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#Jonah meta
dissolving-mansion · 1 year
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Obviously, criticizing Elias for being a capitalist and a corporate CEO is silly because he is neither of those things ('vibes' are not admissible in court) but there is a lot to be said about intellectual elitism and academic gatekeeping. About how this man knows exactly what is wrong with the world and priotises his own wellbeing over that of everyone else. Clearly he never took an ethics in industry class at university.
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i wanna talk about tma characters and the concept of a facade. because i have a lot of thoughts.
so most people understand how ironic it is to characterize martin blackwood as a soft boy that can do no wrong, because one of the most interesting parts of his character is how much of a subversion of that trope he is. he's manipulating people by acting like that. this is addressed in the canon. he wants everyone to like him, and he knows he'll almost always get what he wants if he puts up this facade.
something people talk about a bit less, but is still equally canon, is that gertrude robinson was doing basically the same thing. pretending to be just a boring old woman, when she's actually extremely clever and ruthless. she plays into everyone's pre-existing biases and assumptions masterfully to hide just how competent she really is. she knows exactly what she's doing, and she's willing to sacrifice anything and anyone for the sake of her self-appointed mission. characterizing her as a grandmother figure is the funniest form of irony to me.
but do you know who isn't putting up a facade? do you know who isn't changing their behavior to affect your idea of them?
the older avatars.
peter lukas isn't pretending to be passive-aggressive and overly cheery, he just kind of...is. why would he ever bother putting up a facade? he doesn't want people to like him. his authentic self is this talkative yet asocial man, who specifically aims to be awkward and unlikeable.
people say that simon fairchild's polite and carefree demeanor is an act, but i really don't think that's true either. i guess i might see it differently because i personally resonate the most with the vast out of all the fears, but i really think that a lot of that behavior makes perfect sense for his character. he doesn't think that anything in life matters. his personality reflects the lightness and carefree nature of that mindset. he just doesn't care. he does everything for fun. he's not pretending to be anything he isn't.
this could be me reaching, but honestly, i don't think even jonah magnus is putting up that much of a facade. he's lying, sure. he's manipulating people, obviously. but he's not changing his behavior in order to do that. even in mag 160, there's no big, henry mildmay-esque "dropping of the act" when he has his monologue. if you look at his behavior as elias bouchard, it's exactly the same as the little bits of him that we get to see in s5. the elias whose last words are "good luck" is the exact same elias as the one who always greeted basira with "hello, detective".
humans put up an act. monsters don't bother to.
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they-call-me-haiku · 2 months
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A lot of people have been saying that they get Elias/Jonah vibes from Lena or Gwen. But you know who actually reminds me of Elias? Alice.
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“Record and study, not interfere or contain” sounds familiar, does it not? Whenever Sam tries to talk about the entries, Alice just tells him not to think too much about it, and just do his job. Of course, she doesn't even tell him to record or study, but that's because their job is literally just to sort the entries and file them away, not to look into it. They're not working in an archive that studies the supernatural, they're just in a boring office job (or so it seems).
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Also, this line in particular stood out to me. Of course, it sounds like her classic dry humor and a jab at government jobs. But.. molding someone into something that serves a larger power? Sounds very familiar.
(definitely a reach from my part, but sshh let me theorize)
Think about it. Elias was super nonchalant about what was happening in the archives at the beginning. He didn't seem completely skeptical or in denial about what was going on; he just didn't seem to care too much about it. It seemed like he knew a lot more than he was letting on, and he did.
And that's what Alice seems like to me too. So far, she plays a very neutral role in the narrative. She's just there to make sarcastic remarks and jokes, and to occassionally remind Sam not to get too curious about the entries.
Sure, Elias was not as peppy or friendly as Alice but their roles in the plot seem very similar right now. Alice could be one of the good guys (though, judging by how TMA went, i'm assuming there isn't a clear divide between the good guys and the bad guys in TMAGP either) but I just get an uneasy feeling about her.
There are already quite a few theories about her trying to isolate Sam from Colin (who is the one other person who seems to smell something suspicious) and preventing Sam from trying to find out more about the entries. I can't help but feel like Alice plays a bigger role in all of this. There must be a reason why she's the only employee who has stayed in OIAR for this long.
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bobliophage413 · 2 months
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Haven’t seen any other posts doing this but I can’t stop thinking about Celia asking if there were any things in common with which statements get read out, so I’m keeping track of which voice reads which statements and what entity I think they’re associated with for my own sick kicks.
Norris (Martin)
Episode 1 - Email about a dead spouse (End or Stranger)
Episode 3 - The man in the garden who killed his partner (Corruption)
Episode 8 - Brutal Liminalism guy (Lonely and maybe Flesh)
Chester (Jon)
Episode 1 - Forum post about Magnus Institute (Eye)
Episode 5 - Blog about evil movie (Eye)
Episode 7 - Hilltop Road charity shop (Stranger or Buried, possibly a little of all of them. It’s Hilltop Road, shit’s weird)
Episode 9 - Artefact Storage file on some dice (Web) ((i’ve seen people say this statment is the end, i disagree. it clearly deals with themes of gambling addiction and not knowing if you’re in control of your decision making. addiction falls under the web. just because there’s dice in older episodes about the end doesn’t mean dice=end))
Augustus (Jonah)
Episode 4 - Hungry violin (Slaughter) ((a note: this episode also features a character who clearly has the Eye’s power of compelling and knowing information, and has access to multiple artifacts empowered by the fears and gives one away to a (mostly) innocent child))
I’ll add to this as we go. Already sensing patterns that have me like
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blousemouse · 2 years
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So funny to me how most tma avatars have like cool entity-themed ways to murder people like mike with throwing ppl off buildings, Jane filling people with bugs, etc… but all the eye people just straight up murder people. The eye murders are all so physical for some reason!
Like tim blowing up the unknowing, Martin stabbing, Elias with his gun and notorious brutal pipe murder, Gertrude literally chopping Jan kilbride into pieces and… so many more things tbh that woman was brutal. Idk just funny to me that the beholding’s avatars (or servants or whatever) are humanized more than any other entity bc they’re the main characters but when they kill they do it SO brutally
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avatorofthelonely · 11 months
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Classism, Privilege, & TMA (synopsis)
Here’s a little content analysis for ya’ll because I think ya’ll missed some of the bigger points of tma.
It is absolutely a commentary on privilege and classism. Point blank.
There’s a reason all the major families that play a role in trying to bring about an apocalypse or have otherwise dedicated their entire blood lines to a specific entity are implicitly white and explicitly aristocratic and extremely privileged.
That includes Jonah, Peter, Simon, etc.
This is also made apparent with Leitner who — although wasn’t evil — did try to contain and control the books related to the entities. This is clear commentary on his old money and privilege and how that translated to his over inflated sense of importance and ability.
Mary Kaey is explicitly attempting to glorify her GERMAN heritage in order to hoist her own bloodline up in the esoteric community — other than saying it directly, JS cannot get more explicit about what that is about.
Just about every other avatar simply did not choose to become an avatar and often become one because of either the mistakes or desires of the aristocratic avatars (the most prominent case of this being Jonah with Jon).
JS even says that the changed world was meant to explore the horrors of our reality.
Both Selesa and Annabelle (canonically poc) fuck off on their own because of what can be summarized as “fucking with the entities too hard is rich white people shit”
This is also why I like the interpretation of Jon being Indian (which this post is getting long so I’ll summarize this) because it creates a much more fascinating interpretation on the intersection of race and classism in modern England that dates back to colonialism.
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When Gerry tells Jon, in Mag 111, “[my mother] marked me as a part of [the fears] without my understanding or consent,” there’s no way Jon doesn’t relate to this on a deeply personal level. They were both groomed into this world of terror and monsters, and neither of them really had a say in it until it was too late.
Elias loves to say that Jon “chose” his path (the path the Web and Elias himself carefully crafted for him), and the listener can of course argue how much choice he had on nearly every decision he makes in the story.
But this doesn’t detract from the intense betrayal and hurt Jon must have felt at realizing that his boss and mentor—someone Jon clearly sought to please when he got the job, someone Jon might have viewed as filling a surrogate parental role in his life, in the absence of having any family of his own—had been secretly shaping and molding him to be something that hurts and destroys on a massive scale. He didn’t understand that he was losing his humanity for the longest time, either, making it even more tragic that his conscious morally grey choices only begin late into his involvement with the Fears.
Jon knows how Gerry feels probably better than anyone alive, in this moment. And you can tell it hurts Jon so much more to know the first real friend he makes in the world of the Entities, the first kind, GOOD ally he makes he won’t be able to keep. Like fucking ships in the night
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racefortheironthrone · 6 months
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i know JJ of the Daily Bugle is famously anti Spider-Man (in most depictions due to a mix of anti vigilantism / specifically being a masked unaccountable vigilante) , but have they ever covered how the daily bugle under his tenure portrays mutants? It seems the daily bugle is supposed to be a major publication, and on one hand I can imagine JJ being critical of The X-Men, but I (hope) don't know if he's ever been anti-mutant
Generally speaking, J Jonah Jameson is an advocate of mutant rights and civil rights more generally...as long as it doesn't involve Spider-Man. Back when X-Factor were pretending to be mutant hunters, JJJ hired them to see whether Spider-Man was a mutant, but when he came up as a flatscan, Jameson immediately pivoted to writing articles accusing X-Factor of stirring up anti-mutant prejudice to make a buck.
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That's kind of the great thing about J Jonah Jameson - at his core, he's a newspaperman and he believes in using journalism to make the world a better place, with one notable exception. Which makes him a more interesting antagonist to Spider-Man, because he'll help out Peter Parker in the same breath that he tries to destroy the "wall-crawling menace."
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cult-of-the-eye · 5 months
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Some of y'all are gonna hate me for this but honestly I've been thinking about it a lot. I want to preface this with I'm not quite sure how Elias/Jonah works but from my understanding he was literally a 19th century upper middle class dude. He was most probably a coloniser. He was most probably racist. Maybe not anymore, maybe he unlearned some things through the years but he is literally an old white male corporate boss and he is bound to have some sort of internalised *bias. Maybe it's not outright "I hate poc" racism but microaggressions for sure. He's also literally evil. Like maybe being racist isn't part of his evil plan to serve the Eye but I'm sure there's some way social bias and discrimination can fit into the fears. But y'all don't wanna hear that cause then you can't say he's fuckable. You can't make your evil little meow meow jokes.
But that's not to say that I want him to be racist, I have made evil little meow meow jokes about Elias as well, I just think the fandom needs to hear this. Or at least I want to think about how racism, sexism, homophobia and such fit into the fears and the tma universe.
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lesmurples · 19 days
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(Spoilers for TMA and TMAGP below.)
Just remembered that Jonah’s desiccated original corpse was in the tunnels in TMA and had a flurry of TMAGP theories sprout in my brain. (I haven’t been in the fandom much recently, so apologies if any of this has already been said elsewhere.)
Maybe the thing coming out of the trap door in ep 10 is Jonah’s og zombie corpse? The body holding Jonah’s eyes and consciousness may have died, but in TMA it was indicated that this body needed to be killed in order to kill Jonah, or at least to kick him out of the Panopticon’s seat of power to make way for Martin. If it has any trace of life or Jonah (or just The Eye) left in it, maybe it could have slowly dragged itself up to that trap door over the years.
On that matter, maybe Elias became the new Jonah in this universe too, and that’s why Gwen is trying to learn more about this supernatural world. She either knew he had been changed, or she wants to know what happened that led to his death/disappearance after the fire - assuming that’s what happened to Elias in this world. (That or maybe Elias was also in the “gifted program” and something went terribly wrong.) something something we thought Alice was the new Tim but alas it was Gwen the whole time etc.
If Jonah was pulled from the TMA universe and isekai’ed into an ancient computer along with jmart, maybe he’s able to reach out to this parallel version of this body, possessing it to interact with the world or just puppeteering it.
On the subject of the fearsome threesome stuck in a computer, there is also the question of what “Chester”s game is, seemingly leading Sam on to fish around in the Magnus Institute ruins. Maybe his last message was a warning not to do this, but Sam seemed pretty resigned to not getting answers before that statement from artifact storage. Maybe “Chester” wanted to free a version of Jon himself from the tunnels, or maybe there’s a disconnect between the actions of “Jon” trying to lead Sam to answers and “Chester” sharing a forum thread in the first ep seemingly warning Sam to stay away from the Magnus Institute. Then again, maybe this too was trying to send Sam to the institute, since Sam seemed to have not thought about his experiences there for a long time. So maybe this whole thing really is Jon leading Sam to uncover these things, not wanting to be “another goddamn mystery,” and maybe the the thing crawling out of the basement is related to Jon. OR maybe there’s nothing stopping a trapped Jonah from using Jon’s voice for his own ends. After all, that email to Sam may have been from “Jon,” but consider that the first three letters of Jonah’s name are indeed J O N OH HO HO I SEE WHAT YOU’RE DOING JONNY, THEY CALLED ME MAD BUT I SAW THROUGH YOU THIS WHOLE TIME-
Anyway thank you for coming to my ted talk.
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its-your-mind · 3 months
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ALRIGHT IVE BEEN HOLDING ALL OF MY INSANE AND DETAILED THEORIES INSIDE FOR FOUR MONTHS AND THEY HAVE GROWN AND FESTERED INTO SOMETHING ENTIRELY THEIR OWN AND I’M MAKING THEM ALL YOUR PROBLEM NOW HERE WE GOOOOO
okay so anyway my current main theory is that Jon Martin and Jonah got schlorped into this other reality along with the fears but the way it happened led to EITHER their weird entrapment in mostly digital media (a lá the Leitners), which ALSO led to Jon and Martin and Jonah also getting stuck in whatever this equivalent of collecting fear-based stories shit is. So obvs they’re those three voices Norris (Martin), Chester (Jon), Augustus (Jonah) (Jon and Jonah are ENTIRELY guesses at present - if it is Jonah he’s the one with the v pretentious-sounding name for SURE tho) I have forgotten what those names are. Apologies.
Anyway I think it’s a weird fusion of whatever the Web was attempting with that website that collected stories, AND the role of the archive AND the creation of the panopticon by a man who was VERY. DEDICATED. TO. SORTING. AND. CATEGORIZING. So they’re collecting data, archiving stories for the Eye (Jon is still the Pupil and the Archivist, after all), but Jon and Martin prolly wanna help. Categorize. Give these people a fighting fucking chance. If I think about them too hard rn I’ll have an emotional breakdown so that’s a post for another time.
But anyway. The forced categorizing (dolls, watching / dolls, skin / all the subcategories under “Reanimation”). The voices reading them out. All of the computers and cameras and mics recording all these convos between the employees. The organization whose job is just reading and filing supernatural data and stories accurately which is important for some reason that no one can really understand or explain. Hahaha. Sounds familiar.
Anyway I’m obsessed with all of these new characters. I’m so excited to spend all of the time with them!! And be terrified of the horrors that are gonna come after them!!!!
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mikecrewsteacup · 1 year
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The un-addressed hilarity of Gertrude not realizing Eric had quit the Archives before dying. Let's recap how that got mentioned: 
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Right. So Gertrude was under the impression that Eric Delano was working on statements, presumably either transcription or researching old leads; maybe she even occasionally let them file things for fun before she'd go disorganize them herself later on. And we can assume she didn't actually keep very close tabs on them, so it's even possible if Eric had quit a week prior to his murder, she would have naturally missed it.
But...months?
I present to you the only possible explanation: that Jonah Magnus (who would have been hiding in Wright's body at the time, not Elias' yet) had to be the one frantically trying to keep Gertrude in the dark about it being possible to quit the Archives. After not interfering for the two years Eric Delano spent trying to quit — presumably he underestimated Eric the way he does Martin later on, and just didn't bother checking in on him until OH SHIT I CANT SEE ERIC WHERE DID HE GO — Jonah suddenly had a huge problem on his hands.
So please, imagine Jonah sneaking back into the Archives after dark (or just never leaving at all) and frantically rifling through Eric's desk to do his paperwork. Knowing just enough information about Eric's intended leads to pretend they'd been interviewed and take fake notes (but not TOO fake as to be suspicious! Eric was always a pretty serious and dedicated employee!). Just generally making it appear that an entire employee had not left for MULTIPLE. MONTHS. 
I know we discuss how to Jonah this show is a workplace comedy for the first like 4 seasons, but it's implied shenanigans like this that really showcase it for me. 
(Also now I can't help but wonder if Jonah is a natural at mimicking handwriting, or if Eric's notes from that period abruptly go from 'neat and tidy but modern cursive' to 'ye olde script, hastily attempting to look modern'.)
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have u ever considered that jonah magnus spent his life and more chasing divinity with the same desperation that jon rejected it with.
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Who is that standing behind Chimney in 7x6?
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Ok... for weeks I've been trying to figure out why Hen won't be at the bachelor party when it's evident from the updated promo trailer, women are present (there are two behind Eddie while he's screaming or hollering).
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Also, I want to know who that is standing behind Chimney while he's crawling on the floor. It's been speculated that it could be Jonah so... I pulled up a screenshot from 5x17 of him while Chimney was on the table.
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In the photo, Jonah's legs appear to be thinner than those shown behind Chimney in the promo.
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Something is off with the wedding and too many things aren't adding up.
For months I've been posting that I don't believe Buck ever woke up from his coma dream and I still believe it's true. It's my Buddie Crack Theory and if it's shown to be true, I'll elaborate but right now, I want to know who's trying to hurt Chimney.
Furthermore, there were a lot of things said in 7x4 that don't make any sense and I've read a couple of speculation posts that are validating the things I said about TK and how he wasn't redeemed right before 7x4 aired (linked here and here). Something is not right about all of this including how Madney's able to afford a lavish wedding when they owed the IRS $14,000.00 last season.
I have so many questions.
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Also, Maddie asked Buck and Eddie where her "husband" was and she told Margaret and Phillip she was going to find her "husband" but she'll say it before the wedding and IIRC, she's never called Chimney that before.
Doug Kendall's dead but he was alive in Buck’s coma dream so there's that but who else would want to hurt Chimney? No one comes to mind except one person and I've said I don't believe they actually ever changed. But if it is him, why does he want to get next to Chimney? On the other hand, if it's Jonah, he would be after Hen instead of Chimney, unless he has a new partner in crime instead of Lucy Donato (I never trusted her, linked here).
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I don't know but I want to figure this out because why are Buck and Eddie having the time of their lives at the bachelor party only to end up hungover but they don't even realize Chimney's missing?
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Lots of questions with no answers.
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Please note, these are my observations and interpretations of things I've noticed and it's ok if someone doesn't agree. Two different ideas can coexist about the same topic.
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just-an-enby-lemon · 3 months
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HC that Chester and Norris also don't kow who Augustus is. Both or one of them might think is Jonah, but they don't really know. They never actually heard Jonah, Is a new voice and even if Jon knew everything once is hard to think inside a computer even less to remember all that information. They are just trapped in barely existence in a Windows NT with someone who might or not be their biggest enemy and if someone were to check the secret notes encrypted in the accient notes app they would find a weird conspiracy board over "who is here with us".
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go-to-the-mirror · 9 months
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Look upon my works all ye mighty and despair.
(The following is satire, I’m going to make a bloody artist’s statement about this.)
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[ID: The Thomas Jefferson Miku Binder meme edited to be of Jonah Magnus. He’s white, with brown hair, grey eyes, a shirt that says “I met God. She’s” and then a drawing of an eye, he’s wearing a green and black bracelet, blue trousers, an eye earring, and a blue binder with a Hatsune Miku design. His info says his name is Jonah Magnus; he speaks English and French; he’s male and uses he/him pronouns; he is trans, aro, and gay; and he is over 200 years old. The additional info says: born and raised in Manchester; Jewish; dating Albrecht von Closen, Barnabus Bennet, Sampson Kempthorne, and Robert Smirke; broke up with Jonathan Fanshawe; has a crush on Jonathan Sims; used to be addicted to “drug smoothies” (cannabis, coca, mescal, morphine, heroin); flamboyant & camp. /End ID]
If you take anything at all away from this post, I want to to be that you should absolutely Not headcanon Jonah Magnus as Jewish, like ever, please for the love of god do not.
The folks on the seasons on the archives discord (esp. @jewishjon @spirallingintotheabyss and @pocketsizedquasar ) encouraged, aided, and hated with a burning passion this. Also inspired. Blame them and me. We did this as a community. They came up with drug smoothie.
Anyway, see Sahar (poketsizedquasar)’s post about Jonah Magnus and why hc-ing him as a minority is fucked up. Also, just, um, take a good long think about why headcanoning him as Jewish is the fucking worst, and you should not! Holy crap.
Finally, if Jonny Sims sees this, I am so, so sorry, but I will never tag anything so you can’t see it, because I live on the edge.
This a work of satire, inspired by a conversation, inspired by a fic that sucked. It is parodying the headcanons around Jonah Magnus — a canonical abusive, white supremacist, capitalist — by comparing him to Thomas Jefferson, who was a real life person, and was a thousand times more fucked up by virtue of being from real life, and causing harm to real people. It’s a joke, but a joke with meaning behind it, urging people to read into the themes of a show before making headcanons that are actually super bigoted.
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