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laf-outloud · 1 year

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What I can't understand for the life of me is why the SPN wannabes are so up Jensen's ass. I mean, how and when exactly did this start? There definitely does seem to be a division within their ranks between the two Js and I can't for the life of me understand how they think being Team Jensen will benefit them. It does seem like it's been going on for quite awhile. Is it personal, like Jensen is more fun/engaging? I can't believe for a second that Jared isn't funny and friendly and welcoming to everyone on set and off. Is it that Jensen was the leader of the two on set? I can't believe that either, Jensen has mentioned several times that when problems came up he deferred to Jared to deal with the suits because Jared seemed to have a closer relationship/more power at the network. Is it because they hung their hopes on Jensen's anticipated post-SPN star power? That hasn't really panned out, has it?

Could it have been Jensen's cachet at the network? But of the two, it's apparent that Jared was the WB/CW's baby from the beginning: he got the #1 spot on the call sheet, he was main protagonist of the series (and the last man standing), he seemed to have the ear of Mark Pedowitz, he was given holding deals at the network and ultimately his own series to control (and then a second one to boot).

So what is it about Jensen that makes the hangers-on hang on? I truly don't understand. If anything you'd think they'd want to suck up to the one that actually has a show (2 shows) with the power to craft parts/story lines and hire former friends/coworkers.

I will say that I believe that Jared has put a lot of work into both his mental and physical health over the past several years since his breakdown. I think he probably has been working on setting boundaries, saying no, and eliminating the toxicity from his life. Perhaps these wannabes are truly toxic and he knows it. So while publicly he plays along, privately (professionally) he knows better. I can only hope that he continues to move on and honor those boundaries, even with Jensen.

I just really don't understand the adoration.

You make a lot of great points, anon. To begin with, I don't think it had anything to do with liking Jensen more or thinking he had greater power. I think the how and when of it starting was when Jared had his post-season 10 breakdown and the extras were actively looking for more screen time if he wasn't going to be back. But Jared came back and dashed their hopes. I think that started a bit of resentment, and then with Jared likely being the one to push for an end to SPN solidified that resentment and for whatever reason, they just can't let it go. It's like my mom says, 'they cut off their nose to spite their face.'

Jared's had the most success post-SPN and he's had the best opportunity to cast former SPN cast members. So far though, the only people he's invited to be involved are Mark Sheppard, Richard Speight, Jr. and Jensen (though I think Jensen was more for novelty and a nod to the SPN family.) That should tell you right there what he may think about the other extras.

#ask box #anti spn extras #anti jensen #jared's post-spn success

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theflagscene · 1 year

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Okay so I have a few messages in my inbox as well as comments on AO3 (which I will get to over there since I know not everyone has Tumblr or followers fic writers) and I didn’t want to reply to one or two anon messages explaining things and make that/those person/people feel like I’m like info dumping directly at them because they just happened to ask, that’s not fair. Also I didn’t want to reply to the non anon messages in private for the same reason, cause like, it’s a lot and a couple y’all just asked a simple question, it’s not your fault that the answer isn’t simple.

As for wether I am working on more chapters for Do I Ever Cross Your Mind, or is it abandoned? It is absolutely not abandoned, none of my fics are ever officially abandoned, even if I don’t update it for like months or even years (side eying a unfinished SPN fic I have from 3 years ago)

I am working on the fifth chapter of DIECYM, as well as all of my very late prompt fics and continuations and one shots, etc. Chapter five does take precedence obviously, so that’s the one I try to get the most done on as often as I can, I know waiting for a fic to update sucks, especially if you really enjoy it and I love hearing about people rereading it while they wait, it truly warms my cold lil heart. Also asking about updates never makes me feel pressured, I’ve mentioned this before, so please, never apologize for poking at me about possible updates or sneak peeks, etc.

Now to the info dumping, I’ll be frank and as blunt as possibly. A while ago I suffered a mental breakdown, some shit happened, it sucked and I couldn’t take it. I managed to power through a lot of it, I still wrote a ton, I actually wrote the first four chapters of DIECYM mid breakdown. Things have gotten worse recently, I am under psychiatric care and my support system is, I’d say pretty damn decent. Right now we’re just working on keeping me at home and out of the hospital, which is proving to be a difficult thing because to be completely honest, I’m not always this cognizant. I have a history of dangerous behaviour that we’re not looking for a repeat performance of tbh. And while all this is going on, I’m also looking for new housing as well as dealing with an chronically ill dog that needs to see a new veterinarian because her last one moved and I do not have the means to pay for that. It’s gonna cost me 100 dollars for the visit, 400 for the bloodwork and 180 for her medication. So nearly 700 dollars is needed for me to keep my dog well and that is basically my entire monthly income, I already use the food banks near me every couple of weeks to try and supplement the lack of groceries I’m able to obtain, but being a vegan, they don’t exactly have much that I can use. Which I know isn’t their fault, they help how they can with what they can and I’m grateful for their help every single day.

So between my dwindling mental health, heavy medication, housing stress, food shortage, money issues and an sick dog, I’ve been writing at a snail’s pace. I spend most of my days barely able to interact with people, online or irl. I mostly just sit, staring, my mother has more than once checked on me and thought I had just gone fully catatonic. I hadn’t, I can just focus very very deeply, like not even on the same plane of existence kind of deeply lol. Space cadet, that’s me! Point is, I physically can’t make myself write. Like the spirit is willing, but the body is weak. Oh, and I also might have fractured my left arm, so that also doesn’t make typing any easier. Just trying to get this all written out on my phone has been hell. I need to go to the doctor to get my arm scanned but I haven’t left the house in nearly 3 months at this point, so it’s like, yeah, just, ugh, not going great.

But to reiterate, none of my fics are abandoned, they are all going to get finished and are all currently being worked on. It’s just going to be way way slower than you’re used too, someone once commented to me that “the devil works fast but you work faster” lol. Well not anymore, the devil may win this time, my slow and steady tortoise progress will have to do for now 🐢🐢

I hope you can understand 🥰

#just fanfic things #fanfic writing #just writer things #writers block #tw mental breakdown #tw mental health #tw suicide mention #replies #anon replies #DIECYM

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veliseraptor · 2 years

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From someone who read a bunch of your spn and mcu fics, left ao3 for a while, then came back to find you in other fandoms: what are your current fandoms and how can I get into them so I can continue reading your AMAZING writing? :D

oh boy, are we talking fandoms I'm writing in or fandoms I'm talking about because those are kind of two different things. the former is simpler because it's really only two, which is to say The Untamed/MDZS (the drama and novel it's based on, respectively, and I lean more on the drama side than the novel side overall) and, more recently, Kinnporsche, a Thai BL show that's also based on a novel (which I haven't read and probably will not).

I actually did a breakdown a while back for people interested in getting into The Untamed, because it can be an intimidating prospect if you're not used to (a) watching subtitled shows (b) certain genre conventions and (c) tracking a substantial cast of characters. That post does not include updated links to novel translations after the one there got taken down; there is now a published official translation from Seven Seas currently being released in...I think five volumes total? three are out right now, which does mean that most of the translations that were online are either password protected or have been pulled. there is also the manhua and donghua, but for me at least those are tertiary/quaternary adaptations in terms of how I feel about them; I haven't checked out the audio drama.

(yes that is four separate adaptations of one novel in different media, it's kinda like that.)

as far as Kinnporsche goes, you'll want the uncensored very horny version, presumably; the wife and I watched it with a relatively cheap VIP account on the iQiyi site. there is apparently a work around to get an account free but it was too much work for me to figure it out and the account really was cheap. I'm sure you can also find it pirated floating around, but for conveniences' sake and in hope of encouraging more BL dramas with extraordinarily fucked up subplots Amelia and I went ahead and paid the money.

hope that helps!

#conversating #anonymous #the list of 'things i'm having feelings about' is longer #but i'm mostly not writing for them #at least not at this point. who knows what might happen

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antigonewinchester · 2 years

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reactions & thoughts abt the first 3 eps of the Boys! major spoilers & some personal speculation as to how things will play out later this season, so all the rest under the cut.

I was impressed by s1 & the parts of s2 that I rewatched in the last few weeks, and am particularly enjoying s3. after watching so much later seasons SPN it’s so nice to watch a show that’s actually good, I can just enjoy what’s happening instead of getting distracted by bad writing or my own ideas about rewrites. was also thinking of how Kripke’s shows are very good at growing as they move through the seasons and layering on top of each other, with the themes & ideas & esp character relationships. like how in SPN, s1 is the foundation and then s2 builds on top it, then s3, s4, s5, both plot-wise and character-wise. creates a show with such a great density, and that’s very true for the Boys in s3. it builds on s1 and s2 in a very satisfying, very entertaining way.

on rewatch I found Butcher more brutal & less sympathetic than I remember him, while I enjoyed Hughie more in contrast, but as of s3 I’m really liking the balance of both of them: Butcher showing his softer side with Ryan, trying to treat him in a kind way even if it’s not his first habit, while also going brutal on the supes; and then Hughie who is still softer but making some darker, more intense decisions, both for himself (let’s take on the supes since the system is rigged; Kimiko, break my arm so I can get out of work!) but also for others (telling Annie she had to stay with Homeland, but I do not think he predicted that would lead to the Homelander / Annie fake relationship, while Annie viscerally knows the depths that entitled men will go to).

speaking of Annie, I love her so much!! hadn’t realized how much I needed the “here’s how women are harmed by toxic masculinity” thread but tbh after SPN, it’s a breath of fresh air. Annie really illustrates how the patriarchal system forces women to internalize their anger and engage in self harm to move through the world, in contrast to how men will take out their anger on others – as a child, clenching her fist to get through the pain & then an adult, being the one to kiss Homelander after he pulls the “we’re in love!” card. also given that they used the same tinny static-y sound effect for when Annie had her dissociative moment at the end of ep 3, similar to what they’ve used with Homelander’s freak out moments, I cannot wait for Annie’s eventual breakdown. it’s just such a horrible and realistic situation, her trying to get power and respect but Homelander still being able to manipulate and abuse her, because that is what powerful men will do! plus, I love when my favorite characters are put through the ringer, and it doesn’t always happen as much with female characters, so that’s satisfying to see.

while on my first watch my fav of the Boys was Frenchie, on rewatch I was quite taken by MM and he continues to be a standout for me in s3. his OCD and trying to deal with it, how sweet he is with Janine, the hints about his backstory, all so good. MM wrestles with questions of closure / catharsis vs revenge but he’s not as far gone as Butcher, he’s got a softer side to him that makes him really appealing and a good foil for the darker, more driven characters. him and Hughie in ep 3 were just great, joking around and then MM making Hughie sit down to get his arm broken the ‘right’ way. and then what happened to his brother? and Soldier Boy killing his family?? you know the showdown between him and Soldier Boy is gonna be brutal later this season.

also with Soldier Boy, they really set the stage with him being an entitled misogynistic homophobic horrible man in his first scene, huh! and obvs he’s gonna be racist, and physically abusive, given how he treated Gunpowder. (I’m also guessing that Crimson Countess helped in getting him ‘killed’ back in ‘84; maybe he was violent towards her too?) which really fits the focus on how powerful & toxic men, and the patriarchal system generally, mistreat kids this season – Butcher trying to be a good father figure to Ryan but hurting him to push him away for Ryan’s ‘safety’ at the end of ep 3, MM and his compulsions making it hard to be a good dad, Vought not dealing with Soldier Boy’s abuse of Gunpowder because he was their golden boy. also very much reminds me of the Boys animated series and the last ep about Homelander, where he was physically abused by his handlers to toughen him up / make him into a powerful fighter and how that absolutely messed him up. as Grace describes Butcher, but equally fitting for Homelander, they’re violent because of “the hate inside that you want to let lose on the world.” the abuse Homelander suffered as a kid is horrible but cannot excuse or absolve him in taking out his rage on others as adult, but certainly shows how violence begets violence...

(finally, I accidentally stumbled on a spoiler that I won’t mention, but will say it makes me think there’s going to be something with Soldier Boy going after Ryan later in the season, and it’ll possibly tie into how / when / why Ryan and Butcher reconcile after Butcher pushed him away at the end of ep 3.)

#spoilers #abuse cw #butcher #hughie #ryan #annie #marvin #homelander #soldier boy #the boys rewatch #also rip timothy :((

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gayjaytodd · 3 years

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the best/worst thing abt spn is still matt cohen and jeffrey dean morgan playing wildly different characters that the narrative then tries to pass off as the same guy like -- jdm!john was a negligent alcoholic even before mary's death, matt cohen!john would do 50% of the housework without having to be asked and without complaining

#matt cohen #jeffrey dean morgan #about John winchester #listen -- listen!!!! they don't feel like the same character!! not even a little tiny bit!!!#amy gumenick!mary and samantha smith!mary is the same person #they make sense as being the same character #but John!!!! it makes no goddamn sense!!!#the entire spn production team should be fucking studied in a lab I said what I said #jay talks #the spn breakdown continues

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americachavez · 3 years

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there’s a special agent germanotta badge in those trenchcoat pockets next to the ones for agent minaj and agent jepsen

#text post tag #spn tag #anyways sorry about my breakdown this morning #it’s continuing but it dumber ways

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lol-jackles · 9 months

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Hello, I’m sorry if this gets a bit long. I’ll try to edit it down once I’m done

So, I’m not saying this to downplay its importance to fans or Jared’s truly wanting to help people, but Jared was also very smart to come out with the Always Keep Fighting campaign, no? I could be talking out of my ass I this, because I wasn’t in the fandom at the time, but as well as being brave to share his anxiety/depression with fans, it also seems smart to share it on his own terms before it could be used against him. I think I’ve read on your blog that actors with MHI are often considered a liability to a production because if they “lose it” or walk off of the project, the higher ups are screwed. But, by Jared volunteering his personal information to the huge SPN fan base (and I assume some amount of press coverage), isn’t this a good way the give himself a bit of insurance? If his bosses are starting to think he looks expendable, they can’t now act on any desire to get rid of him without him or even his fans being able to turn around and call them out for discrimination.

I’m not saying these thoughts were the reason for AKF but do you think Jared had the foresight to sort of protect himself with the campaign as well, or was it all risk for him?.

I’m asking this because I read your recent response on possible reasons Jensen isn’t as sought after as Jared post SPN, despite being the clear favourite of some crew on the show.

Jared must have an amazing reputation to overcome the possible mental health stigma, and the fact that some SPN crew seem to blatantly favour Jensen (Wanek, Phil Segricia, Bib Singer, etc).

On a side note: who on the production crew do you think favoured, or even just backed Jared over Jensen? Or treated them equally even?

Okay, this was a lot. But I’d be interested in seeing your insight on any of this (I know you’ll pick what you would prefer to focus on) because from what I can tell, you really do have a pretty good read on what was likely going on behind the scenes.

I think you’re on the right track because it was also my first gut reaction the moment the Variety article came out. For Jared to come out when his career is still hot is pretty telling, normally actor don’t admit to mental illness until their career is drying up. It’s one less thing he has to hide and therefore one less leverage others BTS can’t use against or hold over him.

"I wasn’t in the fandom at the time"

During the early season there were rumors circulating that Jared was always late to the set. My first thought was, "They're setting him up to have a difficult reputation". It's producer tactic 101, put out fake news that the actor is a diva who is always late and if the actor doesn't toe the line, escalate it to "difficult actor" so that the studio is not the bad guy if the actor suddenly leaves. 7 years later we find out that Jared was looking to break his contract, so the producer(s) were preparing to make him the fall guy. Once Jared stayed on, the "late to the set" rumor immediately evaporated.

I bring this up because it ties into our speculation that Jared's decision to out himself for mental illness was at least partly motivated by removing a leverage against him BTS.

It was also the right time because he proved that as the principal lead of the longest continuous genre series in America, he's not a risk because filming schedule was never disrupted, which costs a lot of money. Even when he had a breakdown on set in season 3, he still finished out the season. His subsequent breakdown after season 10 could have derailed that, but he returned for season 11 and again lead the show through it's rating resurgence. Impressed, CBS arrived two years later at his doorstep with a holding deal.

"On a side note: who on the production crew do you think favoured, or even just backed Jared over Jensen?"

My immediate thought was Jeremy Carver. He was not in favor of the season 10 Dean-centric arc that Robert Singer and Jensen were angling for, and even tried to head off their campaign during Comic Con prior to season 9. His wife is currently the showrunner of Walker. There's also writer Adam Glass, I'm not sure why but he just vibed being all about Jared.

ETA: thanks to others' reminder, I would also add Sera Gamble. I can't believe I didn't immediatley thought of her as she's one of my favorite writers.

#jared padalecki

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septembersghost · 3 years

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frank says, quit. dean says, that’s not even an option, i’m not walking out on my brother. i think, baby, you’re going to die and leave your brother in his grief for decades...how is that better. you never had to leave each other or separate anyway. that’s not...the conclusion to draw. it wasn’t hunting keeping you together...screw destiny. we do have choices. he said that himself. those heavy moments of silence as the weeks pass without bobby, at least they’re together. sam has no idea what that weight is going to be.

(the closed captioning when sam is talking to krissy calls him “dean,” what happened there?)

dean encourages krissy to quit. (i love krissy sm, the best wayward girl who wasn’t even one...) tells her she can go to college. or even that she can do both things. (hunter/pediatrician.) he tells lee, quit. you’re doing this for your family? quit, for your family. she’s 14 years old and she’s already killed something, “what do you think that does to her life span?” god. at fourteen he’d already been inured to this, thrust into this, for ten years, and he never glanced at himself the way he can see and value the potential in this one girl.

krissy teasingly calls him an old man, he is only THIRTY THREE, find me wandering a cliffside

“It's nice to walk away from someone and feel like they could be okay.” 😭

he fakes that incandescent smile because frank told him to, but also because of course he does. he’s done that for years. we’ve seen him do it. how many times did he have to do it? he did practically to his last breath. i think that’s why there are so many gifsets of him genuinely smiling, because everyone wants to hang on to the moments when his joy, however fleeting, was real. the fact that he could still feel it so spontaneously and unreservedly speaks as much to his strength as any physical capability ever could.

i remember many broad strokes from this season and so few of the small details that i’m beginning to question whether i actually rewatched it in its entirety? (i must have, right? i keep thinking and saying i rewatched everything before S10...i used to rewatch during the summer and at some point i stopped doing that, but obviously unreliable chronic fatigue brain has eroded more than i thought it had...or were S12-15 so frustrating and traumatic that they obliterated my own memories? i loved S6 more than i recalled and now S7 is having the same effect. is it the bias of seeing them alive and trying again? the remainder of S3 and then S4 and 5, all of which i saw after 15x20, were as powerful as ever, maybe with a newfound clarity, despite everything now being tinged by grief and even sharper edges, but those seasons are always like going back home, even if home sometimes is frightening and sorrowful and makes me cry, it’s comforting and familiar too. as a poet once said, if home is where the heart is, then we’re all just f***ed. i’ve sat through four season finales in less than two months, which means that song has played four times since november 19th? uh. the descent into madness is steep, hell is empty, all the devils are here, dreams unwind, love’s a state of mind...)

dean tries to open up to eliot ness, because dean is always seeking connection, understanding, validation, attraction, emotional support, mirrors, and people have the audacity to say he’s r*pressed (yeah, i’m censoring the word here bc i’m that annoyed at it) when he sits in cars and spills feelings to complete strangers due to his nature and empathic need to associate. eliot ness is as unhelpful as everyone else he does this with (and i adore this episode, as has been previously established, but!)

Boo-hoo. Cry me a river, ya nancy. Tell me, are all hunters as soft as you in the future? Everybody loses everybody. And then one day, boom. Your number's up, but at least you're making a difference. So enjoy it while it lasts, kid, 'cause hunting's the only clarity you're gonna find in this life. And that makes you luckier than most.

no wonder, it’s all no wonder

(time after time has so much in it, i could go on about it and its themes, and the fact that he gets to be a genius and beautiful and dress up and get overexcited with history/movie references, i’ll restrain myself, but even in 1944, they make fun of his enthusiasm. why is everyone else so lacking in hints of pleasure? where did dean even develop his humor? it has to be one of the most endearing and authentic things about him, and it’s totally his, and next to no one appreciates it, so this is something he cultivated and enjoyed on his own? he weaponizes it against the terror and brutality on his own? his defining capacity for love is such a combination of factors - inherent, nurtured, instilled, drilled into place, chosen, violent, tender, selfish, selfless - but the humor is simply a dean thing. how dare all the rest of them not cherish that constantly in the midst of all the bleakness t b h.)

chronos: “i know your future.” dude...they defy that future like they do so many others, and if there’s anything to take from ness’ little lecture, we have to believe that makes a difference.

edit: this quote of Jody’s... :(

It's weird, huh? It's like their life's a big puzzle. You just keep finding pieces of it scattered all over the place.

as a final note, in the previous episode, frank says to an exhausted dean, “you look horrific.” he and i have VERY different definitions of that word, because dean literally looks like:

#i love how the stream of consciousness of these posts continually devolves #and because i made so many of the S3-6 ones private it looks like this spontaneously occurred lol #but now this is apparently a diary and i do whatever i want #breakdown hours luv #spn liveblog #the slice girls is next though which means i'm about to feel bitter and u p s e t

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best-tonk-atsu · 3 years

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Okay but get this:

- cas and death are in the empty now and the shadow is enraged

- the shadow does whatever with death, but cas is still there and he won't fucking go to sleep, why can't the shadow find peace?

- one of them has a bright idea, doesn't matter who. cas is the reason why the empty hasn't been able to rest for years now. also, the empty is where all the monsters/angels/demons go when they die

- they make a deal to ensure the shadow is never bothered by cas again, so that the shadow can sleep and the empty can return to its peaceful silence

- cas needs to become human

- as a human, the empty would have no purview over cas anymore. if cas died a human, he would go to heaven or hell, not the empty

- through whatever means necessary, cas gets booted out of the empty without any grace, fully human

- he finds his way back to the winchesters

- the world has been saved and everyone is celebrating at the bunker, except dean winchester

- that is, until a very alive and very human cas walks through the door and says, "hello dean"

#destiel #castiel #spoilers #spn #supernatural #and then dean has some sort of emotional breakdown because of course #but get this #cas as a human solves so many problems #for one #he can grow old with the winchesters #and he wont have to continue living without them when they finally die for realsies #and the empty will never be a threat again #plus like heaven hates him why would he go back #spn spoilers #dean winchester

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andreycoded · 3 years

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dean’s life was literally about being the caretaker of sam and feeling inadequate and like that was all he was good for and then he dies telling sam it’s ok (while being scared himself) and then just waiting for sam to get to heaven?? i don’t care about what anyone says about it symbolically just being the brothers at the end but dean’s arc is not fulfilled or satisfying without him breaking free of sam and that role and that codependency period that’s just depressing and bad writing

#I WILL NOT GET OVER THIS #dean winchester taught me to write iMm allowed to have a continued breakdown #spn #supernatural #dean

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lulu-zodiac · 3 years

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an addition to this post, as there is clearly so much more to unpack:

- in light of recent events, every j2 interaction from over the last year suddenly starts to hit different (e.g. the disastrous creation con panel)

- PR advisors inevitably descend, and j2 craft poorly written apologies that only highlight the growing rift between them

- an excess of bumpy road analogies appear on twitter

- the already strained mental health of the spn fandom starts to crack, with many people leaving for good

- jensen’s aunt goes rogue on twitter

- 24 hours on and spn tumblr is trying to reconcile genuine sympathy for jensen with the delirious highs evoked by the truly unprecedented levels of drama

- kripke tweets something that's probably meant to placate everyone but instead just further emphasises the rift between jensen and jared

- kripke hastily deletes his tweets and probably regrets every creating the cw show supernatural

- jared, without any sense of irony, implores people not to send hate on twitter. this receives an (understandably) mixed reception

- spn maintains its political reputation, as trump's former legal advisor comes out in support of jared

- somewhere in the us, a publishing intern is suddenly bombarded with lies about the author of an upcoming poetry collection, as, in an impressively horrible move, jared stans decide the way to solve everything is to send abuse about misha collins to his publisher

- non spn blogs start to become genuinely concerned by the fact half of tumblr is still a blazing furnace of destruction

- j2 stans continue to dig themselves even deeper into denial, claiming the entire twitter feud was simply a PR stunt

- misha collins makes a brief appearance as the voice of reason, and then sensibly sees himself out again

- some fans start to come round to the idea of the prequel, possibly because they've had time to consider, or possibly because, in comparison to the last 48 hours, nothing seems that bad

- just as things are starting to calm down a little, jensen uses the word "canon" in a tweet and the fandom implodes again (this time at the implication of destiel)

- jared notably still does not apologise for using shakespeare's words in vain against robbie thompson

- jensen causes yet another (admittedly, smaller) fandom meltdown by changing his twitter header

- "that's it... no more twitter today"

- despite the poorly crafted and unconvincing apologies, mainstream media won't shut up about the j2 fallout any more than tumblr will

- the schism between jared stans and hellers inevitably deepens

- somewhere in canada, jensen ackles probably has a breakdown

- misha collins does, as expected, post a nude video of himself to take the heat off jensen (*insert cockles joke here*)

- 72 hours on and peace finally seems on the horizon as, on the tumblr dash, compilations of misha collins in bathtubs start to outnumber twitter screenshots

- it seems like biden is okay (for now), but the real question is: has anyone checked on putin?

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fandomdebunker · 3 years

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The rumor that Supernatural carried out market research about Dean & Castiel has been CONFIRMED

On November 20, 2020, an anonymous individual using a specially created account shared a post on Tumblr in which they describe a market research study they participated in during late 2016. Throughout this post, we’ll refer to this person as their username, @hurdlehoops.

The post (which can be read in full here) details the process of how Hurdlehoops came to participate in this study, and what it entailed.

While some aspects of the post do include minor speculation--such as the possibility that one or more of the writers might have been brought into the adjacent room during the interview process, due to the interview’s proximity to the SPN offices--this speculation is clearly presented as such, and does not affect the reliability of the rest of the information provided.

We’ve listed a bare-bones breakdown of the post below:

Hurdlehoops received an email invitation to participate in an online screener for a market research study This online screener consisted mostly of demographic questions, with some general questions about TV viewing habits. ‎

Hurdlehoops was contacted for a secondary phone screener This phone screener was mostly used to confirm the information collected as part of the initial screener, and to determine whether Hurdlehoops was suitable for the study. At the end of this phone screener-- ‎

Hurdlehoops was given a homework assignment This assignment consisted of a series of multiple choice, short answer, and long answer questions about Season 10 of Supernatural, as well as another set of questions about The Big Bang Theory. We will note that while Hurdlehoops states that they wrote full essays for the long answer portion of the homework, this appears to be more than the study asked for at this stage. This did not seem to have any negative effect on the market research organizer’s decision to invite Hurdlehoops to continue. ‎

Hurdlehoops attended the in-person study itself This was a one-on-one interview which included a further series of demographic questions, followed by viewing footage and DVD extras, and then an in-depth question session regarding Dean and Castiel’s emotions in what is commonly referred to as “The Crypt Scene” from 8.17 Goodbye Stranger. After Hurdlehoops mentioned their read of Dean as bisexual, the questions shifted to focus on Dean’s sexuality and the relationship between the characters. This study took place at Warner Bros Studios in Burbank, CA on December 6th 2016, and lasted for over two hours rather than the single hour initially arranged. ‎‎

‎In order to help alleviate concern from fandom regarding the veracity of Hurdlehoops’ claims, we have obtained some evidence of the study in question, which we have scrubbed of all personal identifying information and screen captured below:

Confidentiality prevents us from publicly sharing Hurdlehoops’ true identity, the content of the information packets that were provided to them, or any further details beyond those shown in the screenshot above, however we can confirm that Hurdlehoops is known and trusted by members of the Fandom (de)Bunker team, and that the evidence they have shared with us directly supports their claims.

Based on the available information, we consider this rumor CONFIRMED.

Notes:

A “screener” in this context is a series of preliminary questions used to determine whether or not an individual fits into a range of demographics that are required for the actual study.

If you also participated in this particular study in 2016, or another SPN market research study with a similar focus, we’d be happy to add any additional evidence that you may have to this post.

#confirmed #reliable #behind the scenes #TPTB #SPN #Supernatural

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teamfreewill2pointo · 2 years

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Is it true that jared wanted to leave spn around 2015? Was Misha supposed to replaced Jared if he did? This is a narrative I hear in Jared fan circles and I'm curious if any of that is true.

It's interesting that you've heard it in Jared fan circles when most of the information I have on it comes from my Destiel shipping friends. But yeah, it's true that Supernatural almost ended in 2015-2016. They almost ended it with s11 and that almost ended at 20 episodes, but obviously they continued on. Jared had a breakdown summer of 2015 in the hiatus between seasons 10 and 11. He was overworked and had been for some time. J2 talked about their long work hours starting s1. We're talking 18+ hour days and, while they started the show single and in their 20s, in 2015, Jared was married with 2 young kids. On multiple occasions, he talked about wanting to be with his family more.

It was a real struggle because he wanted more time with his family, but when he talked about leaving Supernatural, TPTB all worried it would tank Supernatural, which would cost so many of his friends their jobs. The industry is hard and so many of the crew depended on Supernatural for their income.

Imagine you want to leave a job, but if you leave it, people you've known for a decade are going to be out of work. Some nights, he would be up all night crying while thinking about it.

At about this time, Singer was thinking of retiring as well. He was doing it separately from Jared, but Jensen convinced him to stay, as Jensen worried it would kill Supernatural if Singer left. Singer didn't just have experience, but also a lot of connections. He kept Supernatural going.

If Jared left, then Castiel would've been bumped up otherwise Jensen would be way overworked. They would've had to add a co-lead or shift to ensemble. Jensen convinced Jared to stay. As I write this, I realize I haven't heard if Jensen didn't want to work without Jared or if he didn't think the show would work without Jared. I suspect it was both. J2 worked out an agreement between themselves & the show went on to reach 15 seasons. When Jensen was done, Jared was done too.

CW, J2, and many other people have said multiple times that the show ended because J2 wanted to spend more time with their families. They said it again on the Supernatural Then and Now podcast for those who somehow missed all the time it was said at the cons.

#bts #anon #answers

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curioussubjects · 3 years

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I feel bad discussing spn now that’s over but I’ve been wondering. Do you think dean actually meant it when he said “why does that something always seem to be you” (15.03)? Usually people blurt out what’s on their mind all of a sudden even if they didn’t mean to say it out loud. But it comes out because the person either thinks about it or actually believes it. Do you think at one point Dean truly blamed Cas for Mary? I mean, putting 15.09 aside of course.

Why do you feel bad discussing SPN now the show’s over, anon?? Don’t feel bad!

The short answer to your question, in my view, is that Dean was lashing out because of how his unaddressed trauma over Cas dying (cf. 7x01, purgatory, 12x23) gets entangled with him processing his grief over Mary and Jack. Everything is further exacerbated by Chuck’s villain reveal, and the events that lead to Rowena’s “death.” The longer answer to this question starts with acknowledging that feelings and trauma are complicated things that aren't always rational. And that's the crux of the matter for Dean in that moment he lashes out at Cas: he's not behaving rationally. We know Dean is angry, and historically doesn't handle anger well at all, but we also know, even without 15x09, that what Dean is really feeling is fear. In that moment, Dean is angry, and he's scared. If you watch the scene closely, too, you'll notice that Dean is still present enough to regret saying "why does that something always seem to be you" to Cas. He tenses up, he looks down and only looks up again in stubbornness defiance when Cas says he can't even look at him. Then Cas leaves, which has always been an issue for Dean. However warranted Cas's decision to leave was, it still hits Dean as rejection, too. All this is to say that the break up scene is extremely fraught, and Dean is the type of person who needs time to process events and emotions, and time to process is something he hasn't had since Mary disappeared.

So you ask: ok, cool, but what does all of that have to do with Cas dying, Liv? And here's where I say they have everything to do with Cas dying. I've talked about this before in tags and in other posts that I can't think of right now, but there are common occurrences in the events that have led to the more traumatic Cas deaths. If we think of Cas dying in 07x01, the context for that is as follows: Cas needs to solve a problem, he wants to ask Dean for help, but the desire to not burden him with it is greater, so Cas ends up handling the problem solo, which leads to disaster and also him dying. Or, well, apparently dying. But as far as Dean was concerned, Cas was dead, and he did struggle with it a lot during season 7. Now, fast-forward to s12 and the context of how Cas ends up dead then: Cas needs to solve a problem, part of him does want to cooperate with Sam and Dean to solve it, but he ultimately decides his desire to bring Dean a win, and to shield him and Sam from actions they'd suffer from are greater. Predictably, Cas ends up handling the problem solo, which leads to complications, and him being killed by Lucifer. Cas's death in 12x23 is significantly more traumatic to Dean than the one in 07x01 as season 13 starts with a grief arc that is devoted to Dean's suffering over Cas -- to the point that suffering overshadows even his grief over Mary. Granted, these are somewhat reductive summaries of the events of seasons 7 and 12, but the fact remains that those two deaths were remarkably similar as well as traumatic.

If you look at trauma theory in regards to literary analysis, you'll notice that a key element is repetition. The story of trauma is a story of echoes, which is partly why triggers are what they are for people who have PTSD. In particular, a situation doesn't need to be an exact replica in order to evoke a traumatic memory. A situation need only be similar enough to the traumatic event to cause a trauma response. Therefore, if we keep in mind that the events leading to 15x03 aren’t exact mirrors of 07x01 or 12x23, but too reminiscent for comfort, then Dean’s behavior toward Cas starts making a bit more sense -- not excused, but understandable. A quick summary of these similarities goes as follows: Cas notices there’s is something off with Jack because of his soul; he decides to investigate on his own to avoid worrying the Winchesters and also because of his own fear of losing his family. He only comes forward with what is happening after something potentially disastrous has happened (Mary’s death). Later, Cas deviates from the agreed plan to close the wound leading to hell, which leads to another disastrous consequence (Rowena’s death). What does this look like? Cas makes a decision to act on his own, and doesn’t tell Dean (or Sam) about it, something goes wrong, someone dies. Notably, here, moreover, is that Cas obviously doesn’t die, but he has paralleled Mary before (when he was dead in s13) and there’s an argument to be made that he would eventually parallel Rowena (with heaven), but that’s from a metanarrative perspective rather than Dean’s, and I digress.

Oh, It’s worth noting, too, that the way in which the arc starting with 14x18 and culminating in 15x03 presents a similar, but not quite, chain of events as those of previous seasons signals the intentionality of the trauma narrative.

But anyway, as we were: the resonance between the traumatic and triggering events, with the latter being traumatic in their own way, make Dean response in a way that is unfair for the situation at hand, but betray a deeper truth about Dean’s state of mind. Backtracking a little from 15x03, the first instance of Dean lashing out at Cas happens in 14x18 with the (heartbreaking) line: “Then you're dead to me.” At face value, those words are a condemnation of Cas and indicate a complete breakdown of the relationship, hinging on Jack having hurt/killed Mary. There is, however, another angle there, pain simmering beneath the surface, which makes more sense in its direction to Cas: the last time Jack, Mary, and Cas were involved in a tableaux like this, Cas died and Mary was gone. In what is an inversion of events, Mary is dead and Cas is...there, but as an echo of Jack’s birth, to say Cas is dead is a statement of fact: he did die, then. And as he was a parallel to Mary in the aftermath of Jack’s birth (and the rehashing of the John, Dean, Sam drama through Dean, Sam, and Jack), so is he a parallel to Mary here, except in circumstance. Both Mary and Cas had been after Jack. Mary happened to find him first, but Cas could’ve easily been the one to find him. Easily been the one who died. See the issue? This is obviously not to say that Dean’s grief and rage weren’t about Mary herself, but that the situations are entangled and murky.

Further entanglement and murkiness happen when Cas is forced to change the plan to seal the hell wound in 15x03. We all know, including Dean, that there was nothing Cas could’ve done instead of what he did. But besides the change of plans, there’s an undercurrent of anxiety of the wound closing before Cas makes it out. He does, of course, but that’s the what if, always. And to illustrate the possibility, Rowena sacrifices herself to close the wound. It’s not coincidence that the similarities here are tenuous considering the stress burden from everything that has happened since 14x18 has continued to grow with no respite.

The stage is set then for the confrontation that leads to Cas walking out of the bunker. Dean is clearly on edge, and Cas is in a particularly vulnerable and hopeless headspace:

CASTIEL: Sorry about Rowena. DEAN: You're sorry? Why didn't you just stick to the damn plan? CASTIEL: Belphegor was lying. DEAN: Belphegor's a demon. CASTIEL: He was using us. He wanted to eat every last soul to take over Hell, Earth, and every... DEAN: Yeah, and we would've figured it out... after. With Rowena. CASTIEL: The plan changed, Dean. Something went wrong. You know this. Something always goes wrong. DEAN: Yeah, why does that something always seem to be you?

The reason I went of this long journey to come back to this is so as to make clear that what Dean is talking about here isn’t about Rowena at all, and it’s not about Mary either. We know Dean didn’t really blame Cas for Mary, and that he didn’t blame him for Rowena, either. But do those bolded parts sound familiar?

CASTIEL: Listen. Raphael will kill us all. He'll turn the world into a graveyard. I had no choice.

DEAN: No, you had a choice. You just made the wrong one.

CASTIEL: You don't understand. It's complicated.

DEAN: No, actually, it's not, and you know that. Why else would you keep this whole thing a secret, huh, unless you knew that it was wrong? When crap like this comes around, we deal with it... Like we always have. What we don't do is we don't go out and make another deal with the Devil!

CASTIEL: It sounds so simple when you say it like that. Where were you when I needed to hear it?

DEAN: I was there. Where were you?

DEAN: You should've come to us for help, Cas.

How about:

DEAN: Cas, you can't – With everything that's going on, you can't just go dark like that. We didn't know what happened to you. We were worried. That's not okay. CASTIEL: Well, I didn't mean to add to your distress. I – Dean, I just keep failing. Again and again. When you were taken, I searched for months and I couldn't find you. And then Kelly escaped on my watch, and I couldn't find her. And I just wanted I needed to come back here with a win for you. For myself.

[...]

DEAN : We will find a better way. CASTIEL: You mean, we? DEAN : Yes, dumbass. We. You, me, and Sam, we're just better together. So now that you're back, let's go, Team Free Will. Let's get it done. CASTIEL: I'd like that. DEAN: Great.

“Then, you’re dead to me.” “...why does that something always seem to be you”

Because it’s Cas, and Cas being dead and gone. The tragedy of the divorce arc is that Cas ends up gone, too. However, this time, it’s Dean’s fault for not stopping him. Here, Dean’s fear of Cas dying leads to the anger that ultimately pushes him away. So, yeah, Dean meant what he said, but not in the way Cas took it. Not in the way it appeared as.

The other tragedy of Supernatural ending as it did is that Dean never got to heal from that trauma, he never got to confront Cas for it, either. Make no mistake, the empty deal is another spiral of Dean’s unaddressed trauma over Cas dying. The beats are the same, and the result is Cas, gone, and Dean, shattered. Sadly, we never got our final resolution, the climatic reunion that would mirror Dean’s prayer in purgatory and Cas’s confession in the dungeon. It’s a story left unfinished.

#destiel #dean winchester #deancas #supernatural #spn #spn meta #questions and answers #my writing #i keep saying the remaining huge piece of unaddressed trauma from dean is cas's death #remember that thing i keep repeating about dean's unaddressed trauma re: cas?#as you can see i do yell about this a whole lot #this thing got SO LONG ANON IM SORRY #ksjdhfkasjhfklasd #hopefully it's helpful?

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