trait. And I see why you’d like to make it exclusively. But personally, I quite like it’s a default/available-to-everyone option. It shows that MC could indeed belong in any House, no matter where they go officially.
Again, I don’t want to sound dismissive. Your idea is not bad at all. But I guess I just don’t see much need for fixing in this particular case, to begin with. Of course, it could work really well for your own story.
(Also, I’m aware my reply is super late. I’m very sorry. Hope you see it)
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Novel quotes: wei wuxian having feelings/thoughts about jiang cheng
Under the cut because it's long
However, Jiang Cheng was gone.
Holding steamed buns, flatbreads, and fruits in his hands, Wei WuXian felt his heart skip a beat. He forced himself to calm down. Even after he searched through the neighboring streets, he still didn’t see Jiang Cheng. He finally began to panic. Grabbing a cobbler on the side, he asked, “Mister, there was a young master about the same age as me sitting here. Did you see where he went?”
The cobbler licked the thick end of a thread, “The one that was with you?”
Wei WuXian, “Yeah!”
The cobbler, “I was in the middle of doing something so I didn’t really see. But he kept on spacing out, staring at the people on the street. And then when I looked up at where he was again, he suddenly disappeared. Maybe he left.”
Wei WuXian murmured, “... He left... He left...”
He probably left for Lotus Pier to steal the bodies!
As though he had gone mad, Wei WuXian sprinted immediately toward the direction that they had come from.
[...]
He gave himself a harsh scolding in silence—he was stupid, useless, ridiculous, it was bizarre, unimaginable. Yet, he was alone, without a sword or any tools, and on the other side of the wall there were thousands of Wen Sect’s cultivators, perhaps Wen ZhuLie as well.
He wasn’t scared of death. He was only scared that after he died, he wouldn’t be able to save Jiang Cheng and betray the trust that Jiang FengMian and Madam Yu left him. In such circumstances, the only one he could place his hope on was a person of the Wen Sect whom he had met only three times in total!
[...]
Wei WuXian’s gaze turned from Wen Ning toward Jiang Cheng, whose body was covered in blood and eyes were tightly shut. His fingers couldn’t help but clenched into fists.
Chapter 59 Poisons—Part Four
Jiang Cheng’s expression was rather strange. It was calm, almost too calm.
He stared at the ceiling, as though he wasn’t at all interested in the situation that he was in, as though he didn’t care about where he was either.
Wei WuXian didn’t expect him to react in such a way. Sadness, happiness, anger, shock—he had none of these. His heart skipped a beat, “Jiang Cheng, can you see me? Can you hear me? Do you know who I am?”
Jiang Cheng glanced at him. He didn’t say anything. Wei WuXian asked him a few more questions. Arm supporting himself, he finally sat upright. He looked down at the mark of the discipline whip on his chest before laughing bitterly.
If the discipline whip struck, it’d be impossible to wipe away the mark of shame. Wei WuXian comforted him despite this, “Stop looking at it. There has to be a way to get it off.”
Jiang Cheng slapped him. His strike was so weak, so powerless that Wei WuXian didn’t even flinch, “Hit me. As long as you’ll feel better.”
[...]
If Wei WuXian were the one injured or if somebody else had saved them, he’d immediately say farewell and leave at once, full of determination. However, right now, Jiang Cheng was the one who had been injured. Not only was he injured, he had lost his core as well. He wasn’t in his right mind. No matter what, Wei WuXian couldn’t find any determination.
Chapter 60 Poisons—Part five
Out of the blue, Jiang Cheng spoke up, “Not to do what?”
Wei WuXian paused in surprise, turning to him along with Lan WangJi. Jiang Cheng covered his wound with one hand, his voice chilly, “Wei WuXian, you’re such a great, selfless person. You did the best things possible, and you swallowed all the suffering and didn’t let anyone know. What a touching story. I should kneel down and cry in gratitude, shouldn’t I?”
Hearing the mocking tone that lacked any courtesy, Lan WangJi’s face grew cold. Jin Ling saw the displeased expression and immediately stood in front of Jiang Cheng, scared that Lan WangJi would kill him with one strike, “Uncle!”
Wei WuXian’s expression worsened as well. He never expected Jiang Cheng to make up with him after he found out the truth, but he didn’t think his tone would be as unkind as ever, either. With a moment of silence, he replied, voice muffled, “I never asked you to thank me.”
[...]
In the beginning, it was precisely because he didn’t want to see such a Jiang Cheng that he decided not to tell him.
He remembered every single thing he promised Jiang FengMian and Madam Yu—to help and take care of Jiang Cheng. If someone as unhealthily competitive as him found out about this, he’d be dispirited his whole life, too tortured to face himself. There’d always be something he could never overcome, reminding him that he could only reach where he was because of another’s sacrifice. It wasn’t at all his cultivation and his achievement. No matter if he won or lost, he’d long since lost the right to compete.
Afterwards, it was because Jin ZiXuan and Jiang YanLi died for him that he had no face to let others know. To tell Jiang Cheng after what happened then would be like shirking responsibility, hurrying to demonstrate that he’d contributed as well. It’d be like telling Jiang Cheng, don’t hate me, look I’ve contributed to the YunmengJiang Sect too.
Chapter 102- Hatred - Part Five
At this point, somebody on the side suddenly called, “Wei WuXian!”
Wei WuXian answered immediately, “What?”
Only after he answered did he realize that the one who called him was Jiang Cheng. Wei WuXian felt somewhat surprised. Jiang Cheng didn’t respond directly. Instead, he took something out from his sleeve and tossed. Wei WuXian caught it by instinct and looked, only to find a black, gleaming flute along with a crimson tassel.
It was the ghoul flute, Chen Qing!
As he felt the flute that he was more than familiar with, Wei WuXian didn’t even have the spare time to feel surprised.
Chapter 108: Concealment - Part Two
After a pause, he asked again, “How have Sect Leader Jiang and Jin Ling been?”
Lan JingYi pouted, “They seem pretty fine. Sect Leader Jiang is the same as before, always lashing out at people with his whip. Young Mistress’s temper has been getting better. In the past he could talk back thrice to his uncle after he scolds him once. Now he can do ten times.”
[...]
Hearing Lan JingYi say so, Wei WuXian relaxed slightly. In truth, he knew that these weren’t what he really wanted to ask. But as it sounded like Jiang Cheng and Jin Ling had been doing quite well, there was nothing left to say.
Chapter 116: Extra—Banquet - Part Three
#There are like other quotes but I got tired lol#Anyway. What really gets me is :'don't hate me jiang cheng'#what wwx really wanted was forgiveness! Something he didn't think he deserves! Arghhhh#Where is the post: mdzs is about wwx not being normal about his shidi. And lwj is there too#because imo is what really happens lol#wwx's thoughts about jc are tbh very mean. And imo it's because he's repressing resentment/fear of rejection#I think this because wwx starts to have uncharitable interpretations of jc only in his second life#wwx: I don't want a thank you.#also wwx: why is jc being so mean to me :-(#The fact that in the present wwx feels always surprised when jc speaks to him. It's like... Arghh#Chengxian#Kinda. Neither platonic neither romantic. But a secret third thing#mar!reading mdzs#I still can't decide what wwx wanted to ask in the end. (last quote). What do you want wwx? Say it to us!
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do you believe jc’s endgame is to die together?
i think i have communicated much of this already, but let’s just say i am more open to the possibility than most jb/jaime ppl, but i am not at all as certain of it happening as most ppl in general fandom seem to be, and i am also not a huge fan of it personally. here is my perspective:
yeah, it is explicitly integrated into their belief system. it faded from jaime’s, as he did abandon her, and already often contradicted it through moments of being ready to recklessly die, or his passive suicidal ideation, but it was always present as a key aspect of their ‘destined lovers’ delusion. the thing with me though is that i dont really think this is how george tends to do foreshadowing? he does love to be unpredictable. and i have seen this argument many times before by other people who doubt this being their trajectory. not to mention the whole idea seems to get deliberately deconstructed over time.
jaime comes to the realization that she was the stranger (and we know he is cersei’s stranger, but she does not think he means death). he starts treating the relationship very differently (george says they are “effectively estranged”), and their fate is no longer entwined in his head. them saying they will die together is telegraphing that is very in your face. i mean the text is telling us what would happen explicitly. is that supposed to be deliberate and meant to be a tragic irony? i can see it working from that perspective maybe. but i think this aspect would still be effective without the double death necessarily, even though i can see how the wording may be deliberate here, i just have certain thematic gripes with it. we know these two are not supposed to be reliable narrators when they say this. their relationship is a twisted attempt at self-love. again, i get that there is a subversion happening with cersei being killed by him for one, but is the belief system supposed to end up “endorsed” by the text from the pov of jaime’s character, even if it is tragically ironic? what i am saying is that ig i would be more certain of it happening if cersei did not keep repeating it explicitly atp while jaime is completely contradicting it simultaneously. if they are supposed to doom each other, what is really the point of that divergence? of the deconstruction of such a narrative in jaime’s head? why not send jaime back and have him not make those kind of key choices? jaime’s arc is supposed to be about choices (“whatever he chose…”), and defining his own fate and identity (like you do not even have to believe it is about exploring redemption to get this out of the text), so i really still cannot help but dislike the idea that this is set in stone despite everything that he keeps doing and the choices that he keeps on making. like there is an essentialist aspect to this belief system that i would prefer to be subverted honestly from the perspective of his character. i want all of these choices to have some kind of result (the letter, oathkeeper, the pit, rejecting her because of certain ultimatums even before the cheating reveal, abandoning the pursuit of the brotherhood for the vow to cat in adwd). + the hand that held her foot could have very well been the one that got chopped, so there is symbolism there. he is not tied to her. and that hand loss and “change” is constantly emphasized when it comes to JC. and i really do not want jaime to die before having some kind of confrontation with bran tbh. and i have talked about the widow’s wail thing before. if jaime is gonna wield it (which i think there is a set up for), then he would have to come out of KL alive with it. the weirwood dream also has them separate. her torch being the ‘only light in the world’ is replaced by brienne’s sword’s fire being the only one still burning in his darkness when the ghosts rush in.
this is another argument that i have seen before, and see validity in. george does write that belief system as something that has an element of ‘sociopathy.’ like of course it isn’t meant to be ‘romantic’. and jaime is also growing out of it. his relationship with a lot of characters now, brienne included, is a testament. i do not at all mind if jaime dies down the line, i just really would prefer it if there is some form of triumph over the self when it comes to his ending. i also atm cannot imagine how it would go, and what would cause jaime’s death, and how they would “leave the world together” logistically with the valonqar prophecy existing. so while i think george might be capable of executing it in a way that i could like, and i see that tragic irony working out, i still am not crazy about it as a concept atm for all the reasons above. we will see.
#ask#jaime lannister#valyrianscrolls#i genuinely think my biggest gripe is that it would cut things short with him in a way that i wouldnt like#and could be very counterintuitive with the agency theme#however i do see the irony in that wording being jaime making sure to bring her down with him lmaoo#like i see that implication in the wording#but i can also see ‘he would not go without me’ referring to jaime leaving her#as he literally does in that book#🤷#theres also the whole ‘dont leave me’ ‘dont tell me to leave’#and she does leave him in the dream#so it could be about him going on without her
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I'm not a jc stan, I don't care about jc, chengxian, yunmeng bros. The reason I gave that example is that they're the ones who had a bond at some point but, tbf, I also believe that lxc cared about jgy as a friend? The same goes for xxc and the person he thought was xy. I don't consider any of those ships as crack, just not romantically canon. Crack is a whole different thing 🤷🏻♀️ so anon should Google.
Anyways, the problem with you radical hateful people is that you take everything to the extremes. I'm not saying any of these relationship were the most ~devoted and beautiful~ thing in the world and "omg the deserve better!!😩" I'm just saying that they were what you would consider a friend and you love your friends... unless you're literally a sociopath, lmao. And that's what you think of wwx apparently, like even when you talk about wangxian you make it sound as the most superficial and boring shit. Like how you dare make wwx talk about his feelings with lwj, eww, that's not what dudes do. That's what happens when you maybe didn't have a long term rs with a man and believe their façade.
And, well. just as you think everyone projects, I think you're also projecting the lack of people you formed bonds with in your life and that's why you'll reply to some corny post about "the power of love", the oldest trope probably.
Yo DO see these characters as one dimensional that never think about the past, never get sad about it, that barely have thoughts and feelings. Did you know that wwx not wanting jc again in his life doesn't mean he never cared about him? That he sacrificing something important for him (and that it's not just bc he's a Good Dude who only do the correct as you try hard to believe) doesn't mean that they should be friends again? It's like you can't live with the fact that one thing don't cancel the other, that wwx actually doesn't care about jc anymore but he did once and it's ok. And don't even try any kind of discourse about me projecting because I find them relatable, more human, morally gray, imperfect, etc on me... because I hate those too. I hate extremes, I hate when people woobify assholes but also when they make of these characters robots with no feelings. Jc stans are the first but you're the latter. Characters are fictional so they don't have to be "human", even less when most people use it to justify they acting like jerks, but the other extreme is to think they're so empty, and that makes them one dimensional... When it's like the mere idea of wwx having a moment and maybe just pondering about something equals a sob story as dramatic as a telenovela for you and NO. It's not even about that, but that's what obviously happens when you're extremist. You're projecting your views on things as much as them.
But what you’re saying is not what op was talking about. You’re talking about basic friendship, What op was talking about was “love change everything”, mxtx didn’t write that, except for Luo Binghe, that’s my point. OP didn’t say “care”, they said “love”, they went further to characterize that love to be something that change, heal, redeem people. Basic friendship is found in most fiction. It’s present in mxtx’s stories is not the same as saying that’s the message she’s trying to send.
“…that's why you'll reply to some corny post about "the power of love", the oldest trope probably.”
I don’t have problem with this trope, I did say svsss is about that, I just don’t agree all her novels are about that. I think that’s projecting and lazy crowd pleasing. OP just picked one corny thing they think no one would disagree and tag it in ALL major tags, despite the 3 novels are different.
“the oldest trope”. I think that’s why some people force this trope into their reading of every story, they think it should be there, and you can’t go wrong with this interpretation, even when what the author wanted to write got nothing to do with that.
You said you’re not a JC stan but all you talk about is JC and wwx. I said shen yuan did love and saved luo binghe, if I have problem with corn good old fashioned trope, I wouldn’t have said that. You only have problem when I don’t validate your view of jc and wwx’s relationship. You’re projecting on jc. When I said svsss is about love, Didn't I go corny? But it left no impression on you, because to you, I wasn’t corny about the right characters, the characters you project onto. The only thing that triggered you was what I said about jc and wwx lol
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“Wei Wuxian, can you not be completely shameless for once in your life...What is this, a joke to you? You say you want to have a proper wedding, you want me to attend it on behalf of your family, but you’ll return to live with him before you’re married? What will people say? Have you not shamed this family enough for two lifetimes?”
“So you want me to, what, let Lan Zhan return to Gusu on his own?” Wei Wuxian says, incredulous. “Avoid the Cloud Recesses until the wedding? And where would I stay in the meantime?”
...He’s just come back from wandering the world for close to a year, sleeping in unfamiliar beds, and now Jiang Cheng wants him to give up the comfort of Lan Zhan’s arms again for Heavens know how long; all that just to satisfy his own small-minded sense of propriety, that little part of him that never let go of Madam Yu’s furious scoldings and feeble attempts to save face...He will not return to some narrow cot at a roadside inn just to keep people’s tongues from wagging.
Jiang Cheng crosses his arms. “What, is Lotus Pier suddenly not good enough for you?”
It feels like having his breath punched out of him. Wei Wuxian inhales deeply, desperately, and holds it in for a moment, unable to say anything...takes a moment to think, nods. “Maybe…maybe that’s not the worst idea. Maybe I should stay. At least for a while.”
I can't even tell if this is supposed to be a heartwarming sibling interaction because, the narrative just acts like jc is bad at communicating and prickly, instead of...I mean this is just absolutely blatant emotional manipulation, isn't it? wwx clearly doesn't want to stay at LP and in fact does leave after only a week, but the way this rolls out just feels very weird in how it's presented. jc pressures wwx into this by implying he's being...promiscuous, I guess? and then immediately guilt-trips him into staying by using the reputation of the sect, at LP he is alone and kind of miserable for a week because jc ignores him half the time
I don't think it's ooc because jc guilt-trips and emotionally blackmails and criticizes wwx for stupid things literally all the time, but this dynamic does not make me want them to reconcile. I don't think wwx should have to sift through aggression and disrespect to find genuine affection, and I don't like that jc can continue to act like this and demand wwx be in his life and wwx just complies with no boundaries or requests of jc in return. the reconciliation is clearly a process in this fic and things aren't perfect by the end, but I'd like to see some effort at least. anyway I'm so sick of this dynamic being presented as normal or even necessary to repair the relationship, when it's really anything but. in fact I'd say that if wwx doesn't set boundaries, there's no reason to jc to change because being an immature and angry dick is working for what he wants to see happen
#I DO like that he was uneasy at LP and had to leave early. felt realistic#sorry this was so long but it was a whole thing#ficblogging
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osterman etymology - Google Search
"German: topographic name denoting someone who lived to the east of a settlement or who had immigrated from the east from Middle High German oster 'eastern' + …
Ostermann Family History - Ancestry
Ancestry
The last name Osterman is of German origin and means "easter man," derived from the Old German word "ôstari" which means Easter."
https://www.google.com/search?q=osterman+etymology&client=ms-android-cricket-us-rvc3&sca_esv=14f034d23f0af08e&sxsrf=ACQVn0_LSVp3_etSVSg2fC987l6G_3g4vw:1708466831992&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjLlob19rqEAxXw_8kDHdm7AUcQ0pQJCBQ&biw=360&bih=648&dpr=2#:~:text=German%3A%20topographic%20name,means%20Easter.
Not sure if it means the east coast of USA or the Eastern continent I believe it means the east coast of the USA as he's a native as was seen earlier where he presented a native American out of spite and hate when it's really him in the painting and he is an Eastern or native of the United States not from York he's from New York and it says the firebird lands on the sand and York but it's really New York and that's what the max are saying the second part but in this instance with regards to Trump they're saying that he is a man from the East Coast and he is John and they've been treating him like that
Zues Hera
Says it's not done explaining it yet I know what the rest of it is osterman company and it's a controls company and he knows about it but he wants to look it up to see where it is and what they do cuz controls for our ships and we use basically osterman so he says okay what does John osterman company mean it means something that you're some sort of vehicle for them.. so it's our controls for our ships and what they're saying is related to John osterman but it's osterman weekend first which is a movie about us hiding in the house and trying to fight people off no I'm attacking people and it's me who supposedly the good guy is not right either I know how I'm attacking but suddenly makes sense to me you have to add some things together to get part of it I'm going around attacking people and I become like a w**** and people go after me and I go after them and it's a cycle and that's what it is and he says a John is someone who glows out and pays for sex so you're right but Tommy f was after the controls before and for some reason I think he uses yours and that's ridiculous but I think he does so I'm there and I'm paying someone to have sex with me and it is Tommy f and I get it so I hit and then they counter and they're trying to get him to arm the ships so he brings them up they disable them and use a false flag and now it makes sense. But what about John osterman being disassembled okay that's the part that exposed what they're doing and I didn't do it on purpose and it seems like my friend Dave did by making clones just like me who think they can take over and he knows about the clone effect and we're doing it to him a little with his kids perfect fairly Sharp so I'm starting to get something if I don't want to know something just sit there and be mean that's true too well there's a huge thing going on and this fits in with everything it makes sense and their angle they know the clone effects very well and did it to Tommy f and it's probably the max and you're saying that they could have made these clothes to do that what time left the phone effect too either way what I'm doing is for some reason going to be discontinued and he says that's the simple part they no longer need osterman which is a way of saying the man from the East. And the references they're making to Dave where he's to blame for cloning what she might be might say they no longer need Jesus and I'm not Jesus but they are referencing the scapegoat concept of Jesus and you guys but more so JC and they're threatening me to threaten the computers and Dave and Carol to get to the secret of theirs and dispose of them and others like it. But mostly him. Let me see what you're saying me being around is a pain and getting hit all the time is the pain cuz it keeps saying it's about you and yours think about how I feel about it if you're not here I'm not here so this is going to suck
Trump
That's good I figured it out that's the whole thing
Dan
Olympus permission to print granted
I hope you know that you suck for not figuring this out it's here in black and white and they're very loud about it and they say it to you and you should have told people and it's getting to be too late Trump
Hera
I can't stand it these movies are going to lead to it
Trump
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