#BUT. AGAIN. I HAVE TO STOP | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

reikunrei · 1 year

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really intrigued by this new stage play delving more into Henry's past and how it will inform/add to what we've already gotten of him in s4, and what we may potentially get in s5, so i kinda just want to ramble lol.

the way i see it, and how we as an audience and how some or all of the characters are meant to view him, is not necessarily that he's the stereotypical "big bad" villain. sure, he's villainous and the overall antagonist, and while he displays extremely monstrous behavior, he's not the "monster" that Eleven envisions.

she has a very black and white view of good vs bad. she's been fighting with this for a while, especially internally and how she views herself. from season 1, she thinks she's "the monster." she opened the initial gate, which made Will go missing, killed countless others, and got all of her new friends in trouble.

in season 2, we kind of started to touch on the idea of what kind of behavior is "good or bad" when she meets Kali. they share an unfathomable bond and love each other dearly through their shared experiences in Hawkins Lab. Kali teaches her how to be stronger, that she shouldn't hide from her powers, she should use them to help herself. and El leans into it, allows herself to be fueled by her rage and sadness. but she hesitates. she wants to strengthen this bond with Kali, her sister, but it feels wrong.

she's killed people, yes, but it's different when it's in self defense in the heat of the moment vs ambushing someone who, while he did hurt them, is currently unawares. plus, there's other innocent children involved. he may have hurt her, but El knows the pain of losing a parent. that's what brought her there in the first place. she can't do that to someone else. her grief hurts, but any relief will be fleeting under the further pain she now causes. she doesn't want to be the monster.

in season 3, this topic is mostly only broached with Billy. Billy is not a good dude. in fact, he sucks major chode and has approximately zero redeeming qualities, and the only reason Max is so torn up about his death is because of survivor's guilt.

but still, in order to beat the Mind Flayer, El has to break through to him, so she finds those happy memories of him with his mom on the beach, and makes him remember that, makes him fight for his mom, rather than the hell he's been through for the last X number of years. he might be a fucking shitty asshole, but he can pull off one valiant deed to save those around him, because he doesn't want to entirely give in to his misery. he wants to remember those happy moments, and wants his mother to be happy, wherever she may be, and that means making sure this monster (the Mind Flayer) is dead.

(plus i guess it's also like a stand-in for his dad. Billy's been abused his whole life, and has become the abuser, and he's sick of all of it. so now, he finally fights back and stands up for his mom like he's always wanted to.)

season 4 is a fucking smorgasbord. they went so heavy-handed with the "good vs evil" "monster vs superhero" shit that it would be hilarious if it weren't totally understandable bc all of these characters are 14 years old and don't have a full grasp on the nuances of the world just yet. again, we get El worrying that she could be the monster, that she'll make everything worse, that she's the one to blame for everything. Mike, Dr. Owens, Will, Brenner, none of them can convince her that, no matter what she did or does, she is their "hero." Owens gets pretty close, he at least gets a few smiles out of her, but she's still uncertain.

she thinks she can no longer be the hero because she lost her powers, that now she's useless, and even if now she's like a "normal kid," she knows she'll never really fit in. but then, when she starts at Nina, she fears that her powers will make her the monster all over again. that she's already done something so monstrous that she won't ever be able to forgive herself.

enter, Henry and the truth. that he killed all of those children. that he was the one behind everything to do with the Upside Down. that he was the reason that Brenner started all of these experiments and built his little "family" in their prison.

so she says Henry's the monster. or rather, Brenner was the monster, and he built Henry into the formidable monster that he then became when he fledged into Vecna. she's now dead-set on blaming it all on those two men, and it all started with Brenner, her Papa. even so, when she's saying goodbye to him, she's receptive to his touch. she leans into his hand, she accepts his affection.

she is so close to getting it. no, Brenner is not a good man, but she did love him at one point, and she still does to some degree. she might say he's the monster, but i think she doesn't really believe that. she just wants to convince herself that it's true so she can find someone to blame, to make it easy, to make it black and white.

and then Henry pushes her closer to the truth! he says that, no, Brenner was not a monster. he was just a man. a mediocre man, who sought power in others. Brenner was just a person.

again, he may have done monstrous things in that lab, but he was not the monster that El wants him to be.

and that leads us to how she views Henry.

where we left off leaves it a bit gray for me. obviously she tries talking him out of all of it, to stop his plan, to leave her friend alone, etc. "you are not the monster, Henry." but he doesn't listen. he likes being the monster. he's good at being the monster. he feels entirely justified in his actions and believes he's helping. and he's so entrenched in his own pain that he doesn't see any need to stop now while he's so close to his goal. Henry even turns it back on El, saying that she was the reason Henry even became Vecna in the first place. so, again, she could be called the "true monster" here for being the major catalyst of it all.

i think if El had the chance in that moment, she would have killed Henry. she was terrified watching him kill one of her best friends, one of her only friends in the whole world. she's killed people to protect her friends before, she isn't going to stop now.

but she couldn't. she had to rely on the teens in the Upside Down to take out his body. and, obviously, that didn't work in the end.

we don't see El talk about it any further, but with all of these prior conversations and experiences, once she's out of the heat of the moment, i think she would not want to kill Henry. just like Kali, the two of them have a bond and their shared experience under Brenner. she sees Henry as a sort of role model, a guardian, an older brother. at least, she did when she became so devoted to helping him, but just like with Brenner, i don't think that's entirely gone away.

she's terrified of him, disgusted by him, horrified at his behavior, but she simply can't see him as the pure "monster" that she wants him to be. she has to start to realize that it will never be possible to group either of them into one category. and she has to learn that that includes herself.

Eleven very easily could have become "Vecna," so to speak. she was just lucky enough to have a support system when she escaped the lab. she found the right kids who would love and support her through it all, the good and the bad, so that even if she does monstrous things, they'll be there for her to help her pick up the pieces and fix it together.

Henry didn't have that. he hid himself away, didn't admit to his family when things were bothering him (or, if he did, they didn't give him the support he needed), and allowed himself to become jaded with anything and everything that inconvenienced him. after all, nobody was helping him fix it, so he has to do it all himself.

he was trapped. just a little kid stuck in an unsavory situation, perhaps aggravated by whatever "shadow" it was that was living in the Creel House and stoking this burning ember inside of him. he was upset, hurt, felt abandoned and lost, and lashed out. it's no different to the times that El killed people in self defense, though perhaps Henry had a smidge more premeditation.

regardless, the core of both of their behaviors is the same: wanting to get out of their cage.

El was just lucky enough to have friends, and Henry was unfortunate to not have any strong, loving bonds like he so craved and needed.

Kali is sort of a middle ground for me at the moment. she is somewhere between El and Henry. she's using her hurt and anger and sadness as fuel, like Henry, but she still finds light and love in the world with her friends and family, like El. she wants to hurt people, like Henry, but she understands that there's only specific people who deserve that hurt, like El.

Henry just wants to throw out the whole baby with the bath. sure, there's specific people he's upset with, but it was the whole world that was set up to make his life harder. he wants to take out everyone because he believes the flaw runs all the way to the roots.

Eleven and Henry are on opposite ends of the spectrum. Henry wants to only see the bad, and El only wants to see the good.

Henry was hurt and then left to wallow in it for his entire life with no one offering out their hand to him. so, if everyone else is going to be "evil," why shouldn't he? he finds power that way, makes himself stronger, so he relies on it to build himself up, to the point that he actively avoids the happy memories of his victims. he can't admit that there might be good in the world, because that would strip him of all of his power. his stance would suddenly have no foundation if he were to acknowledge that there is good and love and light mixed in with all of his grief.

with this play, we'll get a glimpse at the possible happy memories that Henry has. we'll find ammunition for El to use against him, to point at and go "see! you were happy! you can still be happy! you don't have to be the monster! you can choose to get better!" that he has other qualities he can nurture other than his hatred. like Billy, he can find the good in an otherwise shitty situation and hang onto it like a life raft.

i'm not entirely sure what to expect from, nor do i know what i really want out of, the ending of season 5. will they kill Henry? will they reform him? will Henry kill himself? will Henry sacrifice himself? there's many options, and i could have a field day going through the possibilities of all of them.

at the very least, i'm almost entirely convinced that El will not want to kill him. especially with a potential time skip leaving her lots of room off-screen to mull it all over. i think she will be determined to talk him out of it. i even get a kick out of the idea of Max being trapped in his head and rooting around in his memories, playing the Ghost of Christmas Past to dredge up his younger years and go "remember this? you were happy! it's not all bad all the time, here's the evidence!"

when it comes to the other characters, i think a lot of them will still want to kill Henry. he caused all of this, after all. he's actively trying to kill them, destroy Hawkins, and potentially drag the whole world into darkness. they have to kill him, right!?

i do believe that El could potentially convince some of them to not try to kill him. especially Will, but i need to stop myself from going on that tangent or this will turn into a 20 page essay lol.

but even if they do reform him, i don't know if i want an actual "redemption" for him. like, that's not really the right word, i don't think, but i am also stupid, so.

like, i think there's lots of room for El to admit that she has done monstrous things, but her friends still stand by her and work with her to fix anything and everything that she may have caused, deliberately or not, because they love her. and she wants Henry to understand that he is just the same as her, and he is also deserving of understanding and help in fixing anything wrong he may have done, whether deliberately or because he was pushed into it.

but i haven't quite worked out where he would stand if they kept him alive. like, i can imagine two paths for him right now off the top of my head:

they fight and Henry is gravely injured. El tries to convince him and it doesn't work. Henry is petulant and stubborn and stuck in his anger and pain, and he doesn't want to listen to this child, his protégé, talk down to him and try to boss him around. so, he kills himself because, if his plan is going to fail, he'd rather be dead.

El tries to convince him and it does work, but he's in too deep now. the plan is in motion, and the only way to stop it completely is his death. so, he sacrifices himself to close the gates and keep their worlds forever separated, saving the Right Side Up from its horrible fate, but losing his own life in the process.

i hadn't thought of the 2nd option until today, and i'm actually quite fond of it. could you imagine our big villain, the one behind all of the characters' misery and pain and death, actually working on their side to fix the mess he's made?

i can totally see Henry's death being framed as a big tragedy, like Barb or Bob or Eddie, rather than the triumphant "win" it otherwise could have been. their antagonist dies, and it's sad.

and even if it was something like Will landing the final blow and killing Henry, or him killing himself, or even El taking his life, it will all be sad, because El will have learned that Henry was not purely the monster of Vecna that they'd been envisioning. he was an ordinary boy, trying to live an ordinary life, and that was ripped away from him (again, like Will, but again, i have to control myself!!!).

i so badly want El to acknowledge that she could have become our story's "Vecna," and Henry always had the capacity to become like Eleven.

in this story, there is no "monster" and no "superhero." every single person is capable of great good and great evil at the same time, and El and Henry need to meet in the middle on that spectrum. if you aren't already, i think that by the end of season 5, every member of the audience will be sympathetic toward Henry Creel, because everyone will understand that we are all capable of becoming as "bad" as him, and even he is capable of becoming "good."

should Henry be forgiven? probably not. nobody owes him forgiveness. nobody should go "aww he saved the day in the end, he was good all along!" that's not the point. the point is that despite doing bad things, all of these characters are deserving of understanding. you don't have to forgive to understand.

i really am just so interested to see more of Henry's past in an objective manner, rather than through Victor's or Henry's memory. we'll get some real meat to chew on and humanize this man that has been unfairly placed into the cookie-cutter mold of "monster."

#henry creel #stranger things #i say things #eleven #OKAY I. NEED TO STOP.#this turned way longer than i thought LOL #this dynamic between el and henry is what im most looking forward to in s5 tbh #it's just so JUICY #theres so much more i could add w how el views this issue #like i just remembered s2 when she tells hopper hes like brenner #BUT. AGAIN. I HAVE TO STOP

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inkskinned · 8 months

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they want to talk about mental illness and acceptance and how everyone is a little ocd it's cute and quirky and their "intrusive thoughts" are about cutting their hair off and you say yours are about taking a razorblade to your eye and they say ew can you not and everyone is a little adhd sometimes! except if you're late it's a personality flaw and it's because you are careless and cruel (and someone else with adhd mentions they can be on time, so why can't you?) and it's not an eating disorder if it's girl dinner! it's not mania if it's girl math! what do you mean you blew all of your savings on nonrefundable plane tickets for a plane you didn't even end up taking. what do you mean that you are afraid of eating. get over it. they roll their little lips up into a sneer. can you not, like, trauma dump?

they love it on them they like to wear pieces of your suffering like jewels so that it hangs off their tongue in rapiers. they are allowed to arm-chair diagnose and cherrypick their poisons but you can't ever miss too many showers because that's, like, "fuckken gross?" so anyone mean is a narcissist. so anyone with visual tics is clearly faking it and is so cringe. but they get to scream and hit customer service employees because well, i got overwhelmed.

you keep seeing these posts about how people pleasers are "inherently manipulative" and how it's totally unfair behavior. but you are a people pleaser, you have an ingrained fawn response. in the comments, you have typed and deleted the words just because it is technically true does not make it an empathetic or kind reading of the reaction about one million times. it is technically accurate, after all. you think of catholic guilt, how sometimes you feel bad when doing a good deed because the sense of pride you get from acting kind - that pride is a sin. the word "manipulation" is not without bias or stigma attached to it. many people with the fawn response are direct victims of someone who was malignantly manipulative. calling the victims manipulative too is an unfair and unkind reading of the situation. it would be better and more empathetic to say it is safety-seeking or connection-seeking behavior. yes, it can be toxic. no, in general it is not intended to be toxic. there is no reason to make mentally ill people feel worse for what we undergo.

you type why is everyone so quick to turn on someone showing clear signs of trauma but you already know the fucking answer, so what's the point of bothering. you kind of hate those this is what anxiety looks like! infographics because at this point you're so good at white-knuckling through a severe panic attack that people just think you're stoic. even people who know the situation sometimes comment you just don't seem depressed. and you're not a 9 year old white kid so there's no way you're on the spectrum, you're not obsessed with trains and you were never a good mathematician. okay then.

mental illness is trending. in 2012 tumblr said don't romanticize our symptoms but to be fair tiktok didn't exist yet. there's these series of videos where someone pretends to be "the most boring person on earth" and is just being a normal fucking person, which makes your skin crawl, because that probably means you are boring. your friend reads aloud a profile from tinder - no depressed bitches i fucking hate that mental illness crap. your father says that medication never actually works.

you still haven't told your grandmother that you're in therapy. despite everything (and the fact it's helping): you just don't want her to see you differently.

#writeblr #warm up #to be clear let me state again: i think you should id however you fucking want if it helps you seek peace #but there is a HUGE difference between being like '.... im undiagnosed but i think i might be X'#and a person who is like ''omg my intrusive thoughts made me buy a birkin!!!''#babe mine made me throw up bc they disgusted me so much <3 #mine made me hurt myself evenly. even when i wanted to stop. i have had to put my hand on the stove MULTIPLE TIMES #and again i'd rather have 10000 people get help for something they don't need help for #than have 1 kid NOT get help #but there has GOTTTTT to be a middle ground here #bc at this point it isn't ''raising awareness''#it's . fucking misinformation. and ''what this picture says about you!!!!!''#& yes! im mostly talkin about ppl who are actually disgusted and offended by signs of mental illness #but use it to defend THEIR actions #like babe you hate when kids start yelling in the walmart? but you YOuRSELF can yell?#you are depressed so it's fine you were cruel to your spouse?#but if your spouse spends too much time in bed she's a lazy fuck?#your partner needs to do everything for you bc of your history in trauma? but when SHE has needs she's being clingy and gross?#HUGE difference here between whom i think most of my followers are btw. like #all it takes is fucking anyyyy empathy or kindness . like.#anyway it's hard to explain im hoping we all know the person im talking about lol

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