#the fact that spn is ALREADY trending

[kipkiphoorayy]

feeling the tumblr ecosystem shifting and changing in the days leading up to november 5th like a storm is coming and you’re outside watching the shelf cloud blow in, the leaves flipping and it starts to smells like rain

#the fact that spn is ALREADY trending #three days ahead of time #pregaming that shit #supernatural #spn #destiel #november 5th #november 5 2020 #kip yaps #best of kip (apparently)

[orionsangel86]

Aa someone who pretty much threw away all their hope as soon as SPN cons started up again after the finale, it is a really crazy position to be in now to have to once again adjust my views and reconsider everything thats been said over the last 2.5 years.

I quit spn fandom and stopped paying attention to cast interviews because frankly:

Jared literally does nothing but spew the absolute worst most rancid takes I have ever heard to the point that I genuinely believe the man is completely deranged and has no idea about the show he filmed for 15 years

Misha has basically given up hope and stopped caring. He started off fighting to ensure people took the confession seriously, and seemed genuinely proud and passionate about ensuring people understood the love confession was legit and Cas knew exactly what he was saying, but over the years it seemed like he was broken down behind the scenes and forced to toe a company line of ambiguity for some unknown suspicious reason. Now he's back to resorting to jokes most of the time.

Jackles though, Jackles has until this point always been a fucking head fuck of a mystery. The "sexy silence" post finale. The sole interactions being with Misha and about the confession. The way he gushed about the confession shortly after it aired before the finale. Then the production company, The Winchesters, the J2 messy public fallout and cringy PR fake reassurance of love for his "brother". The fact that in every con up until this point he has kept any answers about the confession abiguous and deliberately vague - always playing both sides, always trying to keep ALL fans happy whatever they believe about the show. The attempt to explain it as Cas not feeling love the way humans do at one point (much to fandoms horror).

I admit I have joked many times about the "jackles long con" (the conspiracy theory that ever since he found out how spn has ended he has personally been on a war path to fix things and give us a satisfactory ending for Dean and Cas) but I was always in 2 minds about whether it was legit a thing. I believed he wanted to fix Dean's ending somehow yes, but I always figured Cas's story was an afterthought the same way Sam's was. I had no delusions that Jackles would legit want to give closure to the confession and give us reciprocated Destiel - whatever that may look like. It just didn't seem like a thing Jackles would want to do. Save Dean? Yes definitely. But actually make it canon that Dean is bisexual and madly in love with his angelic best friend? Even on his most Destiel friendly days I have never been able to truly believe that.

But this latest response from him at jibcon is veerrrry interesting. To plainly state that he hopes the confession is addressed. That he wants to see that. Its the first time he's ever mentioned it in non vague terms.

Look I have no hope of a fanfiction style sappy romantic destiel reunion scene in the Winchesters or whatever. But for Jensen to genuinely give a clear and thoughtful response about what he thinks that would look like, that he thinks Dean would want to talk about that, and address it, that is certainly progress beyond anything we've had from him before.

One of my friends in our group chat raised the thought of Jackles addressing the confession only to have Dean tell Cas he's sorry, but he doesn't feel the same way. THAT is a terrifying thought, but I gotta ask, would Jackles really do such a thing? He knows exactly how much Destiel means to the fans. He knows how important it is, hell, he was online watching the Nov 5th fallout along with everyone else. If it wasnt important, it wouldn't have trended above the US election. He would alienate the majority of his fanbase. Remember, he has already technically picked a side - something I thought he would never do. The Jared stans and bronlies and Destiel haters all loathe him now. They curse his name as much as Misha's ever since he dared to exclude Sam/Jared from The Winchesters. Jensen isn't an idiot, he knows who his main fanbase is, and that is proved even more obvious by The Winchesters itself, which according to my friends who watch it, is very pro Destiel. My friend described it as what SPN could have been were it not for Jared and Bob Singer - a kinder, friendlier, queerer, and more equal, show. I haven't watched it so I can't comment, but I see so many people say that this among other recent behaviours proves that Jackles is on our side.

I am of course still a bit hesitant to give him so much credit. I'm not gonna stamp him with a big HELLER FRIEND stamp like the one we stamped on Misha years ago. But I am feeling more positive towards him than I have in ages.

Ever since the confession, the official stance on Destiel seems to be to keep it as vague and ambiguous as possible. To never confirm or deny anything especially when it comes to Dean. This has been frustrating, but has kept the door open at least.

By Jackles stating today that he wants the confession addressed and even hinting that it may be in the cards sooner rather than later, tells me that a decision has possibly been made.

The ambiguity has got to go. Dean either reciprocates or he doesn't. Those are the only options available.

If, as it has so often been teased and alluded to, Cas is going to make an appearance in The Winchesters, Jackles would surely need to get Misha on board with his plans. Misha who has been firmly on the side of Destiel since day 1. Would Misha really agree to step back into Cas's shoes only to have his heart broken by a rejection from the man he loves? I don't think he would.

So surely, the only way for the confession to be addressed is to go with the other option. Full reciprocation.

Who else is there to even object anymore? Jared? Fuck that guy? Bob Singer? That old asshole has no power anymore. The CW? Maybe. I dunno what Jackles situation is with the execs and how much power he has over the Winchesters stories. But perhaps he's been able to convince them? Given the state of queer media in 2022 and how rapidly the world has moved on from tolerating CW style queerbait.

Shows like OFMD, Good Omens, The Sandman, IWTV, WWDITS, etc etc... they have proven that queer is popular. It brings in cash. The CW has always been sitting on a goldmine with Destiel, which has never really stopped being popular, even now. They were fools to not go all the way the first time around, and after the queer media boom of 2022 they look like even bigger fools. I still have my own beliefs about the circumstances that prevented a proper destiel ending (mostly to do with the business of the one star the CW were holding onto at that time and his stupid cop propoganda show) but considering all that has happened since then, were the CW given another chance to explore Destiel now, I think they'd be absolute fools not to take it.

Anyway, the point of all my rambling is this: I think I'm back on board. Laying it all out logically, if Jackles is gonna address this, he's gonna do it in the way that will be the most popular, and generate the most publicity, engagement, and ultimately, cash.

In other words: we may see yet ANOTHER "Destiel is canon" day before the decade is over.

#destiel #jackles long con #*puts on clown makeup again* #i mean it could also just NOT happen #but bringing cas into the winchesters surely means him and dean would need to interact #and that brings up the confession #so yeah #i guess that man has his hooks in me again #sigh #hope is a dangerous thing #and i have been burned before #but fuck it #hope it is

[watching-sam-and-dean-again]

So, this little ditty has been floating around in my Twitter orbit, and people’s replies are pretty much what would be expected from something like this in the SPN "Family". Before I get into some of the trends I saw, I want to note a few points I saw made along the way. One person said that Ruby should have just been one character on the last row, and Meg should be included, and I agree. I also saw someone point out that Sam and Dean shouldn’t even be on the list. I agree with that statement, too, because the show is about them, so we technically shouldn’t be able to remove either. Finally, I think there could easily be about two more rows of characters on this list to consider from, but it is what it is.

(Souce)

Anyway, let’s get back to what I found in the replies and quotes. You have a good number of people with what I consider to be pretty reasonable selections. For example, pretty much everyone gets rid of Samuel, Gordon, and Kevin. I pretty much agree with these. Kevin is fine but compared to Death (iconic), Rowena (very popular), and Sam Fucking Winchester the poor guy just can’t compete. Gordon is a murdery jerk, and Samuel is a bag of dicks. Then we have our legions removing John because, well, he gets hate from almost every side, so while I don’t agree with removing him, personally, I’m not surprised either. Many many people remove Mary, which again, is understandable for me. There is a fair amount of Castiel removal (more of my thoughts on that later). Finally, out of the more reasonable responses, a lot of people remove Ruby 2, which I have mixed feelings about.

Then we get into the ridiculous takes. More people than a show about brothers, that couldn’t even exist without Sam, chose Sam. I’m sorry but, eat shit. There ain’t no Dean if ain’t no Sam, and there ain’t no show if there ain’t no Sam. Take your AA ass or shipping delusions and go. Next, we have the people who crossed out literally everyone except for Dean (excuse me while I roll my eyes), everyone in the Winchester family except for Dean, everyone except "Dean's boyfriends" (excuse me while i roll my eyes so hard I get a migraine), and everyone but Dean and Castiel (you guys can see my response above. It starts with an "E" and ends with a "shit"). This is a bad take because besides the fact that you can’t have the show at all without Sam, you also need the Winchester family as a whole if you’re going to have Dean because so much of his character is informed by them. Finally, we have the people who crossed out everyone except for Sam. Honestly, I think this was done more in response to the hellers and AAs, but, come on guys, the show wouldn’t work with just Sam either. And as much as I love him, he isn’t the only good or necessary character.

Anyway, this got me overthinking thinking about my own responses, and I realized that it wasn’t that easy for me to pick. I ended up having to think of this "assignment" from a few angles: who is least necessary to the story, who overstays their welcome the longest, and who just annoys me? Now, it wasn’t always clear which criteria the people who answered on Twitter were using, but most seemed to be looking at it from one of these angles.

So, I’m going to put my responses from each of these angles under the cut, as well as some of my reasoning (because I’m me and I can’t just do the activity WITHOUT some kind of commentary on it … sorry). So, if you’re interested, please do see my thoughts below. If you’re not interested, but want to do this for yourself, feel free to use the image I posted above, but just include the source if you post it.

First, while I really enjoy Benny, I had to remove him in this case because I don’t think he fundamentally changes Dean or Sam. He come between them, yes, but it’s not even his fault that he does, rather it’s because of Sam and Dean's own issues. Purgatory effects Dean more than Benny. Second, I already said Samuel is a bag of dicks, and I’ll stick to that. Mitch seems like a sweetheart, but Grandaddy Winchester sucks. Third, While Bella is a good foil for the boys in Season 3, and the show could have done more with her character, she doesn’t have a lot of impact on the greater scheme of things. Fourth, Kevin does have a place in the plot as a prophet, but the other two play a more significant role in either their impact on the boys or the plot (and I wasn’t crossing off Sam). Finally, I had to chose Gordon, even though I like how he is used in Seasons 2 and 3, Ruby and Crowley have more lasting impact on the boys and the story overall.

A lot of characters are either underutilized on Supernatural, or they stay so long that there isn’t anything left to do with their character but make them worse. My first pick is Mary for this because, while I don’t mind the idea of bringing her back in theory, the execution was … lacking. I don’t think her coming back did a lot for her character. Yes we get to see Dean tell her he loves her and hates her, and we get to see her ignore Sam unless he’s supporting her, and we get to see her put literally everyone before her boys, but … well, you get my point, I think. I chose Samuel because after him being in the story in "In The Beginning", I don’t love how the show used him, and The Campbells story line didn’t amount to much. Third, both Lucifer and Castiel overstayed their welcome in similar ways, for me. Both had a couple of natural end points that the show could have just stuck with: Luficer/Nick in Season 5, Season 7 when Sam stopped hallucinating, and at the end of Season 13; and Cass in Season 7 and at the end of Season 12. Both of their stories could have had stronger finishes if ended more definitively sooner. If I had to pick, I think Nick in Season 14 is the most egregious over staying of an SPN character's welcome. Forth, I chose Rowena not because she stayed too late into the show exactly, but because she has some side story and early story beats that I wasn’t very invested in. Finally, it pains me, but I have to say from this list, that Crowley outstayed his welcome the longest. Or rather, the writers stopped knowing what to do with his character, wasted at least a season on bad side plots with him, then had the character go out on a whimper.

Okay, here’s my last criterion for this simple little twitter activity. First, I’ve seen a lot of people cross of Lisa with relish, but honestly, I think she was a pretty decent person and put up with quite a lot. And it was so real of her to know the score: "As soon as Sam walked back through that door, I knew it was over…" (or something like that). I’ve also seen people say that Dean's "one who got away" should have been Casey, and while I think that’s a fair argument, Cassy pretty much told him to beat it in Season 1. Anyway, I chose Mary here for the reasons described in the last section, and for her generally sulky demeanor and ignoring of Sam. Second, sorry, Samuel, but for reasons already discussed, plus you trying to trade your grandson's lives to a demon, you gotta go. Third, we have Lucifer and Cass once more sharing my ire. If we are talking Season 12 Lucy, or who-gives-a-shit-about-this-storyline Nick, than Mark P has to go. However, if we are talking only late seasons Castiel, he has to go for the crimes of becoming an under-powered angel, letting Sam get killed by mutant vamps and not caring at all, and becoming a generally boring simp. It’s a toss up. Fourth, Kevin, I’m sorry, I’m adding fuel to any fans out there campaigning for "justice for Kevin." I don’t dislike Kevin, I just Like OG Death and later seasons Rowena more. Finally, this might be controversial, but I like most of Gordon's episodes and I like what he reveals about Sam and Dean. The character is a jerk, but I like how he’s used. Also, I picked the original Ruby, even though I think she’s stronger than Gen acting-wise because her characterization of her is so no-nonsense and harsh, that I wouldn’t have bought Sam being manipulated by her in the same way as Gen's Ruby. I can’t see Sam and that version of Ruby hooking up or her working him the in the same way.

Anyway, if you actually read this far, many thanks. I know these kinds of things don’t interest everyone, but there is a little meta commentary mixed in here.

If anyone is interested in participating, I’d love to see who you would eliminate and for what reasons! Are there any characters not pictured who you would remove? Why?

#supernatural #spn meta #anti hellers #anti AAs #Sam hate not welcom #Dean hate not welcome #which character would you remove from each row and why? #what characters would you remove from the show (not Sam or Dean)? #castiel critical

[dean-is-love]

the fifth is really going to hit hard huh

#i mean the fact that spn is already trending #skdhjski #insane #bee's incoherent rambling

[lewishamil10n]

the year is 2050. j2 are at a con to talk about their classic show spn. someone asks a question about sam and dean's relationship, and jensen talks at length about how much dean loves sam and how he thought his speech in the barn scene reflected that perfectly. jared talks about how difficult it was for sam to live without dean. they agree that the boys had a good life together before dean's death, and that their reunion in heaven is the perfect ending for them.

on twitter, a user with a blue and green heart in their username tweets:

haha jackles can pretend all he wants, we all know he hates the finale!! destiheller king 💚💙

another replies:

haha #SexySilence

a third answers:

where are the destiel tapes!! someone violate jensen's privacy and leak them already!

a fourth person says:

i can't wait for jensen to finally be free of his abusive PR friendship so he can be his authentic self with mish #CocklesForever

a fifth person mourns for a group they don't really care about, saying:

it's the queer kids who watched spn that i really feel awful for. what they did was the peak of homophobia and the worst thing that queer people have ever been through #TheySilencedYou

someone adds:

i bet it's jared's fault :/ he's been holding misha back forever, we all know he's always been insanely jealous.

the other five agree.

meanwhile, none of this changes the fact that sam and dean are canon soulmates, who lived out their semi-retirement domestic fantasies in the bunker after years of thinking they could never have that kind of peace. j2 are still attached at the hip, spending insane amounts of time together. they have long since stopped pretending to acknowledge misha's existence, even though every now and then he still tweets inappropriate things about jensen. all six of his remaining fans are delighted by this but no one else cares. jared has gone on to star in several successful shows, and even a few movies. jensen directs all of them. their spin-off short series about sam and dean in heaven was a massive hit.

the twitter user with the hearts in their username posts:

i can't believe jensen would just abandon mish like this :/ that man literally only cares about j*red, it's disgusting :/

the other five agree. they make plans to get #MishaForPresident trending, using every sock account they have at their disposal. it works for five whole minutes, and they begin bombarding the white house account with spam, asking when they'll be swearing misha in. misha tweets:

I'd be a great President, especially with my First Lady at my side @jensenackles

all six of his fans cheer. jensen doesn't respond, because he permablocked misha on twitter after The Great Destihell Shitfest of 2026. he goes on a nice dinner date with jared and posts pictures, with the caption:

Date Night with my boy.

jared likes it immediately and comments:

looking great for a dude pushin' 100! love you brother ❤️

twitter is in uproar. INCEST, they shout. someone tweets:

I CAN'T BELIEVE THEY'RE STILL PANDERING TO THOSE GROSS WINCESTIES UGH I'M SO SICK OF THIS. THEY ALWAYS DO THIS!!!

they are comforted by misha, who posts a link to his stands shop where he's selling a t-shirt with the words LOVE WINS written in feathers over a trenchcoat. a reply arrives immediately:

the only real ally 💚💙 fuck those homophobic assholes, who needs them anyway!!

it receives five likes.

on november 19, jensen posts the barn scene. jared posts the bridge reunion. they talk about how much spn means to them and how much they still care about sam and dean. they don't mention misha at all, even when he posts his own crying face from his final scene.

the more things change, the more they stay the same.

#this was supposed to be a short snarky post and it became a monster lmao #j2 #anti destiel #anti destihellers #anti misha collins #naila.txt #salt tag #shitposting #this is inspired by hellers STILL gaslighting themselves into believing jensen is one of them #even after jensen talked at length abt the finale lol which he clearly doesn't hate #such stupidity can only inspire mockery

[wigglebox]

I am sad that CMP’s first outing has gotten such a negative immediate reaction 😞 I hope they can weather the storm.

[i vented sorry]

Yeah, I was very sad yesterday seeing everyone do that. Especially the secondhand embaressment. This is this production company's first big thing, in the SPN universe, and when you have the actor of that universe suddenly turn producer to make more content — folks were going to write articles and the twitter descriptions it's just like —

I feel like the fandom showed its ass yesterday. No one is saying folks have to be jazzed but the reaction, in my opinion, was childish and very rude. Many things that the fandom told each other over the last several months, telling each other how much we trust Jensen with anything SPN related, how much we began to understand his respect for the material etc etc just flew out the window as soon as folks saw 'John Winchester'.

Folks I thought of as rational thinkers, level headed, not dramarific or one for over reactions for SPN things over the years were very quick to get morose, negative, and bemoan the fact this isn't a continuation with destiel attatched to it. There were also the concerns over trying to paint John as a "good man", which, there's no way to make that assumption with any facts behind it. It's just emotions replacing facts in my opinion.

It's like the article was published, people blinked, and forgot everything.

It takes two seconds of thought to understand where this is coming from, what may come of it, and what benefits it'd have to both CMP and to just the SPN universe in general.

But some people wanted to get memes out, wanted to get the quip out, wanted to get the viral tweet or tumblr post, wanted to sit on their rockers and just complain.

I understand some of the criticisms, and they are founded — after the content begins and you actually see something amiss with it.

Right now however, there is no content to judge. You have nothing. It's just emotions being presented as facts in folks' heads which led to SUCH an embaressing twitter blurb being written — I honestly wanted to cry when I read that.

There was no reason for that reaction. Not the caution, but the meanness that came from some fans.

I'm chalking it up to old bitter fans, new bitter fans, fans who don't know who Robbie is, fans who still for some reason think Jensen is a homophobe, fans who wanted to be "right" and were embaressed when they weren't ("right" being "oooh they're going to come out with a continuation as their first SPN project").

I will admit myself when I first saw it I went "wait... what?"

But I got over it, I sat down with myself, and gave a minute of thought to it to understand 1) why we're starting with this 2) what can come of it and 3) what are the good things we're already seeing like Robbie Thompson being involved.

I'm not saying I'm better than others who had their reservations, because this fandom did get put through the wringer last November and a few times before that. I understand the hesitancy. I understand the caution.

But what I did not understand were the trending comments that put Jensen and Dee on blast. I did not understand people complaining to them. I did not understand people celebrating that the twitter blurb made us look like idiots.

Sorry I really lost myself in all of that. I'm really tired, I've been awake since 3 a.m. and had no sleep lol.

To answer your thing: I think Jensen and Dee will actually weather it.

Because even though I just said what I said, the ball is actually in their court, and I do believe they'll do some magic. Bad press around a series only sticks around if it is, in fact, a bad series.

It took less than a night talking about the potential of the show not from only me but from several others as well for other fans to pause and maybe give this a cautious optimism.

Imagine if this series comes and it is something amazing (which, I think it will be good. yes yes CW this and CW that but whatever. It is what it is).

I think we as a fandom forget that SPN means just as much to Jensen as it does to us (most of us — some of "fans" are still extremely bitter or just weird and don't actually watch or care about the show and only want to criticize so... idk what they are doing here).

And it's in that care, in watching the last two years of interviews of him talking about a continuation, him voicing his excitement in 2018 over wanting to help tell the Wayward Sister story, his "I have Dean", his insistence that nothing stays dead on SPN, his overall love and devotion for the show, for the crew, for the cast that I personally think he will 1) push through this and show us just what he can do and 2) prove the trust we had in him was justified.

And I do trust him, and Dee, and Robbie, and everyone else involved in making this. I think their drive is going to push through this weirdly annoying reaction that spawned.

Their love and passion and respect for the material I think will give us something very special, and I think they know that as well!

Never forget:

#spn fandom #slight negativity bl #salt #i'm sorry i don't like talking like this on my blog #especially post finale i'm trying my hardest to maintain that positivity #but fandom needs to take a deep breath sometimes #and not just fly off the cuff #this happened all the time with promos and shit during the show #i remembered the absolute PANICK when rowena was introduced thinking she was a female love interest for dean #despite him not having one for years by that point #so it's like #...just because something isn't exactly how it is in your head doesn't mean it's bad #it just means folks have different stories they want to tell and how they want to tell them #i'm sorry i forget the con that last image was from

[quillquiver]

On SPN, Burying Your Gays, and Being Heard

I am shaking, I feel sick, I feel like I’m insane. And did I run a little wild with the theories? You bet. But you know what didn’t help? The botched clusterfuck that was this entire goddamn finale debacle. How was I supposed to believe anything they said in panels when M&G dialogue would leak saying the exact opposite? How was I supposed to grieve and move on when there was nothing from the cast and crew? Nobody said anything! And any info leaked just destabilized what we already knew or directly contradicted what we’d been told. In light of that, how was I supposed to trust anything anyone said? One rogue translator reciprocated the love confession and I was practically sold, because there were so many questions surrounding the English text that this was something good, something that logically fit, and something I wanted to hold onto. 

Because they hurt me. This is about so much more than one episode or a ship; for years queer fans have seen ourselves in these characters and been told that we were crazy. That we were reading too much into it. I’m not sure how people get upset and offended when a storyline that doesn’t exist... doesn’t exist! said Guy Bee (2013). And then, after all of that, they turned around and said magnanimously, you have your version, I have mine... and that’s okay. But it’s not okay. It’s not okay, because that doesn’t erase what came before - that doesn’t erase the baiting and the gaslighting, and that invalidates everything we felt in the time leading up to that episode. It gave them an open window for all the subtext that came after. It allowed them to brush us off.

And then we got Cas’s love confession. I watched that scene about 500 times. Added to the rest of the season - to the fandom avatar being presented as successful and intelligent, to arc being the death of the author - I felt seen. Really seen, by a show that made it its mission to erase me. I had been okay with Cas dying at first because I had been sure the romance arc would carry through. I had been convinced that after everything, there was no way they would give that to us and then take it away.

But they did, because this is Supernatural. To anyone saying this is not bury your gays, I implore you to read up on the Hays Code. This link is to an amazing queer history podcast and the episode that covers it. In short, the Hays Code was a legal document that came about in 20th Century Hollywood during the puritanical war on the American entertainment industry,  and it stipulated what was not allowed on screen. Not all of it was queer - there’s a whole section about kissing - but what the Code is most remembered for is that queerness was not allowed on screen. But queer people are resilient, and so they started testing the waters... and it turned out that you could in fact code queerness into a narrative, as long as it was subtextual, or as long as the queer character died/was punished, or both. The point is that the character is not allowed to live their truth openly. They are buried, either in the ground or punished in the narrative. The former is normally what we refer to these days, because the latter just doesn’t really happen anymore.

Until Supernatural. 

Castiel is immediately punished for speaking his truth - and please don’t tell me he leveraged that punishment and so he had agency. Literally the only thing that could make him happy was confessing his feelings, and so the Empty deal was directly related to this idea of queerness-as-punishment. That being said, Bobo wrote a beautiful scene. Cas’s confession was a love letter to queerness and coming out... but everything that came after buried him. Castiel may have ended the series alive but he was effectively written out of the last two episodes, and that means that he actually never really got to live his truth. He was silenced by the narrative - that is punishment. 

Dean is a whole other can of worms. Does one rogue translator confirm canon bi!Dean? Or do we have to read our own version of the text? The fact that we even have to ask these questions firmly places us in the realm of queerbaiting. Were the writers trying to get bi!Dean approved but were unable to? I have no idea, but queerbaiting requires proof that the writers encouraged a reading they had no intent of following through on, and we certainly don’t lack in evidence of that. Not from this writers room, but from those of previous eras. Did these writers try? They might have, but the funny thing about queerbaiting discourse is that there has never been a show to bait this long, and I’m making the call that even if you tried at the end, you baited me with half the ship and all the years that came before. 

Of course, the narrative leaves open the possibility of bi!Dean so if you do read the show that way, that means Dean also falls into the bury your gays category; if you read the show this way - which many of us do - the mere suggestion that Dean Winchester was bisexual was enough to punish him. And he was punished. We’ve all written extensively on this, but he was given a random death, on a case his father never finished. All that growth, all that time spent having him accept himself, love himself, that was all taken away. He died the way he always thought he would: as a tool, in service of his father, protecting his brother. He had always believed he’d been a body to throw on the sword and in the end that’s all he was. And when he gets to Heaven? He’s also silenced. He barely speaks in the episode except to monologue during his death, and that is 100% Sam-centric. He is scared. 

It was horrific to watch. I sobbed so hard my roommate was seriously concerned. 

I had been fully prepared for Supernatural to end disappointingly. I had figured everything would end with a huge heaven reunion because white, straight, cis-male S&F writers love the idea of death as a reward, but instead of being disappointed I felt like I had witnessed a slaughter. Every single one of the queer themes intrinsic to the show: found family, resilience, speaking your truth... were gone. And I know we’ve talked about this too, but it bears repeating, because in doing this, in writing the queerness out of its narrative, Supernatural effectively looked every one of us queer folx in the eye and said: you are not important. You don’t matter. All of that stuff that came before is all good and well, but what really matters at the end of all things is blood family. It’s two brothers in a car. Life sucks but at least we get to die and go to paradise - real paradise, that your angel buddy died for and then made for you and who we never hear from again.

I felt insane. I felt cheated. I felt humiliated. I felt devastated. I still feel all those things, but listen to me. You have been heard. Not by Misha Collins, who is a great guy, but doesn’t get it. Not by Jensen Ackles, who is a similarly great guy, but also just doesn’t understand. And not by anyone else who worked on this show. 

You know who heard you? Me. The people who follow me. The people who follow you. We saw each other, and heard each other, and we gave each other a leg up. We made memes. We wrote fic. We drew fanart. We made gifs. All for ourselves and all for each other. We broke Tumblr multiple times. We donated over $60,000 USD to multiple different causes. We got multiple hashtags trending at multiple different points, and today kept it up because we demanded answers and then we got them. There were at least 5 articles written about the show today. We made that happen. We made people listen. 

Supernatural didn’t deserve me, and it didn’t deserve you. It didn’t deserve Dean. It didn’t deserve Cas. It didn’t deserve Misha and Jensen. But this show ended with a bleak, awful message and we turned around and showed them that love is loud. So what about all of this is real?

We are.

#alex talks #spngate #archived #this was very therapeutic #and i honestly don't know if i will ever be able to love something like this again #because i have been burned oh man #but this fandom is amazing #and i am proud to be a part of it #and i am not going anywhere #journaling #15x18 #15x19 #15x20 #castiel #dean winchester #destiel

[incarnateirony]

Hi!)

I just recently joined your fandom, and I'm not a native speaker, so I don't always understand how to determine if the information is reliable. but I'm used to drawing conclusions only after listening to the arguments of all sides.

I was just looking for all sorts of nonsense on hashtags and accidentally came across an old article (apparently j2), where it says that before the start of season 9, a survey was conducted whether viewers wanted a big return of Cas, and most responded with ridicule. There was also about the fact that episodes with his participation are less appreciated and viewed (although I am almost 100% sure that I have seen the opposite statistics somewhere), and in general he is absolutely not popular among fans. That his panel doesn't sell tickets and stuff. I wanted to ask you, as a person who knows more about statistics and spn. Is it really so. because I just refuse to love the world that Cas doesn't love.

I will be very grateful if you decide to answer this question.

P.s. I really like your blog.

OK, so like. No?

That's the shortform answer since you struggle with language. Now the longform.

This was a desperate ploy of their already failed Silent Majority. After Gamble tanked out S7, she brought Cas back after swearing not to. Immediately during the S7 finale, they started planning ways to prove what you said, but they ran into issues. Mostly, that they couldn't get any sizeable amount of people to join, because they were full of horse shit, even after they tried to rebrand it on the outside as "preferring" brother content rather than wanting Cas gone. They capped at 240 participants, despite aggravated efforts on their part.

Then, while they swore Cas being back would destroy it, Carver era soared and flew back out of the toilet Gamble almost got it cancelled in. S8 went against all industry trends upward, then S9 hit the highest respective industry value to date. There's a reason Jim Michaels and Beaver called them idiots and blocked them.

Then, around S10, the fandom census was run and, yet again, among 10,000 tested individual IPs, only 240 people said "prefer sam and dean", and of those 240 people, if you break down their voting through the hundreds of questions, just like the failed Silent Majority, a bunch were just people not aware of what that actually *meant* and still at least neutral or vaguely positive to Castiel as a character, just brother-leaning. And, just like the Silent Majority, there were only about 45 dedicated antis total. Which, I'm sure you recognize, is a goddamn sliver in this fandom.

There is no open, widely cast net demographic test or poll that gives them what they want. Sometimes they'd run it on their own niche sites, or twitters, while blocking out anyone they could find they disagreed with--and sometimes they still lost.

Also: Re ratings: The opposite is true. There was an S8-10 episode marketing and character presence test that showed Castiel episodes performed by base 3% better than eps without him, 6% better if it was promoted as such, and up to 9% better if the episode was promoed with "Dean & Cas" content specifically. These numbers also translated to my own study on The Castiel Effect years later, which I pulled episodes from S12-14. This stuff is ALL in my years of the #demographics tag, so feel free to dig. I even did a version of the Cas Effect where I penalized out any "special" episodes that may have given him a boost, and premieres and finales for their boost, and just stuck his averages with generally tepid episodes between and he STILL. CAME. OUT. HIGHER.

They say a lot of things they want really bad to make true, but they just don't get it. The "lower ratings" point came from them not understanding industry Y2Y decline, and when I explained how that worked they spent years crowing something deranged about "baseball stats" because the words "league average" confused them. Then, ofc, when Walker crashed out by 66% in the same year it aired, they screamed "Y2Y decline", because they were still too busy drooling on themselves to recognize it was the same TV year, and thus not Y2Y decline, and they just hoped everyone buried their bad argument. They're literally morons trying to google anything they can look up to use as an argument without even remotely understanding any of the content they're entering into the argument, they're just there to argue and pretend it's valid. They don't even understand/believe a damn point they're using (hence the Y2Y opinion flip of convenience), it's just there to make noise so they can feel better about themselves.

Like. lmao. idk what to say beyond "this point couldn't be more wrong or less corroborated there is no meaningful data point that matches up with this theory"

[ikimaru]

Sorry, european here, what the HELL happened?????? I went to school for o n e d a y and suddenly tumblr is exploding pls explain

I’m also european but I was still awake at the time then got some sleep and just came back hAHA

u probably already found out by now but there was a new spn episode ft Cas confessing his love to Dean and he got sent to the empty right after (ppl are calling it super hell) so there’s a ton of people reacting to that

happened around the same time as Putin was said to be (allegedly) stepping down, both things combined were trending on twitter under politics, lots of memes, it’s like 2012 all over again, truly bringing all of tumblr together lmaoo

also the fact this happened in addition to all the chaos that was already taking place is just hilarious, well I hope that explains it! 8′)

#Sunnyasks #supernatural #spoilers

[kamipixel]

On the, tiring, subject of “queerbaiting” in Good Omens

I’m aware the lack of nuance on this website is well known by now, but sometimes I still have to ask a very loud and very confused “what?” at some of the takes I see on here. Since Good Omens came out over a year ago, every few months, like clockwork, I inevitably see a post talking about how this show is just really “queerbaiting”, or “queer rep lite”, or “bad queer rep” (the sentence “SPN and Good Omens are just as bad” comes to mind as a recent example. Please note that this is not an invitation to bash on SPN). And not only do I have to sigh, because I guess people still haven’t learned what “queerbaiting” means (and I’ve no intention to define it here, there are so many posts on the subject already), but I also have to sigh because, inevitably, there’s always some lovely bout of queerphobia (or internalised queerphobia) that comes prepackaged with these takes.

The language used in these posts is always very “woke”, as the kids would say, and everything is all laid out much more comprehensively than I could ever do. And every time, it’s always an incredible slap to the face. And I’m so incredibly tired of seeing it that I figured, at this point, might as well write my piece on this mess and address what I’ve seen.

I’ve no intention of naming names and putting anyone on blast because that’s not what I’m here for so I’ll paraphrase very simply. These posts always say something to the effect of “the characters aren’t explicitly, canonically, queer, meaning this is queerbaiting”. And yes, said this way, well, why would I ever disagree? Don’t I want confirmed queer representation? And sure, of course I do. But I’m pretty sure that most queer people whose identities are a bit of a moutful, like mine, could tell you that this isn’t what this phrase really mean.

Because what these posts forget to mention is that by “explicit” they mean: “these characters are in a romantic/sexual relationship on screen, these characters kiss (on the mouth) on screen, these characters mention their orientation on screen, these characters say “I love you” in a romantic way on screen...”

Because what these posts forget to mention is that by “queer” they mean: “these specific letters in the LGBT+ alphabet soup and nothing else.”

And so I’ll ignore the fact that most of these arguments brought up when talking of “explicit rep” would feel, to me, incredibly out of character for Aziraphale and Crowley in the context of the show and instead say this for a moment: Good Omens should have the queer rep that I want. Yes, specifically me and only me. I’m going to watch the show again and if Aziraphale and Crowley’s identities are not explicitly moulded to what I want, I’ll make a second post and tell everyone I’ve been led on and that this is just queerbaiting, really.

“Well why the hell should this queer rep fit only what you want to see?” you may rightfully ask. “There so many queer experiences that differ from yours.”

And I’ll tell you: “oh it absolutely shouldn’t, but this is exactly what these posts are insinuating, isn’t it? Only in a very reasonable manner, and with very nice words indeed.”

Let me tell you three things about myself for a moment. I’m aromantic and don’t care much for romantic relationships, I dislike kisses on the mouth very much, and for complicated reasons it took me years before I openly told my girlfriend I loved her.

Curious, isn’t it? That’s the exact opposite of what these queerbaiting posts say I should want to see.

Let me tell you one last thing about myself. I cried when I first watched Good Omens because for the first time ever, I saw characters and a relationship in mainstream media I could identify with.

Not to mention that apparently, I guess, to the people who write these posts, gender doesn’t exist anymore either. Was Crowley switching up his gender expression a whole lot, not “explicit” enough? Or did no one think it mattered because it wasn’t a romantic/sexual orientation? Have we really gone back to the “if they’re not gay nothing else counts” takes now? Really?

So next time I see someone whine about queerbaiting and Aziraphale and Crowley not being “confirmed” gay, or in a romantic relationship, I think I’ll just laugh and say: “why did you think they were? Where did you even get that impression?”

Honestly I have a lot more to say on all of this, but I’m not quite sure how to write it so I suppose this will do for now.

I really do understand the frustration with shows that give you nothing but crumbs, and I know it’s tempting to buy into the whole “all or nothing” trend with queer rep that tumblr likes to push. And It's understandable to be disappointed by the lack of representation you want to see. And you can make as much art, and headcanons, and posts, and stories as you want to fill that gap. And you're free to find other shows that suit you better or make your own thing as well. But don't come to my door crying wolf, wrongfully saying that Good Omens is “bad rep” or “queerbaiting”, and essentially spit in my face by telling me my idea of representation isn't queer enough. That I’m not queer enough.

#good omens #queerbaiting #long post #fandom nonsense i guess #thanks for coming to my tedtalk #i'm so tired you guys #i write stuff sometimes #i didn't have this on my spn ending consequences bingo but i guess here we are #again...

[onrainynights]

why you can't compare buddie to destiel (from someone who ships both)

this is kind of addressing the recent negativity in the buddie tag, but it's also a collection of my thoughts and reasoning for being buddie-positive despite my experiences with destiel and spn in general. the text of 911 is not really discussed at all, and this is relatively spoiler-free, so if you're thinking of watching 911 I encourage you to read it. if you haven't seen both shows it probably won't make perfect sense, but I wrote this with spn fans who haven't seen 911 in mind, since that's most of my followers (and also seems to be where much of the negativity was coming from) pretty long post under the cut to save your dash

I just want to prepare y'all for the fact that buddie could be the slow burn will they/won't they mlm romance we've been waiting for practically forever.

at this point it's not fair to call it queerbait because where their relationship is now fits the characters and their development. this is not like destiel, where there were many moments over the years that could've ended with them getting together and it would've made sense with the story. buddie right now is in this sweet, wholesome pre-relationship kind of place, which on its own is a compelling dynamic and so fun and good to see. a resolution of it right now would feel out of character—they both still have some development to do before that would feel natural. and so, I don't think we can really call it queerbaiting unless the characters get to that point and there is still no resolution.

also I'd like to point out the overall positivity from the cast when it comes to buddie. both Eddie's and Buck's actors have said (I'm paraphrasing cast statements in this post unless they are in quotations) positive things about the pairing, and Buck's actor has said that he likes the interpretation of Buck as queer, and he would be happy if the writers took his character in that direction. also Eddie's actor with "that's what they all say" when buddie was referred to as a "bromance". Jennifer Love Hewitt, who plays Buck's sister (another main character), is very supportive of buddie, saying she's "rooting for it", that it would be "amazing", she doesn't "see how it couldn't happen one day". this was in response to hearing that a fan insists Buck and Eddie will be a couple. She flat-out said "I think so, too." She jokes about buddie with Buck's and Eddie's actors all the time. Also, my favorite bit from the video of her saying all this, "Let's manifest it together!"

It's safe to say this is a VERY different environment to spn. I don't think I've ever seen a cast this positive about a show's main non-canon queer ship before. NEVER. I think it's safe to say that if/when buddie is canonized, the cast will be just as excited as the fans—at least JLH will be! Add into the fact that the show's PR seems to be leaning into bi buck and buddie right now, it's a VERY different vibe than spn had, definitely. There's no gaslighting of the fans here, at least not that I've seen. also, although 911 has a large casual viewership, I think it's safe to say the GA would not be upset by buddie—there are only 3 serious, long-term romantic relationships involving main characters in this show, and one of them is a lesbian marriage with two children. And yes, the characters are shown being lesbians, it's not just a stated fact; the audience is privy to their relationship (and their interactions with their adorable kids). I think it's safe to say that buddie would go over well with the fans, even the casual viewers (of which there are many). buddie doesn't seem to be a huge divider in fandom like destiel is, either. reactions generally seem to be either "I ship it" or "I don't care either way."

Also I'd like to point out that while yes, it's possible that buddie is only bait (which would be disappointing), there's a reason queerbaiting works. people WANT to be queerbaited, because it's nearly indistinguishable from a slow burn will they/won't they queer romance. queerbaiting allows fans to make theories, create fan content (including fic), and keeps them engaged with the dynamic and the show. fans who are vulnerable to queerbaiting want a slow burn will they/won't they queer romance, which is currently an almost completely untapped market. spn could've tapped it, but despite the huge fandom they did not. there are SO MANY people outside of spn fandom who want a slow burn mlm romance, one that keeps the audience guessing, one that's will they/won't they, one that is not guaranteed, and that is why queerbaiting works so well. the audience doesn't just want the payoff, they also want the build-up. the longer the build-up, the higher the payoff, and the suspense of the build-up is gone if you know from the start that the payoff is definitely coming. that's part of why malec from shadowhunters didn't fully tap this market—there was no question of if, only the question of when (which wasn't really a question either, given there was an episode in season 1 literally titled "malec" when they got together.) the characters were always queer, the show being an adaptation of a book series where they were in a relationship and eventually had children together.

this was why November 5th was such a big deal—fans were so far past the will they/won't they aspect of destiel, firmly believing that destiel would always end as a "won't they" and not a "will they" that when cas confessed his romantic love for dean, destiel trended on Twitter over the US election. you all know that story, but maybe not everyone reading this knows that after Nov. 5 there was a case of hundreds if not thousands of spn fans experiencing love sickness because of the confession scene. the payoff of making destiel fully canon (and reciprocated, in English) would've been huge. fans would've been throwing their money at the c/w.

which leads me to the possibility (this is not at all me saying that I think this happened or even is likely, just that it's one possibility that /could/ have happened) that buddie started as bait, that the writers never intended for them to be a couple, but saw fan reactions to buddie during season 2 and started to lean into it in season 3 (and 4 so far, but it just started so I don't want to make any generalized statements about it) possibly still as bait or maybe not deciding yet if they'll go anywhere with it. and then maybe they saw destiel trending on November 5th, realized just how BIG the market for a slow burn will they/won't they mlm romance is, and said "hey, we already have the foundations for one of those. why not go for it and draw in all those viewers who clearly want one so badly?"

if buddie goes canon, because the cast and PR have been so positive about it, unlike spn, and because of the text of the show itself, the show's creatives could VERY EASILY claim that they were never baiting, that it was all an intentional slow burn will they/won't they romance from the beginning, and most people would believe them; there isn't really any evidence to the contrary, although I am sure there would be at least a few fans convinced it started as queerbaiting, and there might not be any evidence to refute that, either.

the point is that 911 is currently sitting on a gold mine. if they play their cards right, and execute buddie well, they will monopolize this market that old straight white men serving as network executives have failed so far to really tap into. they queerbait without the payoff, which gives the show a reputation among those in the market who haven't seen it, guaranteeing they will never watch it. shows in this vein: sherlock (huge reputation for queerbaiting and a finale fans didn't like) and spn (huge reputation for queerbaiting and a finale fans didn't like). spn got so, so close with cas's confession but then continued to gaslight its fans, and PR did not lean into destiel AT ALL. if 911 did buddie? the PR team would be all over it. it would be a moneymaker, big time, and Fox knows it. if buddie, or even just bi buck, went canon, tumblr would be all over it. viewership for the show, which is already impressive, would skyrocket. 911 would monopolize this market, because fans wary of queerbaiting would watch it with the knowledge that the payoff is there, and there really wouldn't be a competitor until other shows saw the success of buddie and followed suit with their own pairings, and given the fact that the market specifically wants /slow burn/ queer romances, that might take a couple years. that puts 911 in a really good position, where suddenly the fandom of the show, not just the GA, is very large and likely very dedicated to the show. the success of canon buddie might just change the landscape of TV in the coming years, showing execs that while queerbaiting does work, actually going through with it is really where the money is. 911 would not just monopolize the market for a while; it would pioneer it.

if buddie never goes canon, I would probably be a bit disappointed at the wasted potential, but unless the characters get to that point where canon buddie seems like the most logical outcome and they /don't/ go for it, I won't be truly upset because I don't think it's fair to claim its queerbaiting until then. I can't tell you how likely it is that buddie will be canon at some point, but it seems FAR more likely than destiel /ever/ did, and we ended up getting cas's confession in the end. I have hope, despite being hurt so badly by spn. 911 is a genuinely great show with some fantastic writing, and they don't leave chekov's gun unfired, unlike spn.

really, it comes down to this: if Jennifer Love Hewitt is allowed to clown for buddie, then so am I, and I'll enjoy this show—which is amazing even without canon buddie—while I apply my clown makeup.

#9-1-1 #spn #buddie #tagging as #destiel #so anyone with that tag blacklisted can avoid this post #unfortunately I have seen w/ncest shippers in the buddie tag so that's just a precaution so I don't get attacked #posts for puck #I might add more to this later who knows but I think this is a pretty good collection of my thoughts #buddie positivity #911natural

[sinclarsupremacy]

THE FACT THAT SPN IS #1 ON TRENDING ALREADY WHAJAHSK something something god works fast hellers work faster

#salute to y’all #we did it boys (gn) #spn #nov 5th

[theyarebothgunshot]

ROSE I AM FREAKING OUT HAVE YOU SEEN THE PREQUEL STUFF???? WHAT IS GOING ON, my god... I was literally about to go to sleep, decided to check Tumblr one last time and see this.... what WHAT!! WHATTTT!!!!!! I don't even know if this is good bad or what but just JENSEN IS PRODUCING A SUPERNATURAL PREQUEL AND DEAN'S GONNA BE THE NARRATOR OR Sth LIKE???? -🐸

YEAH i am normal about this <3 (jk i am also freaking out) welcome to: people screaming to me in my inbox about prequelgate ft. j/2 fallout theory. let's goooo!

Another copypasta and suddenly chaos machine is full on gay I love this prophecy

you know whats funny i just checked the j/2 tag and i feel like for the first time in a long time they are starting to realise that maybe THEY should be the ones who are "gutted" *sips tea*

ROSE HOLY SHIT ROOOOOOOOSE ITS HAPPENING HOLY SHIIIIIT

YEAH

Nevermind just read prequel and well good luck I guess but just you know kind of bleh who wants to watch John Winchester well let’s have hope anyways

i know a lot of people are bummed out but i am kind of very excited actually?? i trust robbie and even though yeah j*hn winchester turned into a nasty abusive bastard, it can be interesting to explore how it all started (imo). it's just the first of many stories they can tell.

I can only accept this circus if it’s Dean telling the stories to his and Cas’ kids and then we have a revival to show that the whole finale was in fact the end Chuck wanted there Jensen I fixed it

i would not say no to this

heyloo bee anon here

um- wtf is happening?

jackles prequel series?? why? i want to be excited about this but sheesh im scared

because supernatural is never dead <3

okay, but, jensen... john winchester ≠ jdm, you don’t have to go /that/ hard for him 🙃

true true... though i am waiting for jdm to comment on this, please i need it

WAIT A SECOND J2 FALLOUT THEORY TRUE??

LMAO HELL YEAH BESTIE

Rose you really picked the worst time to sleep for real

bestie it was literally 4 in the morning, what do you expect from me sdfjsfhsf

I can’t literally can’t we were all right LMAO j2 fallout theory is real and cockles (Misha supporting Jensen) is [gunshots] I’m just laughing cause what the hell is this timeline we’re living LMAOOOOOOOOOO

we would always end up here <3

Do we have the copypaste anons to thank for JP basically confirming the J2 fallout? lol 🦚

yes, everybody say 'thanks annoying idiots!'

ROSE, WAKE UP, COME HERE,

THERE'S A LOT GOING ON FFS

YEAH I KNOW BUT I NEEDED SLEEP

Anticipating that there's going to be a lot of yelling about the prequel on here: I am cackling, but also, I mean, the first time Dean got a look into his parent's past, Cas was the catalyst: literally entered Dean's mind and catapulted him to the 70s. So idk, it's not completely unreasonable to expect some Cas cameos, maybe setting up a parallel timeline since Dean is narrating. What I'm saying is, this is Jackles, he's getting JDM and Misha in on this lmao -Honeymoon Anon

you were right lmfaooo also i fully agree. misha's tweet further cemented that thought for me. he knew about this prequel and i dont think he is cas-baiting us, i think he'll be involved. i'd also be obsessed to see jensen and jdm act together again (though idk who jdm could play seeing as it's a prequel and he is way too old to play young j*hn)

longlivethetribbles heeft gevraagd:

Heyyyyyy bestie, are you SEEING the absolute madness going on right now holy shit

well a little late but I SURE AM BESTIE

bestie wake up pls s16 finale just dropped.

- 🍯

and WHAT a great one it was

I love coming home from work to see all of the chaos unfolding on Tumblr and Twitter. I'm absolutely buzzing right now. I'll probably still be here by the time you wake up and check tumblr 😂 - 🐢

lmaooo and were you still awake?? did you see my freak out??

Oooh bestie wake the fuck up, I know you’re gonna be excited for this one jsnsjsj

god i had SUCH a morning like. it's 12:00 now and all i did since i woke up is check tumblr rip

short summary: jen and dee gain the rights, they post on ig/twitter about a prequel ft john and mary that no one asked for, the fandom loses its everloving shit as usual, they trend on twitter thanks to the beloved twt intern who missed us, misha qt’s jen about cas possibly benefiting from being in the prequel, then j*red qt’s jensen abt how his feelings got hurt by him not being told about a prequel his character as no involvement in & he initially throws a tantrum, and the rest is history - 🦋 anon (ps: i hope this helps a little, i’ve been scattered brained trying to keep up with it all night lmao so pls let me know if i missed anything, bug crew !!)

thank you so much darling i figured it out eventually but this is a helpful summary!!!

I hope you enjoyed waking up to all of this XD -🐢

i sure did!!! also that answers my question about you being awake lmao

I WILL NEVER EVER EVER FORGIVE MYSELF FOR SLEEPING THROUGH ALL OF THIS DRAMA AND NOT EXPERIENCING IT IN PERSON I DIDN'T NEED THIS SLEEP - tea anon

well the party was still going strong this morning so im not TOO "gutted" see what i did there lmaooo

Now that you are caught up with the news... So idk if you remember this but...didn't jarpad tell jackles he was up for a reboot in an online panel? And jackles answered that this was news to him??

-🍯

yeah i think you are right but he was clearly joking and didnt expect jackles to actually be working on something already

J2 anon spare more of those anons let's finish this - tea anon

please, we're having a ball in this bitch

I saw a post on tumblr where someone said now that Kripke gave J&D the rights, maybe they’re starting with a prequel just to end on a reboot in years time and honestly ? I wanna believe that so badly. This is tinhatty but what if this is all calculated in a way that makes it so that Jensen is slowly starting to fix everything that was wrong with spn - now that he has the rights and he’s slowly making spn his own story ?! I mean he did say in his ig post he wants to ‘fill in the rest’ - and maybe Mary and John’s story is only the beginning of spn related content from J&D to come ??? Maybe he wants to give spn the justice it deserves ?? Thoughts ??

i dont think this is tinhatty at all i think this is very possible and not that much of a reach. i could see this happening yeah for sure

want to hear something funny. I found out I had a ruptured blood vessel in my eye because I was sending my friend a video freaking out when the prequel news dropped and I noticed the corner of my eye was red af. and when I got back online jared had tweeted.

DJFHSJD ANON THE CHAOS OF IT ALL, HELP, are you okay? <3

rose.. bestie... how are you feeling about The News? nsfshsf being european is a curse </3 🐞

i feel GREAT im living for it i feel on top of the world tbh (and yeah it really is dsjfhs)

What am I waking up to I can't WHAT I rested my eyes for like 5 minutes help *hits reblog button* - anon anon

yep yep essentially djfhs

“Jensen and Misha are Co workers who barley talk”

I can’t be sure of course but I’m fairly certain that this is the copypasta that brought the j/2 fallout theory back to life. Who’s apparently ‘barely talking’ now? skansjsjsj. It’s almost prophetic, these j/2 anons have superpowers I’m telling ya.

-poker face anon

next time we get one of them we should be thanking them lmaooo

ok, but are we gonna talk about the "When Daneel and I formed Chaos Machine Productions, we knew that the first story we wanted to tell was the story of John and Mary Winchester [...]"-quote because the way this is phrased implies they formed CHAOS MACHINE Productions with the intent of telling this story (first), i haven't been in this dumpster long enough but the name just tickles me in that Misha way, isn't it so sus??? am i missing something???? i mean with this announcement they SURE lived up to that name... 🧩-anon

you are absolutely right, chaos machine SCREAMS misha and we are all here for it!!

hey hey hey. joining the clownverse, there's no way THEE cas girl danneel doesn't know just how much the fandom loves misha and cas. so 2 + 2 = misha in the spn prequel!

AGREED

So I think I finally managed to catch up on wtf happened while I was asleep and my brain melted. What a shit show to wake up to.

Anyway thoughts.

I don't hate the idea of a Mary&John sequel. I think it has the potential to be good (It has the potential to be really bad too, so I'm kind scared).

🕯️🕯️🕯️ manifesting Mary being badass and John being kinda useless🕯️🕯️🕯️

As for the Jensen and J*red thing.

I can see Jensen not telling J*red even if they are still friends, because J*red is kinda good at accidentally telling Secrets. He could have told him right before he announced it so, so that J*red didn't have to find out from twitter. He was on the show for 15 years, he is bound to get asked about it. The public twitter meltdown was really unprofessional so. Like you have Jensen's number J*red. You could have sorted that out in private like a normal person, but instead you choose to act like a toddler throwing a tantrum.

Is it weird that I'm actually going to be kinda that for them if the actually had a falling out, even tho I don't like J*red all that much. They seemed to be really important to each other and while I thought before that the might have triefted apart a bit, I didn't think that the where actively fighting.

- 🐌 anon

the thing is, the polite/normal thing for jensen to do was text him before announcing it on twitter. it's weird he didn't, and that makes me believe that maybe yeah they did have a falling out. especially with the way j*red responded to it on twitter. if he had no other reason to be this upset (no prior beef or falling out) you'd think that he wouldn't be responding like this. on the other hand, the man is a mysterie to me so who the hell knows. i'm not gonna mourn about it if they did/do grow apart because j*red is just.... awful imo.

#frog anon #bee anon #peacock anon #subtlerainy #honeymoon anon #bestie mutual #honeypot anon #turtle anon #butterfly anon #tea anon #ladybug anon #anon anon #poker face anon #puzzle pieces anon #snail anon #good lord i think i got more anons about this than about anything else before lmao #good luck to anybody who actually reads this <3

[virginwhoredichotomy]

i don’t mean to bring discourse to your blog but i started reading With Understanding this morning and after a few months of reading spn fics i’m getting the sense that works from a few years ago used to me so much more fucked up than now. also i hate the fact that they are going to get together in the end of the fic lmao i hate it

i steer clear of fics written after 2016 and actively avoid fics written after nov 5 so i don't really have a good grasp on what the current consensus is but i'm inclined to agree! supernatural fanfiction is kind of predestined to go through this evolution considering its roots lol but even just looking at destiel fics you can clearly observe this trend. i think it's partly due to the text/the progression of dean and cas' relationship from horny to horny And deeply desperately romantic, partly due to the shifts in fandom culture as a whole, and partly due to the changed demographics and self concept of the spn fandom in particular. i've said this before but Back in the Day the no 1 criteria for being a good fan was edginess and now the vast majority of the fandom is holding hands around dean's soft epilogue lmao

i'm not the best person to talk to about with understanding rip i stopped reading halfway through because i found the writing/characterisation/supporting characters THAT annoying but i will say that i think it's okay for the main couple not to end up together sometimes. i guess this is where fanfiction is constricted by its own premise since the whole point of fanfiction is supposed to be "ok but what if they were together for real" however i simply think that sometimes endings in which the couple stays together.. are worse.. like if you spend the whole fic digging into their relationship and exploring the characters you've already more than done your job! sometimes people separate. sometimes a story is better if you don't insist on a romantic endgame. sorry this is not what you were talking about at all i just read the great escapist today and i have thots on break ups in fanfiction

#ask #anon #with understanding /

[thetiredstuff]

What is with this fandom’s weird obsession with creating and spreading misinformation? Normally I see it being done to Jensen, but as the post you just reblogged proves, they do it to Misha too. I’ve been in a lot of fandoms over the years (some of them way more toxic than the spn fandom), but this has never been a thing in any of them. I don’t get it.

Hi anon!!!

Damn for a second there I thought I had reblogged misinformation and was starting to panick because I try my best to not do that

but yeah i've never been in other fandoms so i don't know about those but I do know (at least in my experience) that it started happening after a new wave of spn fans joined. I think after episode 18 aired, so the ones who are here largely because of destiel and who are all pretty much my age surrounding early 20s. (not saying everyone fits that descriptions because I fit it pretty well so ... but definitely a trend i noticed)

And for some reason a lot of them find it hilarious to spread misinformation posts. And some are indeed funny! When ya know they also mention it is in fact a joke. Because some—like that misha one—are sent out into the tumblr stratosphere without any mention that it is in fact fake.

And some are more harmless than others but for the most part they can be incredibly harmful: I'm thinking back to like a while ago (several months or a year ago) when someone made a manip of Jensen tweeting a homophobic tweet and that just isn't funny. On the contrary it's just very damaging to not only Jensen because he didn't actually say it but also and in that instance more directly to the other fans who love Dean or Jensen or Destiel and then maybe aren't as active on Twitter and see that he's homophobic with no mention that it is in fact fake.

And then other people outside this fandom, still on tumblr, pick up on it and before you know it, it's preading like wildfire except it isn't even true. But the damage is already done.

And while that "Misha is now into NFTs" post is of a different variety, it carries the same weight behind it.

It's very irresponsible and also just damaging to these people's carreers. Like imagine if you're going about your business and then all of a sudden you start seeing screenshots of supposed tweets you tweeted but they're expressing homophobic views?

Like people do get fired for that, people do get reprimanded for that.

It isn't funny to me.

And in the age of so much misinformation and fast-paced sharing, it is really important to watch what you are saying and if you are sharing something to disclose if it is a joke or not.

Of course, that responsibility also lies with those who reblog those fake posts immediately but it isn't always clear whether or not something is fake.

Those "ha ha funny fake posts that make people think actor A is an asshole because it looks real" might be funny to those who create it and their friends who are in on the joke, but the moment it spreads further than that small friend group, it is in fact not funny. Because it can be very damaging to the actor and also to the fans who enjoy his work or characters.

#anon #ask #this became longer than anticipated and probably has a ton of spelling mistakes so ignore that #fake news #me #spn

[incarnateirony]

To the people silently asking, “does me just... not streaming the show actually do anything?”

Answer: Yes, ESPECIALLY if you apply it to ALL of their shows.

You’re not here to punish Just Supernatural. In fact, you’re probably not here to punish SPN itself at all, as most people are aware this is the NETWORK and not the CREATIVES. That means you have to send a message to the NETWORK. That’s why we’re also working with, say, parts of Supergirl fandom, or pointing out what they did to the Black Lightning crew, and more. Hell, it’s too late for like the 100 fandom, or clexa, but maybe if we turn up the heat enough, Supercorp will stop getting treated like shit because they’ll want to turn around their image and go OH LOOK AT US BEING PROGRESSIVE FOR REAL NOW to save face. But that also requires Supercorp fans onboarding this with equal dedication to the 90K+ people in the last few waves that were righteously hot about SPN -- now, not only after it does or doesn’t affect them personally. Because ironically, right now, it does affect them personally.

But SPN, for example, topped the global list in digital calls since about S11, running in a similar category to Grey’s Anatomy and Game of Thrones. About half the list are CW products, because at the end, they don’t care about live, and here’s why.

Digital calls include, but are not limited to: official hashtags, and digital streaming services. This can range from buying Amazon passes to a season to watch live, to using Netflix to stream already uploaded content.

FWIW, early S15 was shattering records it hadn’t seen in years in its SVOD and digital calls. Meaning it was positioned, early, especially with the early netflix upload, to hop forward on that top 20 digital list again. But it’ll be a while before we get the report, and I’m interested to see if it, and other CW shows, can be punted off the list.

Are you one of those people that casually put on SPN while you clean the house or whatever? Hell, are you one of those people that do pretty much sequential binge watches, maybe 30 episodes a week? Knock those out. That’s 30 digital calls they lose, not counting the drop in hashtags. Now do that for a few months. Suddenly that’s 300 digital calls they’ve lost. Now get 10 friends to do it. That’s 3000 digital calls they’ve lost. 

For example, during the year of S12, there were 891,364,902~ digital calls for SPN. So let’s say we get 1,000 career binge watchers to stop for the next 3 months. That’s - 360000 digital calls on their streaming calls alone (again, not including hash trends and the like.) So you’ve just knocked off everything beneath the millions alone, and those are DIRECTLY going to hit their streaming services they have to shop the product to. 

How many hash tags did you use usually? Knock those calls out too. How many of your friends that watched more like 3 episodes a week can you find and get to stop doing this? Maybe another 10,000 people that more fit that bill get on board? Oop there’s another 360000 calls. Let’s assume everyone used about proportionate hashtags. 360000, 360000 again. Oh, shit, so suddenly, off of the simple rebellion of *not watching this show on any streaming service*, you’ve knocked out a few *million* digital calls. Add in the more casual loss of people not using it to stream live and they’re going to even lose that whole like, 40K active accounts monthly on twitter alone that maybe spammed 10 tags a week. Oh, there goes another 400,000... weekly... times that maybe 3 months... another 4,800,000 out the door easily.

What about the passive GA that felt burned by that ending? Cuz they ARE out there. How many of them are going to move on their interests and just wait for nostalgia to come around later? 

You see how quickly this stacks? Especially when you also won’t buy their swag or watch live either, even if live is their secondary interest? What are we at in only one quarter of the year now? Like them losing about 7 million? Okay and if that was the full year reports come in? 28 million? Without even calculating in the GA that felt whacked off by this? And with us being extremely conservative on how wide this reach will get? And hitting them ONLY on SPN?

SomethingtoSay and TheySilencedYou got almost 100K tweets. The #MissingSupernatural sad trombone got 2K, despite the “related interests” trend push and the blurb to try to catch attention and tell us all how sad we should be. I’m going to need someone to think about that.

They have to individually shop products around since the Netflix deal broke. That’s WHY in some countries SPN has bounced between Netflix and Amazon often. With their shit-shows it’s a matter of convincing platforms to stream. With their big ones that are streaming wonders, it’s a boon to them, because biggest bidder scenario. What people think will bring them to their platform.

If you only use a streaming service for CW shows? Cancel it, use the little reason box to clarify exactly why. Let them know those products aren’t worth as much anymore. Let them know loudly. They’ll buy it for less and less historically, which again, hits the CW right in the money maker. Suddenly it’s not a competition for this property and they won’t be racing for it the same way.

Do that for *all* their shows. Imagine mirroring that on like 4 shows. That alone slams them with a loss of like, over a hundred million digital calls. Jazz fucking hands. Do you know what that does to a network who’s entire strategy is to shove shit TV out on digital and wait for it to catch fire?

Yes, it helps. And it takes negative effort.

Cancelling your netflix or whatever -- in just a few months of casual savings you’ll have enough to buy at least half the DVDs pre-owned. Start with your favorite seasons and by the time you’re done with those, you’ll be able to get the others off the same income save.

I’ve already cancelled my Netflix and told them why. Have you?

#somethingtosay #eileen #saileen #disability #end erasure #enderasure #destiel #black lightning #supergirl #supercorp #clexa #theysilencedyou #rancidnutwork #rancid nutwork #the 100