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psychologeek · 4 months

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Your defense of Israel murdering or displacing all the Palestinians is disgusting.

You defend the government’s actions over the whole course of its existence and deny is subjugation and occupation of Palestine.

Israel is a colonist nation. Regardless of who your ancestors are from thousands of years ago, you do not get to go to another country and forcefully expel its current population out of some inane sense of birthright.

I am African American. My ancestors were stolen from their homelands, sold to slavers, and shipped across the sea where then endured torture in every meaning of the word for generations. The African American community is still recovering.

But that in no way gives me the right to return to the African country of my ancestors and demand that whoever lives there (and has lived there for centuries) leaves and gives their land to me so I can make a new country. And I’m talking about a crime that happened only 300 years ago, not thousands.

The Israel government is currently committing war crimes at unprecedented levels in modern times. And their only goal is to expel all Palestinian from Gaza (and the West Bank). They don’t care about the hostages, they just want land.

October 7th does not exist in a vacuum. Even if it did it would not justify the thousands of children that have been murdered as a result. Over the course of 75 years of occupation Israel have murdered countless children and other innocents, all far before October 7th.

Antisemitism is an incredibly serious problem in the world. But antizionism is not antisemitism. What right do westerners, regardless of who their ancestors were and regardless of what they have been through, to forcefully claim an already occupied plot of land in the Middle East. The answer is none. If they do so they are colonizers. Just like if I were to forcefully claim land in Africa today I would be a colonizer.

Real nazis exist. White supremacist exist. And many of them actual support Israel because they recognize it as a facist state that kills brown people.

True antisemitism exists and it is being largely ignored so Zionists can attack Palestinians and other Arabs for refusing to give their own land to Western transplants.

You should reflect on the empathy you have for Israel soldiers and the lack of empathy you have for the Palestinian children (the nearly 10,000) who have been blown up, shot, and starved to death of the course of the last few months.

You justify their deaths at every corner and talk about the fear of violence you feel, but not the actual violence they endure.

You have the nerve to write about a complicated middle eastern child like Damian when if he were real, you would be justifying his murder at the hands of western fascists.

Anon,

first of all - I do have to thank u for taking it to my Tumblr instead of the comment section on ao3. I appreciate it.

For those interested - this is the fic anon refers to at the end of the comment, when saying "You have the nerve to write about a complicated middle eastern child like Damian"

TL;DR:

Me (literally was a Middle Eastern child who grew up to be a ME adult, and have a complicated family relationship)

me: writing "Hi, Intifada is actually a bad thing. Bombs are blind, you know" in my A/N of one of my fics.

Anon from the USA: HOW DARE YOU VIOLENT WHITE FACIST!!!!!

me: ?_?

*********

now for the actual reply!

1."Your defense of Israel murdering or displacing all the Palestinians is disgusting."

Where, exactly, did I say I support murder/displacement of people?

(And yes, I mean ANY people)

2. "You defend the government’s actions over the whole course of its existence"

Umm, what?

I definitely disagree with (many many MANY) things the government did. 'over the whole course of its existence' - wow. You really went on with it, huh?

3. "and deny is subjugation and occupation of Palestine."

"subjugation, occupation " - again, what?

And, how do you enslave a LAND?

That is a very interesting claim you're making here.

(Not to mention that, Palestine was the COLONIAL name of the reign. But who cares?)

4. "Israel is a colonist nation."

Do you know what "colonist" means?

I'll give you a hint - it requires having a country in a first place, and expending.

5. "Regardless of who your ancestors are from thousands of years ago"

No, but you see - it DOES matter.

That statement means that heritage doesn't matter. That 'homeland' has an expiring date.

A. Since many of those who consider themselves Palestinians today do it bc THEIR ancestors lived in the reign, it is a crucial thing. And an interesting claim.

B. Does it apply to other places as well? I mean, are you also against "land back" and independence for Puerto Rico (which is, btw, ANOTHER colonial name).

C. There have always been Jews in Israel. Judaism (which comes from "Judea" - you know, the old southern Jewish kingdom? in the Jerusalem area?

6. "you do not get to go to another country and forcefully expel its current population out of some inane sense of birthright."

I agree. I don't support any expel for anyone. I believe there's enough place for anyone that wants to live IN PEACE. About 20% of Israel's population are Arabs-Israelis. I had Muslim roommate in the past, and where I study, about 25% of my class are Muslims.

7. "I am African American. My ancestors were stolen from their homelands, sold to slavers, and shipped across the sea where then endured torture in every meaning of the word for generations."

Yes. So were my ancestors. (Guess who built the Collosum?) And my people are still being harrased and murdered.

7. "The African American community is still recovering."

So does the Jewish population worldwide.

8. "But that in no way gives me the right to return to the African country of my ancestors and demand that whoever lives there (and has lived there for centuries) leaves and gives their land to me so I can make a new country."

There is no demand for anyone to leave.

About the "lived here for centuries" claim :

In the first quarter of the 19th century, Israel population was about 250k (about 25% Jews.)

overall population according to year. origin mentioned.

Then, in 1948, the arab population in Israel was 1,237,000 (67%) and the Jewish population was 608,000 (33%).

for example, main cities population 1860-1946:

Jerusalem (over all, Jews, Muslims, Christians) ,Jaffa (over all, Jews, Muslims, Christians), Haifa (over all, Jews, Muslims, Christians)

Same origin also cites a lot of immigration (mostly from Egypt and Lebanon).

****

[So, you go by the right of conquer? as in "if you live there, then it's yours"? So, do you support the Jewish return to Hebron (Jewish community constantly, until 1929.) and Gaza (same)?]

Of course that you, as a single person, can't do that. May I remind you of decision 181 of the UN? about 2-state solution?

In fact, the first accords, the UN ones? said "we'll give 80% of the land to 70% of the population" (Arabs) "and 20% of the land to 30% of the population"

Jews said: ok!

Arabs said: umm. Nope. We want everything, or there'll be blood.

You can probably read about what happened to the Jews that were left in Gush Etzion and other off-border Jews after Israel declared independence.

[Why am I using the term "Arab" and not "Palestinian"? well, that's what they called themselves:]

Arab leaders like Auni Bey Abdul-Hadi told the Peel Commission in 1937: "There is no such country as 'Palestine'; 'Palestine' is a term the Zionists invented!" During the 1930s, anti-British and anti-Jewish riots were enflamed by the newly created "Arab Higher Committee,"( Arab - not Palestinian!) the central political organ of the Arab community of Mandate Palestine .In 1946, Arab historian Philip Hitti testified before the Anglo-American Committee of Inquiry that "there is no such thing as Palestine in history.” In 1947, Arab leaders protesting the UN partition plan argued that Palestine was part of Syria and “politically, the Arabs of Palestine (were) not (an) independent separate … political entity.” In 1947, the UN proposed a "Jewish" State and an "Arab" (again, not Palestinian) State.

9. "And I’m talking about a crime that happened only 300 years ago, not thousands."

Yes. If you want to know why the Jewish population is/was suspicious about living under arab/muslim authorities, feel free to look up the Hebron massacre (and ethnic cleansing - the eareser of the Jewish people in 1929. Also the EC of the Jewish community in Gaza in 1929, several exiles before. Also massacre of Zfad 'what year?' - ALL OF THEM).

And that before mentioning the EC of jews from MENA countries - arab/Muslims countries (there's a nice song about it. Feel free to listen.)

10. "The Israeli government is currently committing war crimes at unprecedented levels in modern times."

Uhm.

The Holocaust? Buko Haram? Hamas? Iran-Balochistan? dam, SYRIA?? Hello?

Funny how EVERYTHING can, all of a sudden, become "the worst thing in modern history".

(There are, probably, war crimes going on. Which is terrible, and should NOT happen, and there's a lot of ppl in Israel calling against it. But just bc you don't like something, or bc it's bad, doesn't mean it's a war crime.)

11. "And their only goal is to expel all Palestinian from Gaza (and the West Bank)."

No, hun. I'm sorry you fell for the propaganda.

Their goal is to return the quiet to the area. Since, you know, we STILL HAVE MISSILES FIRED AT CIVILIAN AREAS as had been in the 20+ last years. Not to mention terror attacks (hi, remember the 07/10?) And THE KIDNAPPED PEOPLE, MOSTLY CIVILIANS.

(Which is a WAR CRIME, btw. In relation to no.10).

12. "They don’t care about the hostages,"

I'm sorry, what?

Right. You say it as... someone who never been in Israel, and get news from Al Jazeera (funded by the same ppl who fund Hamas), I guess.

(Literally some of those who currently fight has family and friends that were kidnapped.)

Though, about the government - idk. I honestly lost any try to understand what the current PM trying to do.

13. "they just want land."

Of course. Which is EXACTLY why Israel has tried to make peace agreements 5 times before, willing to give away land. EXACTLY why Israel had exiled every last jew from Gaza Strip in 2005, during the disengagement. Exactly why, during the peace agreements with Egypt, Israel gave away Sinai (which is about the size of the rest of Israel.)

14. "October 7th does not exist in a vacuum."

Love this comment. Such a great idea.

I bet you'd say the same thing about Floyd, won't you?

I mean, it didn't happen in a VACCUM. That officer felt threatened and I'm sure he was very sad afterwards.🥺🥺

15. "Even if it did it would not justify the thousands of children that have been murdered as a result."

aaaannd we reach the part of PROPAGANDA. I'll be honest, I'm tired of it.

I'll only say - according to international law, and the laws of war (LoW), hiding in civil population is a WAR CRIME. So is using child soldiers, hiding HQ and ammunition under hospitals, religious places, schools, and kindergartens.

16. "Over the course of 75 years of occupation Israel have murdered countless children and other innocents, all far before October 7th.

check your resources about: 75 years. "murder countless children"

Antisemitism is an incredibly serious problem in the world. But antizionism is not antisemitism. What right do Westerners, regardless of who their ancestors were and regardless of what they have been through, to forcefully claim an already occupied plot of land in the Middle East. The answer is none. If they do so they are colonizers. Just like if I were to forcefully claim land in Africa today I would be a colonizer. Real nazis exist. White supremacist exist."

Love that you claim me to be westerner and\or white, as I'm neither. Go back to no.8. Jews ALWAYS lived here. wanting a state, when *all countries in the area started becoming their own countries* isn't the problem. Claiming that only THAT country has no right to exist - yes, it is antisemitic, sorry. Or are you also against Syria, Egypt, Lebanon, Jordan, etc. as their own countries?

Also - not forcefully. UN decision.

"Real nazis exist. White supremacist exist." - funny how they BOTH agree that Israel is bad. Almost like they have 1 thing in common

(Hint: this isn't a strong urge for world peace)

"And many of them actually support Israel because they recognize it as a facist state that kills brown people."

- Dog whistle!

"Jews are white killing brown ppl" + "jews are the REAL nazis"

"True antisemitism exists and it is being largely ignored so Zionists can attack Palestinians and other Arabs for refusing to give their own land to Western transplants."

"Jews are white colonisers that came to kill all the nice PoC who lived peacefully!

"You should reflect on the empathy you have for Israel soldiers and the lack of empathy you have for the Palestinian children (the nearly 10,000) who have been blown up, shot, and starved to death of the course of the last few months."

- you don't care about the kids!!!!

(Israelis are soldiers and murderous, VS. the Palestinians who are all innocent kids who did nothing.) don't care about the Israeli ones).

"You justify their deaths at every corner and talk about the fear of violence you feel, but not the actual violence they endure."

- YOU ARE VIOLENT! How dare you say you want ACTUAL peace, one that includes NO ONE being targeted by missiles??

[Can you, in your OWN WORDS, say what are "Nazism", "Facism", and "Zionism"? bc one of those isn't like the others.]

"You have the nerve to write about a complicated middle eastern child like Damian when if he were real, you would be justifying his murder at the hands of western fascists."

- Wow. How dare I, a Middle Eastern who grew up in a complicated family, write about a Middle Eastern child who grew up in a complicated area and complicated family situation?

really, SHAME on me!

But sure-

The problem is that I write about Damian, a FICTIONAL CHARACTER, and not that actual, real life, ppl suffer.

The problem is that I dare say "Yo, ppl, calling for Intifada, aka TERROR ATTACKS (that killed EVERYONE - Jews, Muslims, Christians, etc.) is bad and violent. Of course. No matter that rise in violence is destructive and harmful to EVERYONE.

I see you came here through my fanfic. Fanfic that part of it was trying to get more comfortable with my grandma's old culture and language. And the other part was about educating myself more about religion I'm not familiar enough with, and reminding myself that people are people. (Hoping that knowing and understanding would help me coup with my own personal prejudice and trauma, as I keep seeing the faces of the dead I knew and keep dreaming about the baby from the terror attack when I was a kid and keep feeling the ground shaking, even though I'm no longer a child in an unprotected area when all I could do was lay on the ground and pray the missiles won't fall near me)

Let me ask you something -

I was born in Israel, and so did my parents, and so did THEIR parents (except for a grandma who immigrated as a toddler from Yemen. Yes, that country that just exiled the last Jewish family in 2022, current Jewish population: 1. That Yemen.)

And it seems like you have never even been to this continent. Never had to run to shelter. Doesn't have baby photos with gas masks, or know how to find the "as protected as possible" area (since not every place has a shelter) -

so you, a random anon, who doesn't really know anything about an ongoing war\conflict that affects many lives, come and criticise me for calling for no more violence.

Let me ask you something -

What gives you the right?

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