#It’s pro and anti at the same time...?

[khorai]

Same Anon as before. Do you have any unpopular opinions about certain characters?

A lot even but i will only talk about my opinions regarding the characters from the Naruto manga that I appreciate - if I expand, we'll be here tomorrow - .

Firstly, let's start with Sakura.

I don't understand why some—actually, many—of her own fans say she is poorly written.

She isn't...?

Sakura has issues concerning her character, but it has NOTHING to do with bad writing but more about her role in the story and how she was used. As for her character itself, she-is-not-poorly-written.

Honestly, I hate this claim because it gives the impression that her character is bad when that's not the case at all.

Coming from the antis, it's not surprising —they can't even understand the character of their own favorite, so understanding Sakura's character would be a miracle— but from her "stan"?

Just...no.

She is not poorly written, and that's my final word on it. I'm more than tired of hearing this nonsense. Yes, the narrative failed her many times— like many other characters, for that matter —but it's not the "bad writing" of her character to blame, but rather Kishimoto's inability to focus on characters other than Sasuke and Naruto.

Another unpopular opinion about her is that I HATE fanon versions of Sakura (and when I say fanon, I also mean popular headcanons about her circulating in the fandom).

It may sound extreme, but you'll quickly understand why:

Initially, it was actually the opposite. I loved it because I enjoyed seeing the different iterations of her that fans could create. It was always refreshing to read other versions of Sakura in fanfic—that admittedly had little to do with the original—growing and experiencing incredible things. I liked that.

And then things got worse.

For some reason, many of her fans —and antis as well— started confusing her canon version and her fanon version (some takes on her are so OC that I sometimes wonder if we're talking about the same person), while others began to claim that she should have had techniques like mokuton in the canon.

... What do they think Sakura is?

Naruto and Sasuke?

If they want their headcanon to be somewhat plausible in the context of canon, at least give her something that aligns with his philosophy of hard work.

Mokuton, from what I know, only manifests through the Senju lineage. If she had it in the canon, she would have to be descended from a Senju —naturally or artificially, it doesn't matter— and honestly... I disagree.

That's not Sakura.

This girl is a titan of her own making, partly thanks to her courage and hard work, and then thanks to Tsunade and Shizune -bless these ladies-

I would never want her to have power-ups like Naruto; it would negate everything she has done since the beginning of the manga, and that's just a big no.

I can understand her fans being upset about her treatment by Kishimoto —I am too, a lot— but that doesn't mean we should change her character to fit a shoddy female version of her male counterparts; that's just rude.

It wouldn't even be the same person anymore.

My last unpopular opinion about her (I have many more, but I'll just stop here) is that she deserved better.

... I classify this as an unpopular opinion because what I mean by that is not: "she deserved better than Sasuke" or "she deserved to be with Naruto" or AGAIN "she should have gotten over Sasuke" or some other thing like "she should have had some super powerful ability."

No, what I mean is that Sakura deserved her own arc.

An arc in which she wouldn't have to carry the weight of the shinobi world's guilt on her shoulders as usual - if Konoha is messed up, it's not her fault-

An arc in which we could see her actually experience her other skills, have other epic battles, build other relationships, break free from the grip of Team 7 in general.

She's supposed to be the heroine of the manga, but Kishimoto treated her like a supporting character with way too much screen time.

Damn, we don't even know what her home life is like.

We don't even really see her parents in the manga, and why is that?

Because she doesn't have an overly tragic background to make Hades pale?

Because she doesn't have balls?

Compared to her teammates, she doesn't matter, is that it?

The only thing we see her do again and again is blame herself for things beyond her control.

Like...why?!

Kishimoto made her some kind of martyr of pain, and it infuriates me every time I think about it.

The worst part is that many of her own fans sweep this under the rug and prefer to argue about who "deserves her."

Sasuke here, Naruto there... is she a piece of meat?

It's almost taboo to talk about the real problems surrounding her character in this fandom without someone mentioning how "Sasuke doesn't deserve her, and Naruto is much better" or how "Sakura is obsessed with Sasuke's dick."

...

Lol.

Next, Sasuke.

Sasuke deserved better...

and

Sasuke was wrong...

are notions that should more often go hand in hand.

His redemption journey was a good idea because, no matter what his most zealous fans say about it, Sasuke needed that journey.

Konoha hurt him, and it's easy to become an apologist for his character given all the crap he went through, mainly because of the incompetent authorities of this crappy village, but... that doesn't change the fact that he is not without blame and that he also did messed up things.

However... I don't like the resolution of his character arc.

Once again, Kishimoto reminded us in the cruelest way possible that Naruto is a classic Shounen, and the protagonist must always be right.

To the detriment of Sasuke.

Attention, I'm not saying that Naruto's view was wrong and Sasuke's was right because that's far from the case.

What annoyed me is the way the author handled it.

It seemed like Sasuke was almost wrong to think the way he did, when given his situation, his reaction was actually expected and normal. I really don't like how he put Naruto's opinions on a pedestal at the end of manga.

He gave Sasuke a completely independent story that didn't revolve around Naruto's sphere of influence -quite rare even today in the Shounen era- .

He endowed him with his own will.

Literally more than Naruto, it was Sasuke who led the dance in the manga, and why in the end?

So that everything would go in the direction of the protagonist?

And that, without even serious questioning of the Konoha system?

What was the point of Naruto knowing the truth about the Uchiha massacre then?

So yes, I don't like what Kishimoto did to Sasuke's character in the end; I find it unfair to him.

I classify this as an unpopular opinion because, even though I'm not a fan of the resolution of his character arc, that doesn't mean I'm "pro-revolution" or that I think Sasuke did nothing wrong, because he did.

This brings me to my second unpopular opinion about this character:

Sasuke is not a revolutionary.

He is not the character built to challenge the system that some of his fans think he is.

Like… since when did Sasuke become someone who could change Konoha's system in the first place?

That was never his goal; the only thing that led him to make that infamous statement was anger and betrayal he felt towards Konoha. It was his obsession with revenge that led to this thought, and nothing else.

Moreover, excuse me, but his plan was crappy.

Eliminate all Kage, okay.

Take the lead of all the villages, okay.

Launch a revolution and change the system...

As if the other shinobi of the alliance would just stare at him and do nothing -_-

His idea was doomed to fail from the start.

I'm theorizing a bit here, but basically, here's the deal:

Does he really think he can eliminate the entire Shinobi alliance? (because that's what he would have had to do to achieve his goal)

With what help?

That of Team Taka?

Lol.

Yes, Sasuke is powerful, but even he couldn't have pulled off this feat without becoming ridiculously overpowered (even more than at the end of the manga).

The only thing this plan would have brought if executed would have been to alienate all Shinobi nations against him (well, he already did it, but it would have been even worse).

And if, by some miracle, his plan had worked - if he had succeeded in his revolution - it would have just caused decades and decades of war between rebel factions - because there would be if we still follow the logic of the manga - wanting to return to the old times, others wanting power for themselves, and others simply refusing to let power go to an Uchiha (let's not forget the reputation of this clan).

Moreover, to change a system hundreds of years old in a world governed by the law of the strongest, it takes much more than violence and a strong desire for revenge.

He would need many brains at his disposal: tacticians, politicians, doctors, advisers...

In short, he would need allies he could trust and who would not betray him.

Unless he wants to be a bully, which honestly seems more likely to me.

He would need the help of countless geniuses in each field for this revolution to be successful, and from what the manga tells us, all these people are in the alliance.

... Who would want to work for him willingly after all he would have done?

And even if there are people willing to do so, it will always be with the fear of possible betrayal.

If even Madara and Hashirama - alias shinobi gods in their time - needed strong allies to create Konoha and make it a prosperous nation...

(even though it went to hell afterward, but still)

What will Sasuke do with a partially destroyed nation that he will have to rebuild with his own hands?

And let's not even talk about the fact that he was consumed by revenge and half-crazy when he talked about this revolution.

I still can't believe there are people who take these words seriously.

I really wonder what kind of revolution they expected with Sasuke in that state of mind?

If it had happened, it would have led to two possible situations:

The death of the last surviving Uchiha or an even more gruesome massacre than the one that wiped out his clan.

Although, considering those who support this pseudo-revolution among his fanbase, the latter option would have suited them just fine.

Another reason that honestly makes me think this thing is stupid is that it doesn't align with the manga's vision.

Kishimoto, despite the few innovative takes he has made several times regarding the plot and some characters, remains a staunch traditionalist. Sasuke would never have become a villain, and he would never have been killed either; that would go against Naruto's dream.

He would also never have become a "revolutionary" challenging the system.

It's not his role; he's not the protagonist.

The character of Sasuke - like all the others, in fact - exists within the limits of the plot; we cannot go beyond and make his character something it was never supposed to be.

Although, for me, it's a good thing that he isn't because his plan was just as bad as Naruto's flawed idealistic vision.

I still think that if Kishimoto had made them talk normally for once, without them having to almost kill each other, if he had made them come to a compromise that would have combined their two ideas, it wouldn't have been as half-baked in the end.

To choose between the plague and cholera, he should have just paired them together -_-

But no, he had to choose nardo's protagonist vision.

Another opinion about Sasuke is his relationship with Naruto, which I find... shaky? overestimated? poorly written?

They share a strong bond, that's an undeniable truth, and you'd have to be pretty stupid to deny that.

It's the main bond in the manga, after all.

But in terms of friendship... I have doubts.

For me, the only reason I believe Sasuke and Naruto are friends is that Kishimoto said so.

We hardly see it in the manga.

Their relationship literally built on years of objectification, selfishness, disdain, rivalry, misunderstanding, resentment, and a huge savior complex.

Naruto made Sasuke his priority not out of genuine concern but because he wanted to prove he was worthy of being Hokage, and for that, Sasuke had to come back at all costs.

That's not friendship; it's selfishness and objectification.

Oh, I don't doubt that he cared, but the problem is that the manga doesn't really show us that.

Moreover, this idea that "Naruto understands Sasuke" is, for me, a bunch of nonsense.

Maybe he does so at a superficial level because of their slightly similar experiences, but if we go deeper?

Naruto doesn't really understand him, and it showed particularly when he learned the truth about the Uchiha massacre.

For Sasuke, it's more complicated.

He has a lot of mitigating circumstances that actually explain his behavior (Itachi being alive, the curse of hatred).

But in general, he played the role of an antagonist for most of Shippuden, and the fact that his character arc didn't revolve around Naruto made him some kind of insensitive jerk to everyone - at least on the surface - .

If Sasuke wanted to take revenge on the world, Naruto wanted to save him.

And neither of them was willing to give in on that.

I'm not going to judge Naruto for not caring about Sasuke's goals after Itachi's death. Who in their right mind would support such a plan?

It was supporting a one-way ticket to self-destruction.

And I'm not going to judge Sasuke for the numerous attempts to kill Naruto because that would be unfair.

However, what I judge is how Kishimoto made their communication impossible.

When they start talking seriously, it always has to end with one of them almost dying at the last moment.

Even Vegeta and Goku had more civilized discussions than these two, and that says something.

I like their relationship, but I sometimes find it hard to label them as friends, let alone best friends.

There's a lot of things that haven't been well-managed in there.

Third opinion:

Sasuke is not evil.

He is not the cold, emotionless individual that more than half of this God-forsaken fandom wants him to be.

I never thought I'd classify this as an unpopular opinion, but considering the nonsense I've seen about him, I had to do it. According to this fandom, both among his stans and antis, Sasuke is abusive, sexist, possessive, indifferent, unfaithful, easily manipulable, selfish, a lousy father, and the list goes on.

Of course, he is none of that, but it's always amusing to see people forcing their fantasies onto his character. This guy has always marched to the beat of his own drum; he has no more official truth about him other than this, and that really irritates a lot of people.

Now, onto his big brother:

Itachi... is not a good person (I still can't believe I have to say this).

He is not even a martyr from my perspective.

I really dislike how his character is glorified in certain parts of the fandom. But at the same time, I don't like how he's demonized among the antis.

Itachi is not an angel, but he is not a demon either.

He's selfish and an unparalleled manipulator, but that doesn't make him evil. He can also be gentle, warm, and incredibly loving - though he has a peculiar way of showing it- .

He's a character with a messed-up mentality, and I love him for that. I hate seeing his character being destroyed by people trying to fit him into boxes he doesn't truly belong to; it annoys me.

In the end, Itachi is a tragic character who found himself forced to make horrible choices. His life was just immensely... torturous.

I love him, but given all the mess he caused, his death was both expected and deserved.

He was tired, disillusioned, sick, and with a list of Uchiha deaths as long as Tobirama's (not to mention what he did to his brother). So no, the idea that he shouldn't have died is truly ridiculous.

Please, let this tormented man find peace in his death.

I'll stop here because at this point, these are not even unpopular opinions but downright diatribes.

#ask #anon ask #I don't even know how to tag this #It’s pro and anti at the same time...? #sakura haruno #sasuke uchiha #itachi uchiha #anti naruto fandom #anti fanon sakura #anti fanon sasuke #I hope it's not crostagging I'm doing #please excuse any mistakes it's not my native language #sorry for the messy response anon #my thoughts were a bit of a mess when i wrote this

[antianakin]

Had a thought, I think what's bothering a lot of people about recent Force stuff is that Filoni/new shows are treating the Force like a "soft magic" system. As in it's flexible to whatever the plot is and the few rules can change. Vs the more solid "hard magic" system the original stuff operates on. Only certain people have it, there's established things it can do, and it's main point of flexibility is that if you don't think you can do a thing with the Force, you can't.

Like movies/clone wars/even Rebels establishes that having the Force is an innate thing and while non Force users can "hear" the Force (various other practices we see like Chirrut) they can't utilize it. That there's certain abilities are things everyone has and more rare abilities exist but don't seem to be learned (at least not easily). I'm even willing to say Force Healing works in the og system set up in that it's a rare ability and it takes energy. You can't bring someone back from the brink of death without killing yourself or someone else.

But things like Sabine suddenly able to use the Force or Ahsoka able to use abilities out of nowhere and established to be innate and rare basically throws the hard rules out and gives it a confusing inconsistency that just makes it unenjoyable.

I think the problem is, in part, that canon itself treats the Force as both soft AND hard, depending on what aspect you're talking about, because Star Wars runs on Rule of Cool sort-of above and beyond anything else sometimes. For example, the Force Ghosts. Even within the original trilogy, the implications about how the Ghosts work seems to change from ANH to ROTJ, and then you get into the prequels and TCW and the sequels and now the Mandoverse and the Ghosts are just... wackier and wackier every time. There are NO RULES for the Force Ghosts beyond that the person ghosting should be definitively dead, not a Sith when they died, and they should look bluish. Like that's... really it. Beyond that, everyone seems to do whatever the fuck they want with it and they always have, even Lucas himself.

And then you have other things that seem to have remained fairly static this entire time even if they went unsaid, like who is capable of wielding the Force and who isn't, whether it's something you're born with or just something some people can learn easier than others. Up until the Ahsoka show, everybody seemed to agree on this one, so even though it's never been outright stated in canon that you HAVE to be born with the ability to wield the Force or you'll never be able to, it's just a generally accepted part of the worldbuilding and one that a LOT of the character narratives sort-of rely on. BUT, because it's never been outright stated and OTHER elements of the Force and how it's used can be pretty "soft magic", I suppose it's not shocking that eventually someone would try to switch this one up. It's infuriating and it's bad writing just because what little we DO know about it is so important to how these storylines go, but it's not shocking.

It's not like I hate "soft magic" systems in general, but in a lot of those stories, how the magic WORKS isn't actually important to the story being told most of the time. Like in Lord of the Rings, how Gandalf can do magic is completely irrelevant to the themes and messages sent through the story of Frodo and the Ring and the Fellowship. It doesn't MATTER.

But in Star Wars, the way the Force works is baked into the themes and messages of the whole ass story. What darkness is, where it comes from, what balance means and how it can be achieved, all of this is VITAL to the story being told throughout the first six films. And so a lot of the little stuff that gets added to the overall "how the Force works" stuff (psychometry, midichlorians, etc) should all sort-of work within those overall themes already set up. Midichlorians are important because Anakin is DEMONSTRABLY super powerful, more than anybody else in history, and it DOESN'T MATTER. He's literally MEASURABLY more powerful than anybody else and he still fails to do anything he actually wants to do. His power makes it so that his choices change the fate of an entire galaxy, but they're also completely useless in any way that actually matters to him. The fact that they can measure his power helps that message get across. Psychometry takes a lot of the stuff about how the Force allows you to dial into the emotions of other people and just takes it up an extra notch to really hammer home some of those themes about control over your own power and being connected to the world around you.

So Star Wars, in many ways, DOES have a "soft" magic system, it always has, but the things that are changed or added to it SHOULD generally still fit within the overall themes and messages that Star Wars has set up prior to this. Sabine being Force sensitive randomly very explicitly goes AGAINST all of these themes and messages and that's why it sucks. Changing the system so that literally ANYBODY could have the Force if they just worked hard enough at it (and having Sabine gain her ability to wield it only when she FEELS the most emotions as opposed to when she CONTROLS her emotions the best) completely fucks up a lot of the narratives for other characters. What makes Luke so special if literally ANYBODY could have just learned to do what he did, but apparently they just weren't trying hard enough? If Ahsoka felt this way this entire time why wasn't she training up TONS of people in the Rebellion to utilize the Force, why was she HOBBLING the Rebellion by keeping this from them? It's just... SO so stupid in so many ways. Why does Filoni seem to think that fans want the space wizards to be LESS special? It's ridiculous and it's insulting.

I think that at this point we're also just VERY tired of Filoni's blatant favoritism for his own characters and the ways he very intentionally will bash other characters in order to lift up his own faves, and quite honestly THAT'S what pisses me off the most about the Ahsoka show. Sabine and Ahsoka can't be special on their own, they HAVE to call the prequels Jedi failures because they were elitist in order to make Sabine and Ahsoka seem like they're so much better and more enlightened than those OTHER Jedi. And that honestly just stinks of a lack of imagination on Filoni's part. If he can't figure out how to make these characters feel special without tearing down other characters in this franchise to do it, then maybe he's just not that good of a fucking writer to begin with.

So while I'm not PERSONALLY a fan of the way the Force is often very "soft" in the way it's written, that doesn't make it bad in and of itself, but Filoni (and the Mandoverse in general, but mostly Filoni) feels like he's actively flipping the bird at prior accepted assumptions about the worldbuilding and the way those things really helped build the NARRATIVE just because he wants to insist that HIS characters are NOT IRRELEVANT and are in fact more important and cooler than everybody else. When I consume a Star Wars story, I'm EXPECTING something about how it's better to accept and acknowledge your own darkness so you can let it go and control it rather than letting it control you. I'm EXPECTING something about being selfless and compassionate over being selfish and greedy. I'm EXPECTING something about how destiny exists but it isn't everything and your choices still MATTER (both good and bad). And that's just... not what Filoni gave me. The things he changed DON'T suit the narrative of Star Wars, regardless of whether the Force is a soft magic system or not.

#star wars #dave filoni critical #filoni critical #mandoverse critical #ahsoka show critical #anti ahsoka show #ahsoka tano #jedi #pro jedi #sabine wren critical #sabine critical #so for example: sabine being force sensitive COULD'VE been... fine #it still would've been STUPID to retcon her into a force user but it's not any stupider than bringing maul back in tcw #BUT #sabine being force sensitive SHOULD'VE still worked the same way it always works #she should've been born with it but for whatever reason just had been weak enough in it that no one noticed it or something #she should've had to learn to control her own emotions #she should've had CONSEQUENCES for her selfish choices #ahsoka should've been RIGHT about letting go of ezra the first time and sabine should've let AHSOKA go later #like making sabine force sensitive was (no pun intended) forced and always would've been so #but it still could've been done RIGHT without violating some of the primary themes that make star wars what it is

[lorcandidlucienwill]

SJM will write the most boring MC romances but then she'll write the best side character romance and suck me in😭😭😭😭😭

#i love and hate sjm at the same time #elorcan #ruhnlidia #elucien #anti feysand #anti nessian #better than rowaelin #it's those damn side characters #lorcan salvaterre #lord lorcan lochan #elide lochan #ruhn danaan #pro lucien vanserra

[autistic-katara]

oh my god can ppl find a reason to ship/not ship something that’s in the middle of a ship war w/o trying to make out the other character to be the worst person in existence? honest to god it’s not that hard to say “this ship doesn’t work for me bcz of xyz” u rlly do not need to go “uhhh actually no it’s not character a that’s a horribly racist asshole who thinks SA is cool (that’s so stupid wtf, they barely did anything), its character b. did u not see how they [smallest thing possible]??? can’t believe the hypocrisy u have going on here…” like seriously PLEASE u do not have to justify urself to this level it just makes everything 10x more annoying

#kataang/z*tara ship war posting in the year 2023? more likely than u think. #also abt the whole jancy/st*ncy thing but this was spurred by me seeing a kataang v zk argument where both ppl just sounded so insufferable #literally “aang is so racist for not liking this one water tribe dish” “actually zuko dismissing aang’s anti-revenge philosophy is the same #as the great grandkid of an ss officer making fun of jewish culture” #(not even exaggerating they both said that basically verbatim) #like babes please it’s really not that serious- #i hate how this happens every time there’s a ship war that’s boy x girl v same girl x different boy #it’s always “erm actually it’s implied in one frame in s1 that boy 1 hates black ppl bcz of the red x over the black background” #“oh yeah? well boy 2 was an asshole pre-character development so he’s definitely homophobic as hell” #with minimal mention of the girl u guys r shipping them with #like look i love kataang nd while jancy might not be my fav of all time i still ship them #but holy shit u guys can be as annoying as the zk/st*ncy shippers u claim to hate #idk this is just a problem i have with fandoms a lot nd i needed to yell abt it #rant #ship wars #fandom bs #atla #kataang #pro aang #pro zuko #ryan shut the fuck up

[grayluforever]

He’s not even really a good dad either since he doesn’t know a thing about Octavia’s interests and uses her as an excuse to leave the house

#anti stolas #octavia deserves better #stella deserves better #STOLAS IS NOT A GOOD FATHER #anti vivizepop #i'm so sick and tired of people calling stolas a good dad #HE IS NOT A GOOD FATHER #tw neglect #and yet people are still making shit up about stella #but next time we see him he's the same cheating toxic asshole #can we also not forget this guy literally FLIRTED with his affair in FRONT of his child #pro stella goetia

[daenerysies]

it’s hard to take some individuals seriously on this app (or ANY social media app since they use the same talking points that can be disproved with a quick google search or idk OPENING THE BOOK) when they go on and on and on about how the series as a whole is only about ‘feudalism BAD’ which YES it is but this is a fictional f a n t a s y series and deliberately choosing to ignore that grrm is known for using his work to critique multiple points of interest and maybe, just maybe, he can critique the monarchy and still bring up other talking points; like how rhaenyra was usurped due to misogyny (it’s also weird the number of people that don’t seem to care about grrm creating the amethyst empress and the bloodstone emperor as direct parallels to rhaenyra and aegon and how each event affects the world of asoiaf but whatever).

it’s ridiculous to claim you’re team green (which means you want aegon to be king, not that you like tg characters) and in response to those on the other side try to take the ‘moral high ground’ by ONLY mentioning how the monarchy is bad when rhaenyra, a potential female ruler, is involved (which is a bit on the nose, don’t you think?) stanning team green and being anti targaryen is almost point blank the definition of hypocrisy. trying to claim you support them bc they were being neglected/abused (even though most of the abuse came directly from their mother and grandfather) which apparently gives them the ‘right’ to steal the throne, or the use of andal tradition (not law) as a way to demean rhaenyra’s position as heir, or even how they only want what’s ’best’ for the realm and aegon is that; despite how he very much would have been aegon the unworthy before we even made it to aegon iv’s generation; and no, you can’t use ‘he had a better council!’ when he fired anyone who didn’t immediately give him what he wants i.e. removing otto as hand bc of him not wanting to resort completely to bloodshed during the dance.

so feudalism is fine if it benefits alicent? aegon? aemond? but i thought all targaryen’s are evil and should go extinct? and aren’t alicent’s children TARGARYENS? so by spreading anti targaryen rhetoric you should be happy that the green’s entire bloodline was wiped out, right? it’s normal to like/dislike certain characters but to state that an entire house should be obliterated whilst liking the characters that exacerbate the worst traits of said house (or are enablers of said behavior) is especially rich, and would really be downright hilarious if it didn’t showcase how insincere and sanctimonious some can be in this fandom. stop constantly moving the goalpost and just admit that your views contradict one another regularly, it would make it a million times easier to engage with you.

#asoiaf #f&b #hotd #rhaenyra targaryen #anti team green #anti targ antis #anti alicent hightower #anti aegon ii targaryen #anti aemond targaryen #anti team green stans #you cannot be anti targaryen #and anti feudalism #and proudly wave your team green banner #AT THE SAME TIME #*mindblown* #the amethyst empress #the bloodstone emperor #fandom critical #rant post #pro rhaenyra

[hyp3rfixation-h3ll]

not to get into discourse mode on here but the recent shit w/ ao3 being once again called out for being run by racists/genocide supporters and seeing so many fucking Absolute Gormless Shitheads blindly defend OTW and going " dOn'T bRiNg FiCtIoNaL PoLiTicS iNtO tHis!!!111!1 " as if they are not immune to propaganda is wild . my siblings in sin , ao3 is literally The Racism Fetish Fanfiction site , and propaganda via fictional work is exactly how racism perpetuates. ao3 and the otw are a part of the problem whether you choose to acknowledge it or not because they contribute to the cycle of violence , fetishisation and colonisation of marginalised groups via complacency (and sometimes even blatant PASSIVE ENCOURAGEMENT) , and then they cover it up by using soft cutesy buzzwords like " anti-censorship " and " free speech " and their dumb ass complex tagging system to appeal to white people , so when Actual Minorities and people affected by the shit they put on there speak up about it they're met with all kinds of bullcrap about "jUsT bLoCk ThE tAg If It'S a PrObLem1111!111" or "YoU'rE jUsT bEiNg a fAnDoM cOp!11!!"

You're a part of the problem if you support ao3 and actively continue to use it & donate to them , especially in the wake of the OTW being actively chockful of zionists who will , ironically , silence those who speak up and rally with Palestine for liberation . And If you decide to take this as me being hostile towards you or trying to " bring fiction into real world issues " , remember that at Any point in time you can go on ao3 for yourself and find thousands and thousands of raceplay fics and other various works that glorify and condone racism , and that the otw and their large userbase (primarily composed of white people!) has a track record of trying to shut up POC when this issue is brought to light .

Idgaf if ao3 is for " anti-censorship " , because there's a difference between anti-censorship and HIDING BEHIND the concept of free speech and the 1st amendment to do and say awful , horrendous things and believe you're above critique , punishment or consequences for it .

tl;dr: fuck ao3, fuck the otw, free palestine, and most importantly: you are NOT and will NEVER be immune to propaganda if you choose to ignore it because it benefits you.

#the captain's rambles #ao3 #archive of our own #racism cw #free palestine #🍉 #otw #ask to tag #also its dumb to request not bringing politics into the topic of ao3 #the concept of anti / pro-censorship Is a political statement #anyways. this isnt even touching on the nasty shit ao3 will let you put on their site about Real People (INCLUDING REAL CHILDREN) #mfs be like “you guys are so worried about fictional kids!11!!” yeah cuz if thats what youre willing to write about fictional kids #then how the Fuck am i supposed to trust Your bitch ass with writing about Real Children in a Normal manner #btw ao3 / otw bootlickers who try n come in here and go ERM ACKSHUALLY will be shot at on sight by my rocket launcher #fiction bleeds into reality and can and DOES influence it you dickless jabronies . that's Literally why The Jaws Effect is a phenomenon #and why racist propaganda (like what the IOF spreads) is so effective #you cannot rally against the oppressor and side with them at the same time because “muh fanfic site” #pick a side or get out you spineless fucks #oh and btw. if you try to equate this with just mindless discourse you're incorrect and undermining the larger issue here #which is Literally #otw and ao3 are built off of racist and arguably white supremacist values and THAT is why they fire people -- #-- for having the oh so heinous opinion of “hey. racism is Bad.” and allow fics that condone racism and fetishise it on their site. #and post. this has been your once in a lifetime tumblr rant from sonic t hedgehog about why white people in fandom more often than not #fucking suck Butt Ass & absolute Balls #im gonna go shower and get some tuna now

[moonlightdancer26]

Marauder stans really be like “my unpopular Harry Potter opinions” and then say things like:

Snape is not nice

Sirius was treated badly by his parents

James and Lily died on October 31st

Regulus cared about Kreacher

Remus is a werewolf

Harry is an orphan

Peter betrayed the Marauders

Voldemort killed people

#like dude i swear no one is arguing otherwise 💀 #it’s either plain facts or criminally popular opinions #no in between #whenever i see these tiktoks pop up i know it’s the same thing every time istg #anti snaters #anti marauders stans #anti marauderfen #harry potter #severus snape #pro snape #pro severus snape #snape #anti marauders stan #hp #shitpost

[starlight-vixen-emiko]

EmoNette: Orange is such an ugly color!

Luka: *chuckles* You're so beautiful when you hate the world.

EmoNette: I don't hate you. 💖

Luka: I don't hate you too. 💙

#lukanette #pro lukamari #technically this is Luka and Evil!Marinette but still counts! #incorrect quotes #source: avatar the last airbender #yes I will stan for the blue couple and the red couple at the same time! #maiko antis fuck off challenge!

[skiploomz]

how can someone be both anti inclusion AND anti exclusion?

#u realise policing the right way to be queer and excluding ppl for their identity IS exclusionism u get that yes u understand it right #somehow both dni male lesbians and female gays AND transmeds and anti xenogender ppl???? am i going insane. #how can u b pro xenogender yet not understand that sometimes multigender ppl will be lesbians and men at the same time #or that someone can transition to be a woman but still feel comfortable with identifying as a gay man #like these are very simple concepts. how can u be anti transmed and pro telling trans ppl how theyre allowed to identify? ur a transmed. #vent #complaining #discourse #SORRY im not trying to start drama this just perplexes and infuriates me

[craycraybluejay]

Btw i do block anti para discoursers. If u believe in thought crime you're going to annoy the shit out of me if you're not just full on trying to harm people who aren't doing anything wrong. And I don't want someone like you around me. Also it feels like abuse apologia and false conflation of a thought or feeling with abuse. And that is cruel to victims of abuse.

only exception is if we're mutuals and you in good faith want to learn more about why the idea of thought crime is BAD NEWS. Oh yeah and it puts innocent people behind bars, and i don't mean for stuff like csem which actually is abuse. What I'm referring to is known as Obscenity Law in the US, barring the possession or distribution of ANY generally legal pornography if it "doesn't align with your community's values" and "is obscene/gross" and "has no artistic merit," all of which are extremely subjective and up to judges, juries, and lawyers. Don't panic though, furries and bdsm likers and lolicon havers. These things alone are not illegal, and you cannot be charged for obscenity law unless someone specifically goes through the effort to take you to court with an incredibly good lawyer. Basically, unless you think that someone who has legally obtained proof (e.g: not stolen, etc.), a lot of money, and a burning hate for you, and you live in a very conservative community, the chances you will ever have to deal with obscenity law are extremely low to none.

#pro para #obscenity law #us law #disclaimer that i am not a lawyer and simply heavily into law research of all kinds but cannot give legal advice as a lawyer #(yet) (might become a lawyer someday idk we'll see) #paraphile safe #thought crime #btw antis before you use the legality argument as a gotcha for the millionth time #your cute fluffy gay fanfic with no age difference can still apply under obscenity law #tw csem mention #also 'proship antipara' people are cringe as hell #if you can acknowledge that thinking about a character is not abuse you can acknowledge the same of thinking ab something real #cause thing is thinking about something does nothing to anyone #like right now im choosing to think about killing idk some guy walking his dog. the guy and the dog are fine and alive and well. #nothing happened or will happen #hope that helps

[unforth]

Y'all (general) really really need to exercise the block buttons more.

An opinion you don't agree with? Someone makes you uncomfortable? Something you don't like? Even just a person whose way of presenting information makes you uncomfortable (even if you agree with them)?

Block.

BLOCK.

B.L.O.C.K.

Look, I get it. I used to think seeing opinions I didn't agree with was important, that exposing myself was a way of staying informed. But finally, I hit a breaking point - I already knew the viewpoints I disagreed with, and seeing them every day was making me miserable.

I've blocked liberally since then.

And the most remarkable thing happened: I routinely see posts where lots of people are disagreeing with the same person...and I already have that person blocked.

Because the most insidious thing about letting myself see the negativity and things that made me unhappy all the time is that leaving it all there gave me the impression that there were a LOT of vocally awful people saying things that hurt me.

But there aren't.

There's actually a surprisingly small number of people who get off on trolling or are so marinated in hate that they have to spew it all around them, and when you block those people, the world gets much more peaceful.

You're not growing as a person by exposing yourself to rhetoric that hurts you. You're just hurting, which is exactly how those people want you to feel: they want you to be in as much agony as they are.

Don't give them the satisfaction.

BLOCK THEM.

(tbh I've hit the point that I think people who willfully, deliberately, loudly, intentionally don't block are engaging in a form of self-harm. seriously, you're not taking a noble stand, no one cares if you don't block except the people hurting you.)

#unforth rambles #my mutuals all know this so i'm preaching to the choir #did i see a bad jiang cheng take again #yes yes i did #but specifically i saw a bad jiang cheng take triggered by anti deciding to vent stupidity instead of blocking the things they didn't like #and then a stan engaging instead of also blocking #both these people would be happier if they blocked #like antis you do realize if you hate a character your best bet is to block the people who love them right #sorry the back and forth is just exhausting #i blocked the anti #and i almost blocked the pro too #stop engaging it's pointless just do your own thing and block the people who you don't agree with #it's not creating an echo chamber #i promise you're not a better person because you let the same terf or anti or racist or whoever #expose you to their toxicity over and over #you've already given them a hearing by reading their first drivel ya know the one that led you to block them #if you know enough to know they're terrible why would you want to give them a hearing on literally any other topic #block and move on #there are so many better people out there who are actually worth your time and energy

[vampirepunks]

It’s important to understand that, at the heart of the matter, pro-ship equals anti-harassment.

Yes, pro-ship can mean different things to different people. No label is a monolith. Some pro-shippers have underage/incest/Dead Dove/etc ships and some have zero. Being pro-ship doesn’t automatically equate to being okay with that kind of content, but sure, some are. What’s important is: “I’m pro-ship” doesn’t directly translate to, “I have controversial ships,” but rather, “I don’t believe it’s okay to ostracize people over fiction.”

At the end of the day, it’s about recognizing the line between content that is measurably harming real human beings and content that simply makes you uncomfortable. Do you believe it’s immoral to attack and harass another person over a disagreement about fiction? Do you believe the appropriate action is to block and move on, rather than publicly shaming and/or privately berating whoever posted it? Do you believe it’s possible for someone to use “dark” content as a means of emotionally processing trauma? Then I consider you pro-ship.

#saw another anti ranting about this issue and yknow what? hate that noise #like I’m generally squicked out completely by certain content #but at the same time I’ll gladly defend someone’s right to enjoy it in their own space on the internet and not receive hate mail over it #fiction is fiction! there’s a gap between what we accept in real life and enjoy in concept! #example: most people who love fictional murderers wouldn’t defend a real-life serial killer #which again—MOST. there are exceptions but that’s another matter #so why are ships held to a much more rigid standard of what a person is allowed to enjoy and share? #enjoyment of fiction ≠ moral beliefs about reality #take Wincest as example. personally I HATE IT. i find it disgusting and disturbing. i block wincest shippers because of that. but! #if I see someone being literally cyberbullied over it I’m going to step in and say ‘hey not cool’ #does that make me okay with Wincest? absolutely not. but I am NOT okay with potentially damaging a human being’s mental health over it #pro ship #on fandom #logan.txt #on politics

[s0fter-sin]

being on twitter and seeing 18yr olds with “minors dni” in their bios is the weirdest thing ever

#lets be real #what the difference between and 18 yr old and a 17 yr old other than voting #youre probably still in high school #still live at home #dont have much if any real world experience #what happened just the day you turn 18 youre suddenly so far removed from someone whos a day before their 18th? #the amount of pro dead dove but with proshippers dni is concerning too #no one over there knows what proship means #which is weird bc i think it came from there to begin with #proship doesnt mean you like ‘problematic’ ships #its not an abbreviation #it means pro as in for #the same way anti means against #you could only ship the most wholesome canon thing in the world and still be a proshipper #it just means youre for shipping #i shouldnt have to explain this #im ship and let ship #i truly dont care what other people do in their private time #that by default makes me proship #but you cant just say that bc people dont believe you bc they think it means something else and you get death threats #its the wild west out there #coming out of my cage and ive been doing just fine.txt

[dirtytransmasc]

I think a lot of TB fans are mad that Alicent is "morally grey" in the way the wish Rhaenyra was, and that she's still doing "morally grey" better than her anyway, despite being a lot less morally grey and a lot more morally... fucked over and backed into a corner where she has to to do morally questionable things to keep her and her children alive... but I digress. I think they hate that Alicent is everything that they preach about when talking about Rhaenyra, while they shit on her with the very next breath.

this isn't even to say that Rhaenyra isn't morally grey, or that being morally grey makes her unlikable. she is, very truly, a morally grey character, and she can be very interesting when viewed as a flawed character with flawed decisions that aren't the best.

this also isn't to say Alicent's perfect, it's to say her hand being forced left and right, being made into a wounded animal that snaps at any hand that comes near it after years of being alone, hurting, neglected, and used, makes her a whole lot more complicated and morally less than grey.

#I don't think alicent is morally grey #I think she's morally complicated #and thats what a lot of Rhaenyra fans try and fool themselves into thinking Rhaenyra is #one has actively maimed murdered and walked over barely cooled corpses to get what she wants #hurt those around her to uphold her lies #the other tried to keep her children alive while causing as little hsrm as possible to a woman she fears may kill her children had she #become queen. not to mention most of her “wrong doings” were forced from her hand by the men in power around her and miniscule compared to #Rhaenyra's/TBs #very different situations #ones morally grey the other is morally screwed over left and right #anti team black #anti team black fans #anti rhaenyra targaryen #pro team green #pro alicent hightower #alicent hightower #she was trying to survive and keep her kids alive man #I can list on one hand all of her truthfully “wrong” actions snd even then they dont compare to nyra #9 times out of 10 she was a bit 'bitchy' and people try snd skin her for that #but again. nyra provoked that anger years ago when she treated Alicent the exact same way

[brokenorbornthatway]

Man it drives me up a wall to come across an anti saying shit like "but the slendermen incident" (whatever that is/was), "but people who emulate fictional serial killers", but but but whatever people who saw something fictional and used it to justify their bad choices.

Just.

You do realize that none of that takes away from the fact that fiction isn't real and the rules of reality should not be imposed on fiction right? People do absolutely horrible things to each other for more reasons than either you or I could possibly think up. Someone choosing to enact something awful they read in fiction isn't any different than someone choosing to do something awful because they read a news article about it.

Think about that for a second. People absolutely have emulated serial killers that they heard/read about from the news. So then, by anti logic, would the solution be to never talk about serial killers on the news ever again in case someone uses it to justify hurting someone else? I sure fucking hope not.

The problem isn't with the news and it isn't with fiction. The problem lies with the people who actually commit the heinous acts and societal issues we have that make it so easy for people to feel for whatever reason that they can and should turn to committing real acts of violence.

Working as a culture to destigmatize having violent thoughts and urges, educating from a young age about these thoughts and urges (and what do about them if you feel them or think someone else is), and providing ample resources for healthy non harmful way to embrace those thoughts and urges would go soooooooooooo much further than arbitrarily trying to police things that are only tangentially related to the core problem.

Honestly, it's my belief that almost (we won't say every because nothing is a monolith) every human alive has violent thoughts and urges to some to degree. We are still animals. We are highly intelligent apes, but apes nonetheless. Look at the violence in other apes and in beings all throughout the animal kingdom. We still have the instincts/genes/biological coding that drives us to hunt, kill, fight for territory, attack any possible threat, do whatever it takes to stay alive and sometimes these instincts+our intelligence lead to people wanting to or causing harm. Some people, for a myriad of reasons, struggle more with violent thoughts and tendencies than others.

I just think if we embraced and acknowledged violence as part of our nature on a foundational level and gave people the tools to handle it without shame or causing harm, there would be a massive reduction in violent crimes. This is done a little bit through things like contact sports, fighting sports, violent fiction and video games, etc, but I think proper education about why people want violent things in the first place would make a huge difference.

I just wish antis would stop pointing the blame of people who do violent things "because fiction told them it was ok" on fiction and point it at the people doing the violent things and the society that allows it instead

-an annoyed researcher

#proship #pro ship #profic #profiction #anti censorship #anti anti #can we please just #cease with the bullshit #and work together for real change that actually makes a difference #just #Jesus fucking Christ #we're all supposed to be on the same side #we all (all is a generalization here) are leftists who want societal change #a large portion of us are prison abolitionists on both sides #do we want to reform society or do we not? #wasting time arguing about fiction when we could be putting energy to debating and discussing what changes we want #and how we want to enact those changes so we can actually work on BUILDING something #I'm not saying fiction isn't important #fiction is incredibly important #but I'm just remorseful #imagine if antis could focus on doing things that will actually keep people safe? #we could have our differences in opinion but not allow it to stop us from doing the work #so much wasted potential