#but that just seems a bit too much | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

singular-yike · 6 months

Text

Musing on Ancient Mugenri History

I've been thinking about this topic recently and there's a lot in my mind, so I thought to write it down before it starts fading lol.

To be clear, this is going to involve a lot of speculation, and not much is gonna be based on concrete proof, which is a rather great departure from what I usually prefer, but hey, speculation is fun every now then~

This is gonna be split into several parts, which I hope makes things neat enough. In any case, let's begin!

The People of Mugenri

Before we look into the general ancient history of Mugenri, let's take a quick look at what the residents of Mugenri could've been like in the distant past.

Canon Information

First, let's start with the history of its population. Here, we look at these this line from A World That Isn't Fantasy — To Mugenri:

Hoojiro "Another world….. A land of a race that broke off from mankind long, long ago."

Haru immediately recognises this as referencing the "Land of Non-humans", which Tsubakura had apparently been looking into prior to being spirited away.

This land is generally accepted to refer to Mugenri, and this is the assumption I will be going off of here as well.

Additionally, let's also take a look at this bit of information from the 2021 Interview with JynX.

Characters (BPoHC) — Question 242 Q: Considering that God is moreso a qualification rather than a species, are Yago and Souko's longevity thanks to their original species rather than their status as a god? Does becoming a god even grant you new abilities? A: They both gained their longevity after becoming gods and were originally human-like.

Interpretation

Putting these two together, I propose the following: Mugenri was initially inhabited by a "primordial race", the very human-like race that Yago and Souko belonged to prior to their ascension to godhood.

Somewhere a long the way, this original race split into "humans" and "non-humans", who once co-existed peacefully but had a fall-out of some sorts.

This lead to the event Hoojiro described, the non-humans "breaking off" from the humans and settling in Mugenri, creating the "Land of Non-humans"

Caveats

There are, I think, 2 major caveats to this idea:

I'm making an assumption that the non-humans "breaking off" from the humans applies to both their evolutionary path as well as the relationship between the two.

There's nothing explicitly connecting the "human-like" race and the modern humans and non-humans.

Mugenri's Ancient History

This is where we get really speculative, as all I really have to go on are these names from BotC Back Issue EE Yabusame's Route - Stage 1:

Gods' Tabooed Land

Garden of Eden

Lost Horizon

Oppressed Land of Exile

It should absolutely be noted NiLU suggests that not all of these names originally referred to Mugenri, but that they only got conflated with Mugenri later down the line.

Nevertheless, they're helpful for taking a glimpse into Mugenri's nature. So, let's try to piece a timeline together using these names.

Step 0. Gods' Tabooed Land

"Tabooed Land" is a concept from Shinto that refers to a location said to be reserved for the gods and within which humans are forbidden, often believed to be where the gods descended to and from earth.

Admittedly, I'm unsure whether this step would be placed here or further down, hence "step 0".

If we were to place this here, this would refer to when the gods first descended to earth and started their work, landing in what would become Mugenri and creating "human-like" beings to inhabit it.

Step 1. Garden of Eden

This of course refers to the biblical paradise mentioned in Abrahamic religions where the first humans Adam and Eve once lived before being exiled by God for eating the forbidden fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

It's a rather safe bet to place as the first stage of Mugenri, as it is where humanity originated. Paralleling, in the case of Len'en, Mugenri being where the human-like primordial race came from.

It would also be during this period that Yago Ametsukana ascended to godhood, and perhaps Souko Shirami as well, though I'm have less proof for that one outside of the two gods' basis sharing a similar time period in the irl myths.

I would guess that somewhere along the way, whether they have already speciated into human and non-humans aside, the original inhabitants of Mugenri got themselves exiled from Mugenri.

Fondly remembering the paradisical life they used to lead in Mugenri, and lamenting its lost, the land eventually became known as, or equated with, the name "Garden of Eden".

Side Note — Yago's Ascension You might be curious as to why I'm so sure that Yago's ascension is so likely to have taken place in this stage, even specifically before the residents got exiled. This comes from a spell card of theirs, Sword Shot "The Cherubim and the Whirling Sword of Flame". This spell references what the Abrahamic God sent to guard the Garden of Eden after Adam and Eve's exile. Thus, Yago having this spell card quite heavily suggests that it was the Ametsukana who forged the "whirling sword of flame" and sent it with the cherubim to guard the garden.

Step 2A. Lost Horizon

Lost Horizon is a 1933 novel by English writer James Hilton, famous for being the origin of Shangri-La, a fictional utopian lamasery.

Having been banished from Mugenri, and as the time passed, it's not beyond belief that the people (especially the humans) would've forgotten where Mugenri was once located, rending a truly lost location from their perspective.

It is also during this phase, I would guess, that the two categories of humans and non-humans must have came to be, no later than this. Explanation to come later.

Step 2B. Gods' Tabooed Land

Yep, the "Gods' Tabooed Land" returns once again. For those who did not forget Mugenri, where it was and its history; or perhaps from the gods' own perspective, Mugenri isn't "lost" at all, it's right there!

Instead, these people would've understood Mugenri as a place now exclusively belonging to the gods, and where humans especially are not allowed to enter.

(After all, while the line between human and god is fairly clear, that between youkai and god is often less so.)

Step 3. Oppressed Land of Exile

Unlike the other names, this one doesn't seem to be a reference of any sort, but is just a simple description of the land.

It is during this time period that I propose the "breaking off" between humans and non-humans must've occurred. For whatever reason, the two races were no longer able to peacefully co-exist.

This lead to the non-humans returning to Mugenri (like I mentioned, it's a lot more likely for them to know where it is after all this time). There, they either locked themselves within to cut all possible contact with the humans or they got locked within by the humans.

Having been exiled from the outside world, the inhabitants of Mugenri started a new era of their lives, adopting the Ruri calendar. "Ruri" meaning "exile", further strengthening this idea.

Side Note I've been using "Mugenri" to refer to this location this entire time, but it only makes sense to assume that this name isn't always what it was called. In fact, I think it's rather likely that it was only used after the barrier was created and a separate world formed. Here, I'll use "Ruri Mugenri", named after its Ruri calendar, to denote specifically the Mugenri as we know it now, separated from the outside by the barrier.

The "exiled non-humans" theory does raise a curious question though: Why are there also humans in Ruri Mugenri?

Of course, this could be explained simply by the fact that humans occasionally wander into Mugenri, but I get the impression that humans have always been in the Ruri Mugenri from the very beginning.

There are, in my opinion, three ways we can explain this:

These early humans were sympathizers to the non-humans, and in solidarity joined them in their self-imposed exile.

These early humans were those who sacrificed their own freedom to forever trap the non-humans in Mugenri.

These early humans were not interested in the race conflict, but was simply hoping to start anew or escape the outside world.

Personally, I would imagine that all these cases could be found, though I'd like to focus on the 2nd option. Because this, I believe, is the origin of the Senri Shrine.

We know that the 1st Senri priest was among those who created the Mugenri Barrier, and considering their successor, Tsurubami Senri's, stance towards youkai, it's not hard to see how I came to this conclusion.

Additionally, this also answers the question of whether the non-humans willingly shut themselves in Mugenri or were trapped in there by the humans.

This idea is somewhat supported by this from the 2021 Interview with JynX:

Mugenri — Question 86 Q: Can you think of Mugenri as a trap or prison, maybe a birdcage? Why else would it be so easy to get in but extremely difficult to get out? A: Something like that. The details are secret~.

Unhelpful JynX aside (lol), they did agree, to some extent, that Mugenri is a trap or a prison, further strengthening the idea that the non-humans aren't exactly willing participants.

The Human/Non-human Conflict

Finally, let's take a quick look at what could've caused this conflict between the two sides in the first place. I have a few theories, so let's go into that here.

First off, there's always the good old human fear of the unknown and the different, the easiest and most typical explanation for these situations and plots.

Perhaps the humans gradually grew more and more intolerant of the non-humans, and eventually took to taking up arms against them, leading to this conflict.

Of course, it's frankly hard to believe that these primeval humans would've been able to fight against the myriad of youkai and other non-humans all by themselves.

Here I suggest that the humans weren't alone, but were instead supported by a certain subset of gods. To see where this idea comes from, let's revisit A World That Isn't Fantasy, this time looking at Alice Leaping Atop Lily Pad Ice.

Hoojiro "Have you ever heard of it? The story of the imperial family and the Earthly Gods buried by history's darkness."

This is, at first glance, seemingly just a throwaway line. Hoojiro brings it up out of nowhere, and Haru quickly brushes her aside.

But even ignoring why Hoojiro brought it up, from an out-of-universe perspective, this line is far too loaded to be nothing, especially from a writer like JynX.

From an in-universe perspective, Hoojiro then follows this up with the talk on the Land of Non-humans in the next section, To Mugenri. This, to me at least, seems to hint that these two must be related somehow.

After all, Tsubakura was looking into the Land of Non-humans, and Hoojiro would've certainly had a good idea of everything they looked into and found.

So! Let's try to figure out what this is about.

First off, I'll tell you right now that this is referring to the mythologised telling of how the Yamato dynasty of Japan came to rule over these islands.

See the imperial family of Japan, according to their mythology, is descendant from Amaterasu Ōmikami, a sun goddess. She is what is considered a "heavenly god" (天津神 amatsukami), gods belonging to or originating from the heavenly realm of Takamagahara.

The counterpart to these heavenly gods are thus the "earthly gods" (国津神 kunitsukami), the native gods of the earth. They were the original rulers of the land (Japan), and it was through both diplomacy and force that the heavenly gods got the earthly gods to relinquish control of the earth to them.

This, I am certain, is the "story of the imperial family and the Earthly Gods", Hoojiro refers to. And I have a feeling that this is what caused the relationship between the humans and non-humans to sour.

Basing it on the myths, it would appear that the heavenly gods chose, for whatever reason, to side with the humans in the conflict, allowing them claim the world as their own.

Having identified the heavenly gods with the humans, this would leave the earthly gods with the non-humans, neither of whom fared very well in this exchange, and were forced to submit before the heavenly gods and their humans.

Thus the losers of this conflict, the earthly gods and non-humans, were "exiled" from the known world, put into an almost mirror-dimension-like plane of existence, their only way back out into the greater world through the outside, the Land of the Humans.

Note — Too Harsh on the Humans? History is written by the victors, or in this case, the imprisoned losers. All the sources we have so far are fairly Ruri Mugenri-centric, even those from outside. There is every chance that the humans were somewhat justified in their attack on the non-humans at first, perhaps the non-humans first took over and oppressed them, much like how the earthly gods were the original rulers of Japan. If this were true, that it'd be rather easy to see why the heavenly gods sided with the humans, perhaps out of pity, or a desire to use them to eliminate a common enemy.

Ending

Phew! That was a lot, wasn't it?

But this indeed concludes my thoughts on what the hypothetical ancient history of the land of Mugenri might be like, from it's initial inception to the establishment of Ruri Mugenri.

Like I mentioned at the beginning, a lot more guesswork and speculation this time, so its canonicity is very doubtful. Still, I think it's at least plausible.

As usual, I hope you enjoyed it~! :)

#len'en project #len'en #len'en lore #len'en theory #mugenri #I considered putting adding how tsukuyomi could've possibly fit into this too #but that just seems a bit too much #some other time perhaps

23 notes · View notes

sableeira · 1 year

Text

sure ango may have betrayed every organization under the sun but tachihara put in the effort to build up the perfect stereotypical gangstersona and act his silly little heart out for the perfect plot twist so we all know who deserves the award for best port mafia betrayal

#ango should have created a gangstersona too… it would have been a bit more spicy #although I do admit that not knowing where ango’s loyalty lies does make the betrayals in dark era good #but I guess similar things apply to Tachihara too which is why chapter 77 hits so good #Rimbaud gets third place for pm betrayals ig I like that his motives are about gay love but otherwise it’s just an okay betrayal #dazai isn’t even on the list because no one except Chuuya seems to count his defection as betrayal lol #I giggled so much during the episode because Tachihara was so dramatic throughout the episode ^_^ he is so funny #bsd #bungou stray dogs #bungo stray dogs #bsd season 4 #tachihara michizou #bsd tachihara #ango sakaguchi #bsd ango

5K notes · View notes

difty-dift · 7 months

Text

#that which could not be included:#scarecrow #sci-fi (aliens‚ robots‚ mad scientists. my mind seems to separate sci-fi and horror as concepts so it just lumps these all together lol)#pirate apparently #the headless horseman. just a smidge to specific and singular #generic 'monster' that isn't an alien but is physically weird as if it were #technically haunted dolls but veering a bit less ''conventional''#i wouldn't count folklore like Medusa or the minotaur cause then this list would be endless. plus feels weird to level those as 'spooky'#I'm thinking too much now I'm done lol #Halloween

2K notes · View notes

bongosinferno · 13 days

Text

A devastating and confusing thing about the Fallout setting, when you explore the pre-war aspects, is what the creators think about pre-war America. In the first games we only get hints of the pre-war world, but they seem to be some sort of wild fascist nation invading Canada. In Fallout 1, the first thing we're introduced to of the pre-war society is seeing a soldier shoot civilians and laughing.

Now, for the first 2 games and New Vegas we don't really know much. What we know is that there's a fascist military group known as the enclave who were a sort of US deep state even before the war, and that the government teamed up with corporate interests to preform vaguely MKULTRA-ish experiments with the Vaults. Basically, the government was an extreme version of the 50s American jingoism and McCarthyism.

This is well and dandy, I guess issues come up more when we get to the later games, especially 4, where it seems like none of this extreme plotting and societal civil unrest which would exist is seen. The society as presented in 4 also seems quite progressive, gay people are featured in the opening, and none of the baggage of say, civil rights not existing are included. Now on a baseline, I don't want settings to be more conservative, homophobic and sexist etc., but it becomes a very confusing setting when it's displayed both as this jingoist extreme thing with fascist tendencies aswell as a progressive place where everyone is seemingly equal. If you're focusing on the 50s as your setting, and American nationalism in the 50s, then you can't have McCarthyism spoofs and anti-communism as a societal paranoia norm while also general equality is the norm without misunderstanding why McCarthyism and nationalist jingoism is bad. A massive harm done in anti-communist paranoia is how it degrades and vilifies any progressive movements (women's rights, civil rights, homosexuality) as being morally un-American and therefore connected to communism. To ignore this just makes any critique of MacCarthyism and jingoism weird!

Basically, pre-war America in Fallout 4 becomes this both sides thing where America is both pure and equal and white fences in every instance that we see as the player (the intro), while also supposedly being this dystopic MacCarthyist hellscape that's broadcasting gladly about their war crimes in Canada, and wants to root out communism. I guess the only fix for this issue without getting into the fine print like they had to do is just not to focus too much on the pre-war world.

#fallout #fallout 1 #fallout 2 #fallout 3 #fallout 4 #fallout new vegas #fo1 #fo2 #fonv #fo4 #I'm almost half-way through the show #it suffers from this too but whatever I'm just going to count it as it's own thing #it gets a pass or whatever. telling a video game story and telling a tv-series is completely different #they can do what they think is useful.#We see a bit of what the I'm talking about in New Vegas with mr house being able to be that rich etc #but new vegas cares more about the fallout of Fallout 2 + new ideas than some pre-war America. The most we get is like Poseidon energy and #Raul. but Raul doesn't really care that much about the details of the past world #his life seems pretty normal. it's not that important.#dead money and owb did this like... Okay. wasn't too bad it was fine. I don't like those DLCs too much. Dean Domino is whatever

439 notes · View notes

radiantmists · 5 months

Text

so murderbot assumes that three offered its armor because it doesn't understand that the armor can belong to it and thinks mb taking the armor is just good resource allocation.

but if it assumes it doesnt have control over the armor, it would probably let whoever it sees as in charge (maybe ART?) handle it, or at least make the suggestion directly to that person. even newly freed in NE, it's willing to give its security advice (on hostage situations being undesirable) even if it doesn't expect to be taken seriously. it doesn't make sense to me that it would have so much trouble expressing the offer if it were just a security suggestion.

and then i think about how murderbot says later in the book that even if three felt fondly toward its fellow SecUnits, the govmod would prevent it from expressing that care or knowing it was returned.

so-- imagine you're three, and you havent yet internalized that you can just say "i care about you and dont want you to get hurt" to another SecUnit; but you can make sure that it has every resource it might need; you could probably do that even before the govmod was hacked.

you can't explain why, but you can hope that the gesture is explanation enough, and you can look for similar caretaking gestures in return; things like being given code and advice to do your job better, and being reassured when you express that you're finding said job difficult.

i think *murderbot* isn't aware of this language of care, because it hasnt had much opportunity to bond with other constructs. but three probably is, and probably knows how to read between the lines and guess that murderbot is starting to care about it, too.

#system collapse #system collapse spoilers #murderbot spoilers #the murderbot diaries #secunit three #maybe this is obvious #but i just got really caught on that bit abt 3 not being able to know if its feelings were returned #bc on the one hand its a really heartbreaking example of how fucked up the governor module is #but it also feels like a bit too much of an absolute #if mb could write a hack of the govmod surely three + its fellows could do a few unnecessary but kind things for each other #its just that they could never *confirm*#still hellish but not the total isolation mb seems to imagine #murderbot diaries

782 notes · View notes

kindlythevoid · 8 months

Text

I have read Fellowship of the Ring more times than I have cared to keep count and every time I read Boromir’s, well, possession for lack of a better word, I have read it in fear, in discomfort, in horror, indifferently.

This was, I think, the first time I read it in pity. I looked at all the plans Boromir was making, how he would save his beloved city, how obstinate he was in his belief that the men of Minas Tirith would not be corrupted when wielding the Ring against Sauron —and I felt sad. He’s waving his hands and hollering and part of him is desperate just for the Ring, of course he is, he’s been traveling beside it with no hope for months, but he’s also desperate for hope. He’s desperate for a chance to save his people, save his brother, save his city.

Moreover, every time he calls out the Elves or the Wizards, you have to remember that he doesn’t know them. All he knows is that he traveled almost a full year to get their advice and they send him on, in his eyes, a hopeless venture. The one hope they give him is Aragorn, who promises to return and help save Minas Tirith with him, but even that all changes once Gandalf dies. They come to Lothlorien and of course it’s a welcome break, but they cannot, or maybe in Boromir’s eyes will not, help his people. And once they leave, Aragorn assumes his role as leader of the Fellowship in Gandalf’s stead more permanently and suddenly even that one, brief, uncertain hope of his is gone. Aragorn will follow Frodo. And it’s almost certain that Frodo will not go to Minas Tirith.

So is it any wonder, really, that tired, desperate, hopeless Boromir, out of his realm, out of his depth, already hanging by a thread when he joins the Fellowship and having been gnawed on by the Ring for months upon months afterwards, finally snaps once it’s clear that he will have to return home empty-handed and almost certain that somewhere far away Sauron is capturing the Ring and killing the companions that he had bonded with? Of course part of the Ring is making him lust for power, but it’s also his only “reliable” (in his mind) source of hope left to save his city.

And so I read Boromir’s (intelligent and thought out, mind you) raving and I don’t feel scared for Frodo, not after reading it so many times and knowing what ultimately happens, but sorrow for Boromir.

745 notes · View notes

funkfreakle · 10 months

Text

incorrect quotes four: special neopets edition

this one’s shorter but i think it’s the funniest one so it balances out

576 notes · View notes

legend-of-cupcake · 4 months

Text

Tsukasa works FOR Sakura

Now this is very likely me just being slow and not connecting the dots until now, but chapter 109 has made me realise that Tsukasa is not the one in charge of the "destroy all yorishiros" plan... It's Sakura.

It's this line here that's made me finally see the light, Tsukasa has to "help Sakura, by destroying the yorishiro." He is not actively desiring the yorishiro to be destroyed, he's just doing his part in the plan. In chapter 106, he wasn't even phased that Nene didn't want to destroy the yorishiro and the only reason he persisted was because it was "his job."

Even way back in chapter 93, Sumire describes Sakura as the one No. 6 serves. Sakura gave him the job of destroying his own yorishiro, not Tsukasa.

Sakura is the one who wants the yorishiros destroyed, she's been trapped inside the school for 100 years and is tired of it. She wants to leave whatever duty is keeping her bound

And she is more than willing to make sacrifices to make her wish come true

Sakura is behind everything, she is the reason that Tsukasa was freed from where he was trapped (very likely Hanako's boundary).

She is also the one altering the rumours.

Tsukasa, as cunning and intelligent as he may be, is probably a bit too impulsive to be the brains behind the entire operation. His intense curiosity for things would likely get in the way, no matter how well he means or how serious he's being.

And again, it's clear Tsukasa is not as invested in destroying the yorishiros as we are initially led to believe. Again, he really doesn't mind that Nene no longer wants to destroy yorishiros anymore

In fact, it's Natsuhiko who worries Nene won't destroy them. Keep in mind Natsuhiko is 100% loyal to Sakura and not necessarily to Tsukasa. If this was Tsukasa's plan, I doubt he would be worrying over whether Nene will keep doing her part as the kannagi

The only reason we even initially thought this was all Tsukasa's doing, was because Sakura painted a picture that she was in a similar situation to Nene.

Sakura gives the impression that she can't go against Tsukasa, that he is her master. But that can't be right, because we know Sakura was the one who appointed the 7 mysteries in the first place. And she was also the one who freed Tsukasa, so how could he be the "master" in this relationship?

I think, Sakura said all this to gain Nene's trust.

Nene, being the modern kannagi, is absolutely vital in the plan to destroy the yorishiros. So having her trust Sakura would help out immensely.

So overall, whether it's the price he's paying for having been freed-- or for some other reason entirely-- it's quite clear to me now that Tsukasa is not the one in charge of the "destroy the 7 mysteries" plan. He's absolutely a major key player, with his cunning and curious mind clearly being an advantage (figured out the fastest and easiest route to stopping time so he could access the clock-keeper's boundary with Nene). But he is doing all of this to help Sakura, it's not for himself.

#tbhk #jshk #toilet bound hanako kun #jibaku shounen hanako kun #tsukasa yugi #sakura nanamine #tbhk theory #it wouldn't surprise me if everyone had already came to this conclusion long before this chapter #I'm just slow sorry lol #Tsukasa is too impulsive and gets distracted too easily to be the mastermind imo #but don't get me wrong he is extremely cunning and smart #only when he's interested tho #plus it really doesnt seem right that Tsukasa is the master of the one who freed him #bit sus there ngl #pls don't roast me too much for being dumb #sorry this post is a bit all over the place

228 notes · View notes