#anti-su critical

[sjbattleangel]

The Virgin Lily Orchard:

Sides with abusers

Lies about having Indigenous heritage

Is horrifically abusive to friends and family

Always sides with corporations

Writes awful revenge-fics out of spite

Fetishizes black women

Dismisses an entire cultural animation medium (anime) as "spankbait for perverts"

Wrote the worst writing advice ever

Has a pathetic vendetta against Rebecca Sugar for simply existing

Sends death threats to creators

Throws marginalized creators under the bus for not being "woke" enough

Lied about being a "highly sought-after writer" solely to spite Rebecca Sugar, ND Stevenson, Darron Nefcy, Dana Terrace and her sister

Hates Asians

Hates Jews

Holds nothing but contempt for animation

Wants all of animation to be nothing but slice-of-life romantic comedies

Wants the Hays code back

The Chad Rebecca Sugar:

One of the nicest people working in the industry

Has fought hard for diversity and representation in animation

Is incredibly talented

Is friends with Alex Hirsch (Gravity Falls), Matt Braly (Amphibia) and many others

Paved the way for more diverse creators

Has won multiple awards

Wrote and sang songs for Adventure Time

A non-binary, bisexual Jewish woman whose background and experiences influence her work

Created one of the most groundbreaking, inclusive, LGBTQ+ friendly shows of all time

Fought against higher-ups when they tried to censor the queerness of her work

Helped normalize discussions of kids' mental health

An uplifting inspiration to a generation of queer kids growing up

Influenced by both western animation and anime

Married to Ian Jones Quartey

#lily orchard #rebecca sugar #steven universe #lily orchard is a hack #anti-lily orchard #screw lily orchard #lily orchard critical #lily peet #cartoons #animated series #animation #virgin and chad #virgin vs chad #memes #meme #funny #jokes #anti-su critical #su critical critical #lily orchard is toxic

[autistic-ben-tennyson]

Still Salty About the Flanderization of Steven

Many SU fans have had to see these memes and are probably tired of them. I really hate the way people who have never even watched the show and probably just LO’s video flanderize Steven into a bumbling wimp or take scenes like him crying about wanting to be friends with Connie or trying to talk down Spinel out of context. People hate him for not killing his enemies on sight and act as if all he does is talk no jitsu. People act as if he’d die trying to redeem Big Jack Horner from Puss in Boots even though he’s met villains like Jack with Aquamarine and Eyeball and not only did he kick their asses but accepted that they were beyond help. Steven prefers to talk over fighting but isn’t stupid and knows when he has to get serious. Even during his “I can make a change” song that’s twisted out of context, he was still fighting defensively against Spinel. He just wasn’t fighting to kill. As for the meme above, did the creator watch Alien Force? The way Ben handled the Dragon, Reiny and the Highbreed would be pretty similar to how Steven would. The idealistic hero who teaches violence isn’t always the answer has already been done so why does Steven get the most hate for it?

I reblogged a post about this but I really am tired of how TOH is propped up as the anti SU when Dana is friends with Rebecca and praised the groundbreaking work Rupphire did. The Owl House crew doesn’t hate SU and wasn’t doing a “take that” by killing its villain or claiming not everyone can be talked down with a hug. They’re two different shows with different stories and themes. Steven would also know that some like Belos can’t be redeemed and he didn’t actually redeem the diamonds. He didn’t like them and acts uncomfortable around them in Future but he needed them to cure the corrupted gems. The point of the diamonds as well as Andy was not that you have to accept bigoted family members but a wish fulfillment where queer people could get their families to accept them. I saw this on Reddit but I think Steven gets so much hate because he teaches the idea that retributive violence isn’t always the solution and because he got a good life with a loving family, girlfriend and adoration of everyone without being a self centered sexist asshole. Internet Dudebros hate the character who showed healthy emotion, treats Connie as an equal and taught stuff like acceptance, boundaries and kindness, as they hate the idea that they don’t have any of that because of how bigoted, self absorbed or toxic they are.

#steven universe future #steven universe #steven universe the movie #su spinel #ben 10 #the owl house #anti su critical

[lainalit]

artist: mftfernandez

#I am begging sarah to let this man go #why is tamlin out here always having uninvited guests in his court #have they not something better to do than disrespect a su!cidal man in his house #acotar critical #sjm critical #anti sjm #anti acotar #anti rhysand #anti ic #anti inner circle #pro tamlin #acotar memes

[newbtheveryawesomeandkindanewby]

#anti vivziepop #anti hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel critical #hazbin hotel critique #hazbin hotel criticism #tbh i dont vibe with su either #but at least it gets coding right

[spop-romanticizes-abuse]

their crimes and problems with their redemption arcs under the cut!

catra:

crimes:

War crimes

Abuse of power

Corruption

Reckless endangerment

Psychological abuse

Assault

Terrorism

Attempted regicide

Attempted mass murder

Attempted world domination

Attempted cataclysm

Conspiracy

Mass destruction

Abduction & kidnapping

Unlawful imprisonment

Brainwashing

Theft

Torture

Treason

Usurpation

Coercion

Stalking

Mutilation

Aiding and abetting

Illegal use of weapons

Espionage

Crimes against peace

Crimes against Etheria

Altering reality

how was her redemption arc carried out?

she was only redeemed in the final season and her arc wasn't as drawn out as it should have been.

she never faces any consequences of her actions and is forgiven by her victims almost immediately, either after a vague apology or no apology at all.

she continues torturing and abusing people around her, especially her love interest, adora. her redemption arc doesn't mean anything since she never actually changes.

the diamonds:

crimes:

Multiple planetary conquests

Mass invasion

Mass terraformation

Attempted omnicide

Crimes against the universe

Cruel and unusual punishments

Unlawful executions

Slavery

Oppression

Propaganda

Abuse of power

Mass murder

Terrorism

Ecocide

Genocide

War crimes

Hate crimes

Corruption

Psychological abuse

Brainwashing

Unethical experimentation

Mass forced confinement

Mass destruction

Mass forced transmutations

how was their redemption arc carried out?

same as catra, their redemption was done during the final few episodes of steven universe, and it was way too sudden to be realistic.

they never face any consequences of their actions and still gets to retain their positions as cosmic rulers.

they do, however, seem to put in some effort to change, although it's not clear if this is helpful. steven also does not seem to forgive them.

lilith clawthorne:

crimes:

Malediction

Attempted murder

Child endangerment

Hostage-taking

Kidnapping

Coercion

Malefic

Treason

Cheating

Torture

Abuse

Assault

Aiding and abetting

how was her redemption arc carried out?

she only had to make one sacrifice and that was the extent of her redemption arc.

she is also forgiven too quickly by the people she had hurt.

she does change for the better, and proves to be an ally to the heroes (albeit being an underutilized character).

sasha waybright:

crimes:

Abuse of power

Psychological abuse

Attempted murder

Treason

Terrorism

Harassment

Vandalism

Theft

Usurpation

Animal cruelty

Conspiracy

Kidnapping

Incrimination

Sabotage

Child endangerment

how was her redemption arc carried out?

we only see the beginning of her redemption, the rest of it happens almost entirely off-screen. this was a lazy choice, as we never see an actual “arc”, only the beginning and the end of it.

she is almost immediately forgiven by her friends. there is some lingering suspicion in some episodes, but not enough for everything she had done prior to that season.

however, she also seems to have turned into a better person and doesn't repeat any of her past toxic behaviour.

#i dislike all of these arcs but catra definitely comes first #since she doesn't even change in the end lol #spop critical #spop salt #spop criticism #spop discourse #spop #she ra #anti spop #su criticism #su critical #su salt #su discourse #toh salt #toh criticism #toh critical #toh discourse #amphibia discourse #anti amphibia #amphibia salt #amphibia critical #anti toh #anti su #steven universe #amphibia #the owl house #toh #cartoons #poll

[amarriageoftrueminds]

one of the morons responsible for writing What If:

so there's no mention of hiring Nazis at all when Peggy wasn't there to do it? 

gotcha 👍

#bucky barnes #anti what if #antipeggy #antisteggy #cynthia glass #p*ggy meta #mcu critical #steggy is hydra trash party #meta #mcu meta #🙄 #wooow that's crazy #when I say peggy is a stupid person's idea of a smart person... #this is exactly as stupid as I'd expect them to be... #this idiot also said that feminism happened sooner... BECAUSE OF PIGGY #SHE'S EVEN MARY SUING REAL HISTORY #howard stark BUCKY'S GOOD FRIEND?? #'his good friend' who is never shown meeting him in catfa #who knew bucky was being tortured and did nothing about it #(in TWO timelines just that we've seen) #and whom bucky murdered despite howard calling him by his name? #that 'good friend' #??? #with good friends like these who needs enemies #this has so much 'JKRowling dropping tidbits about wizards shitting where they stand and then vanishing the poop' energy

[rhaenin-time]

If you reread the Dance portion of Fire and Blood after spending near any amount of time reading about how Empress Matilda was written about — not about Matilda herself, not the history, but specifically the historiography about how chroniclers and historians constructed narratives around Matilda — the story, Rhaenyra's story, becomes a lot less "ambiguous."

GRRM doesn't just know history, he knows historiography. He knew what he was doing. And it's a shame, and a little troubling, that so many people — including the writers of HotD — don't see it.

#fire and blood #asoiaf #defending rhaenyra out of principle #it's sus how so many people seem determined to commit to uncharitable interpretations #when that was THE WHOLE POINT #that how you interpret Rhaenyra says far more about you than it does about her #and if reading that made you angry or defensive you might want to think about WHY #rhaenyra targaryen #team black #because 'team green' is an invention to drive engagement #hotd critical #hotd sexism #anti team green #hotd

[space--butterflies]

not to be a bitch, but it's feeling more and more like the fandom is reducing/has reduced Hunter to just being Willow's boyfriend Caleb, and nothing else lately.

#toh critical #anti huntlow #remember when hunter was his own person? #and not just caleb 2.0 or willow's bf? #those were the days #and no i will NEVER get over how the show treated him #his best friend dies to magically cure him of his disability and now suddenly the girl he likes sees him as more than a friend #seems pretty sus to me #not to be a hunter stan but goddamn the show did him fucking dirty #you know what willow also deserves better #they both deserve better #i love them separate but hate them as a couple

[anti-spop]

sure, a lot of fandoms are crappy, but the spop fandom is quite possibly one of the most hostile fandoms i've ever been in. like i'm not joking. i've been accused of so much shit for not liking certain characters or ships. hell, not even the r/egular show fandom was like this, when it still had the love triangle plot going on.

and it's so odd bc spop is literally the queer "power of friendship" cartoon. i mean, the show itself has its shitty things, but i never thought the fandom would be worse.

#i post #spop critical #you could mention the su fandom which was also shitty #but i was never stalked by an angry su fan #the most i got was rude comments on my fanworks #but in the spop fandom i was called antiblack or 'spicy white' for criticizing how spop handled the black characters #srsly this fandom is bananas #i've heard from other crits that they were accused and harassed similarly #anti stans

[genericpuff]

just a cautionary heads up, a bunch of antiLO accounts on IG are getting hacked right now. Change your passwords, and set up 2FA.

#i don't wanna make any accusations but this seems sus #just saying i know EXACTLY the kinds of people who would make targeted attacks like this smh #it wouldn't be the first time something like this has happened fr #antiloreolympus #anti lore olympus #lore olympus critical #loreolympuscritical

[autisticsupervillain]

"Steven Universe is Nazi propaganda because characters who destroyed planets got a redemption arc!"

You guys act like two of the most popular redemption arcs in fiction didn't also happen to characters who destroy planets.

Hell, the Galactic Empire Vader works for is supposed to be a direct analogue to the Nazis for fucks sake. No one is calling Stars Wars or Dragon Ball Nazi propaganda just because these two got character development. That'd be fucking absurd.

Like, complain about how the Redemption Arc got rushed all you want (even if that's on the producers for canceling the show early and not the writers), but please just acknowledge the calling the Jewish woman a Nazi sympathizer because you didn't like her kids cartoon is fucking vile.

#steven universe #anti su critical #star wars #darth vader #dragon ball #vegeta #su critical

[sjbattleangel]

"I'm not (media illiterate)."

Lily, you are one of THE MOST media illiterate people on the face of the earth! You decided Moon Girl And Devil Dinosaur was "automatically garbage" because you heard it was going to be serialized; You dismissed Amphibia as "irredeemable trash, sight unseen" because you heard it had a story and fell for some stupid nontroversy regarding a crew member's fanart; You sided with Disney suits when they cancelled The Owl House for being "too dark and scary for kids" to appease some moral guardians and watchdogs (who may've not even existed)! You want to control what kids watch, you want all of animation to be nothing but toothless, slice-of-life romantic comedies with no action, stakes or soul. Just like your crappy coffee shop AUs.

Not to mention whenever any piece of media contains disturbing and/or problematic moments, you automatically believe it equals "endorsement" and to you, we're all impressionable babies who can't tell fact from fiction and need to be "protected for our good." You just want censor and police fiction to satisfy your own holier-than-thou self-indulgence. Helen Lovejoy much?

"I didn't (accuse Rebecca Sugar of being a sex fiend)."

Hermana, WE HAVE RECEIPTS!

You and your simps decided that a sweet, wholesome picture of Steven wearing his mother's hand-me-downs is somehow Rebecca Sugar's way of "sexualizing him." Even more, in your awful Rebecca Sugar Must Die video, you accused Sugar of sexualizing the character of Stevonnie and that through fusion, Sugar made Seven and Connie "have sex". For this you constantly attacked Sugar as a "creep", "pervert", "disease", "fascist sympathizer", trying your hardest to convince everyone that Sugar is some Neo-Nazi pedophile.

No, Lily! Rebecca sugar is not-and never has been-a Neo-Nazi pedophile! She didn't sexualize Steven! She didn't sexualize Stevonnie! But most of all, fusion was never a metaphor for sex!

The only ones sexualizing Steven, Connie and Stevonnie are YOU and your simps!

#lily orchard #lily orchard critical #screw lily orchard #rebecca sugar #steven universe #connie maheswaran #stevonnie #media literacy #media illiteracy #lily orchard is a hack #lily orchard is an antisemite #lily orchard hates jews #su #anti-su critical #su critical critical #lily orchard is a bad critic #anti-lily orchard #mst3k #mystery science theater 3000 #Youtube

[almacambiondaughterofsaleos]

Helluva boss so she try to follow footstep of a slice of life show then as the story goes on it got more serious. Steven universe cover heavy issue trauma war generational trauma and mental health

I think they both suffer from badly handling their themes and stories. It ended up being a mess and leaving people unsatisfied.

#helluva boss #helluva boss critical #helluva boss criticism #helluva boss critique #vivziepop critical #vivziepop criticism #vivziepop #anti-vivziepop #su critical #steven universe critical #steven unvierse criticism #su criticism #anti-steven universe #steven universe critique #su

[is-the-owl-video-cute]

I know personally as someone who was in my mid-late teens when I watched su, it really mattered to me to get to see a show that said parent figures aren't just right because they said so, and you DO deserve an apology when they hurt you, but one that also had the nuance to show that while you deserve reconciliation and apologies for being hurt by them, they also act with their own reasons and not usually out of a callous disregard for you. Like yes it obviously doesn't flat apply to full on abusive parents, but to parents who were neglectful without really meaning to be or being unable to do anything about it (like, parents who needed to always be at work or who couldn't be there for you) it's actually very relatable and well calculated. Ngl I think some people just dont know what to do with media they don't directly relate to or immediately understand. I did also see a lot of su criticals who tried to claim the show was about forgiving abusers for this exact reason, but I think you only really get that interpretation out of it if you think all media should be about you specifically

In all honesty, the diamonds really did show three different types of parents who are incredibly toxic and damaging to their children without meaning to hurt them.

Yellow is a workaholic, and holds a very strict no-nonsense attitude. She didn’t make time for Pink or treat her problems as legitimate until it was too late, but she did still very clearly care about her. She didn’t let her emotions show to anyone, least of all to herself because she saw them as an obstacle to what needed to be done.

Blue is her polar opposite, she suffered greatly from a loss and (in this case, correctly) blamed herself for every part of it while never actually processing or overcoming her grief. By not taking care of herself, she lashes out at others and cannot move forward. Before Pink was shattered, Blue was indignant, disdainful, and quick to take out frustrations on Pink when she felt “embarrassed” by her not conforming to their expectations.

White was condescending and more dismissive than the other two. Quick to belittle and intimidate to get her way. She loved Pink, yes, but more in the way one might love a nice coat. She was a perfectionist and projected that need to be right and perfect (literally) on every other gem, the other diamonds most of all as they are implied to be of her own creation. Her ego and inability to accept being wrong (or by extension, those she created doing what she decides is wrong) cause her to force Pink to fall into a role that she was never really suited to. She saw Pink as one of her greatest failures and something she needed to either fix or hide away.

All three of them together formed a very deeply toxic and emotionally abusive relationship towards each other and to Pink most of all. A few people take issue with Steven “forgiving” them as they misconstrue it as a victim forgiving abusers, but at the end of the day Steven is not nor was he ever Pink Diamond. He was mistaken for her and felt some of what she experienced because of that, but he was not a long-term victim the way Pink was, in a lot of ways he was an outsider who had context of the situation and wanted to step in to keep them from hurting anyone else.

More to the point, he doesn’t forgive any of them. He calls them out on their toxic behavior and tries to get the point across to each of them that the way they’ve been living isn’t healthy for anyone, and is actively traumatic not only to them but for everyone they hold power over. The end of the series sees him teaching them how to atone for some of what they’ve done and to help others heal, but he doesn’t stay with them, nor does he invite them to stay on earth despite extending that offer to just about every other gem he encountered. It’s established in the movie that he almost never visits any of them outside of his activism and subtly making sure they aren’t regressing into dangerous people again. In the epilogue series he is shown to be (rightfully) distrustful of Blue and Yellow as well as being openly afraid of White. He helped them feel closure for Pink and repaired the relationship the three of them had, and that was it. Even if he had been in that abusive environment for as long as Pink was, that isn’t an unreasonable response. Some victims of (unintentional!) emotional abuse do find catharsis in confronting their abuser once safely out of that situation and expressing the way that behavior harmed them. Some victims genuinely do want their abusers to become better and healthier people when the abusive traits stem from their own trauma or lack of emotional intelligence. There are other victims in the show who completely sever ties with their abusers and never interact with them again, so this wasn’t trying to push a narrative that victims MUST do that, it was giving people language and strategies to approach these conversations if that is something they want to attempt.

This was another of my famous rambles, but I suppose in conclusion I would say: whether SU crits liked it or not, the final arc of Steven Universe was absolutely helpful to people in toxic home environments. It also served as an allegory for queer children not being accepted by their parents for who they are, and how changing your perspective as a parent and accepting your child is legitimately a healthier option for everyone because to do otherwise just ensures you will lose them in every way that matters.

There’s just a lot of important takeaways from that arc, especially for children. I’m incredibly tired of seeing grown adults whining about it because they chose to take it literally. Well done on missing the point of a show for middle schoolers I suppose, but idk if you really just want to see all villains get killed for their villainy just go watch Breaking Bad or the lion king or something. There are plenty of shows where violence is the answer, there’s not any real point getting furious over one of the few that don’t use that as the ultimate conclusion.

#SU #it’s a show for queer children #the entirety of the Gem Society is meant as an allegory for queer people learning to accept themselves and to show #that society accepting queer people is a good thing for everyone #Steven Universe #Anti SU critical #Rebecca sugar #steven universe future

[tranquil-slaughterhouse]

Hey does anyone remember 7 years ago when some people thought Adventure Time was better than Steven Universe all because Tree Trunks wrote "Fascist" on her picketing sign?

#adventure time #steven universe #su critical madness #high strangeness #tree trunks #anti su critical

[spop-romanticizes-abuse]

toxic relationships: intentional vs romanticized

i want to talk about what makes a toxic ship intentional and what makes it romanticized, since a lot of spop fans claim that “of course Adora and Catra's relationship is toxic, they were enemies and they had a rough childhood”. however, it's clear that the writers of spop themselves don't consider this relationship toxic, or if they do, they think that the toxicity is sexy or romantic.

for comparison, let's take Jasper and Lapis from Steven Universe. this was a ship that was clearly written to be unhealthy. these were two characters who did not like each other in the slightest, who both had their own share of trauma that they never worked through and decided to form a fusion instead.

Jasper tries to coerce Lapis into forming a fusion with her, in order to help her defeat the Crystal Gems. Lapis is unwilling at first but later, she relents. whether she did this out of fear or because of her own anger towards the Crystal Gems is unclear at first.

Fusions in SU are a good way of visualising the nature of a relationship. if a relationship is healthy and stable, the fusion is stronger and can stay fused for longer periods of time. if the relationship is unhealthy, toxic or unstable, the fusion might break apart easily or have trouble functioning as one body.

fusions aren't strictly a romantic thing either, there had been a couple of platonic fusions in the series too, like Smoky Quartz or Steg. suffice to say, it was just a creative way to explore different dynamics between different people.

as expected, Lapis's and Jasper's fusion was not stable or healthy in the slightest. Malachite was the biggest fusion we had seen at that point in the series, and she looked more monstrous and unhinged than any of the other fusions we had seen prior.

it is at this point that Lapis reveals that she was just trying to keep Steven safe by fusing with Jasper and forcing the fusion to stay underwater with her.

even right after this scene, it's clear that the writers wrote Malachite as an intentional toxic ship because Garnet immediately remarks that those two gems were “not good for each other”.

after an undetermined period of time where Malachite stayed fused, and while Jasper got more and more angry and vengeful, Lapis got more and more exhausted of holding the fusion together; the Crystal Gems finally succeed in making the two unfuse.

there is some nuance to this ship too, because there wasn't just one person at fault. while Jasper was physically stronger than Lapis and she was the one who initially coerced Lapis into fusing with her, Lapis herself admits that she used their relationship to take out all of her anger and frustration. she admits to hurting Jasper in the process.

Lapis also admits that she misses Jasper, a sentiment that Jasper also seems to share as she tracks down Lapis to ask her to fuse with her again, promising that it would be better this time.

this is not uncommon in toxic relationships where the individuals get so used to the toxicity that they feel empty without each other. they would rather be in an unhealthy but familiar relationship than be alone. and this is the first time i've seen this sentiment be portrayed so realistically in a show. the fact that you can get away from someone who hurt you and still miss them and want them back is something that needs to be talked about.

Lapis does eventually reject Jasper's offer, saying that their relationship wasn't healthy. while i do have problems with how they suddenly made Lapis the victim afterwards (and her whole arc as a whole), i still think SU handled this ship really well.

it was an introspect into a toxic relationship, without romanticizing or sexualizing it, and without justifying Lapis's or Jasper's actions, even though they were both sympathetic characters on their own. they do kind of gloss over Lapis's role in this relationship later on, which i wasn't fond of but in the end, they made the right decision to not let this ship be canon.

this is how toxic relationships should be explored in media. without bias, without excusing or justifying a person's actions. whether the ship separates in the end or not is the writer's wish, but the framing is important.

whereas c//a is framed in a way that expects us to sympathize with Catra, to excuse her actions and to root for her to get with Adora. like Malachite, c//a was not healthy for Catra or Adora (although the conflict there was definitely more one-sided) but the writers of spop seems to think that a vague apology is enough for them to get into a stable relationship.

if you frame toxic behaviour as cute or romantic, your audience is going to accept that. fiction does greatly impact reality. and considering that spop is quote-unquote “a kid's show”, they have a responsibility to not send the wrong message to thousands of impressionable children.

this turned into more of an SU analysis than an SPOP critique post lol but since y'all already know why c//a is not like malachite, i trust i don't have to write more about that.

#lapis and peridot also had an unhealthy and emotionally abusive relationship #and while i hated how they never held lapis accountable for her actions #i'm glad they didn't make that ship canon either #long post #steven universe #steven universe meta #su meta #su #lapis lazuli #jasper #lapis x jasper #malachite #spop critical #spop salt #spop criticism #spop discourse #spop #she ra #anti spop #anti catra #anti catradora #anti c//a #antic//a #anticatra #anticatradora #tw abuse #tw toxic relationship #i also want to point out the language used in su vs the language used in spop #su clearly states that lapis's and jasper's relationship was unhealthy and that they were not good for each other #while spop uses vague terms like “catra is mean” “catra is a bad friend” or “adora's and catra's relationship is complicated”