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burningvelvet · 6 months

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Why Mr. Rochester and Bertha Mason Couldn't Get a Legal Separation; or, the Utter Madness of Marital Laws

So I saw a Jane Eyre post discussing why Mr. Rochester and Bertha Mason couldn't get a legal marital separation. I've thought a lot about this topic, and in order to procrastinate writing the final for my upper-level Brontë class, I've decided to write this sort of convoluted analysis instead. I know many others have written about this subject, but I wanted to explore a bit further on my own.

Preliminary context about me, the Brontës, their Byronic inspiration, etc.: I've learned a lot about 19th century British marriage laws recently in my classes on old British literature, as well as by having studied Byron, whose marital separation in 1816 was a notorious part of his history & also reverberated through 19c literature. He refers to this separation in many of his works, most famously in his notorious poem "Fare Thee Well." Harriet Beecher Stowe, the most famous American female writer at the time, was friends with Lady Byron and wrote a book defending her called "Lady Byron Vindicated: A history of the Byron controversy from its beginning in 1816 to the present time" (the original callout post).

Insanity accusations did factor in to Byron's separation. Many scholars have remarked how the Queens of Byronic Criticism, the Brontë sisters, took significant inspiration from their well-worn copy of Moore's biography Life of Byron when creating their works. The Brontës would have been very familiar with marriage laws not only due to their knowledge of Byron's trainwreck of a marriage, but also due to being well-educated women at the time who knew that marriage was the most important economic decision of one's life and could very well make or break a person. As a result, marriage plays a significant role in their novels.

More relevant preliminary context about the novel: Jane Eyre actually takes place in the Georgian era, despite most adaptations and anaysis presenting is as a Victorian piece due to the novels publication date (this drives me crazy; same goes for the other Brontë books). Marriage laws did not change drastically from the time the novel is set to the time Brontë was writing the novel, but things were a bit different socially. Rochester was also married 15 years before his attempt to marry Jane. According to this very good analysis, Rochester and Bertha probably married in or around the year 1793: https://jane-eyre.guidesite.co.uk/timeline.

Now, here are the reasons why Rochester couldn't separate from Bertha:

1) Insanity wasn't grounds for divorce/separation in the Regency era.

Rochester himself says that he couldn't legally separate from her because of her insanity, which presumably rendered any of her faults null on the grounds of that marital vow "in sickness and in health." This is possibly one of his biggest reasons:

"I was rich enough now – yet poor to hideous indigence: a nature the most gross, impure, depraved I ever saw, was associated with mine, and called by the law and by society a part of me. And I could not rid myself of it by any legal procedings: for the doctors now discovered that my wife was mad — her excesses had prematurely developed the germs of insanity [..]"

2) Divorce was nearly impossible anyway.

There had only been around 300 divorces in English history at the time. Almost all of them were husbands divorcing their wives for committing adultery. Only a handful of divorces had succesfully been obtained by women, and they were only in cases where the husband had committed incestuous adultery or bigamy, and was extremely physically cruel. So technically after his bigamy attempt, Bertha may have had more grounds to obtain a divorce than Rochester would have, if only she were lucid enough to do so. However, in that scenario infertility would have helped their case, and Adèle's existence would have harmed their case if he attempted to seek a divorce before marrying Jane. Though as the novel explains, Adèle is probably not his, she definitely would have been used against him, as would the fact that he kept Bertha's existence a secret in England. But he wouldn't have tried for divorce that late in the game anyway, considering it was one of the most difficult options.

3) Female adultery was your best bet at divorce or separation, and this probably wasn't applicable to Mr. & Mrs. Rochester.

Although some scholars claim that there is subtext hinting that Bertha was adulterous (which some adaptations, like the 2006, include), you needed substantial proof of the adultery, which Rochester may not have had if it did occur. Being a proud man, he also wouldn't have wanted to be humiliated in that way by letting it be publicly known (as shame is one of his main reasons for hiding their marriage to begin with).

However, I lean toward the idea that Bertha may not have committed adultery. If she definitively did, seeing how affected Rochester was by Céline cheating on him (he shot her lover in revenge and left her with a stipend), if he ever suspected adultery on Bertha's part then I'm sure he would have been at court the very next day. I also think Rochester tries not to be too much of a hypocrite, and he is well aware that he himself is an adulterer, so he probably doesn't want to accuse Bertha of a crime he's committed and which he couldn't definitively prove she did.

Rochester does talk about hating Bertha's "vices" when they lived together, citing drinking, arguing, cruelty to servants, cursing, her being "unchaste," a "harlot," etc. - the last epithets, combined with her supposed lack of morality, and her being described as seductive, heavily imply that adultery could be added to her list of offenses. However, if she did truly cheat on him as well, I don't see why he wouldn't plainly tell this to Jane as well. I would imagine it would be his first complaint, and it would probably be considered his most justifiable reason against her by their cultural standards.

I don't see why he wouldn't jump to take Bertha's infidelity as an opportunity to defend his own actions, considering how open he is with Jane about his own adultery and being cheated on by Cèline Varens. While I can see how some of the textual evidence may strongly suggest Bertha's adultery, we cannot be fully certain, and that may be because Rochester himself is not fully certain. I cannot see why he wouldn't have sought legal advice on that account alone.

In short, if Bertha was an adulterer, there must have been no evidence to convict her.

Also: while the double-standard may seem odd and trivial to us, the reason why female adultery held more weight than male adultery has entirely to due with old patriarchal inheritance laws; i.e the risk of a wife getting extramaritally pregnant and passing the illegitimate child off as her husband's heir was considered too great of an affront. A man could have as many bastards as he wanted because he would know they were bastards and were not at risk of inheriting his stuff. One needed legitimate heirs to justify passing on one's ancestral wealth to. Essentially, marriage was a mere economic tool, and the economy was and is inherently patriarchal. I digress.

4) Rochester's lack of social & economic leverage, and risk of social ruin in general.

Only the wealthiest of the wealthy could obtain divorce or official separation, and it often led to social ruin. Rochester is rich, but he has no title and no great network of supporters due to being a younger son and having been abroad for most of the past 15 years (this was the length of his marriage to Bertha, stated by Mr. Briggs during the bigamous wedding attempt). He doesn't have as much leverage as Lord and Lady Byron had.

To continue on official separation, like Lady and Lord Byron obtained. Just like divorce, this was also a messy and scandalous legal proceeding, and required numerous good reasons to obtain, and being well-connected Lords and Ladies really helped your case. You also needed many witnesses and written statements as evidence. Bertha's family, as we see with Mason, would have been unhelpful to Rochester, and due to his shame and secrecy, no one could really testify on his behalf I'm assuming.

5) Unofficial separation would have been inconvenient, especially in regards to living situations.

Aside from divorce, which was extremely rare, extremely controversial, and only for the wealthiest members of society — there were unofficial and official separations. An unofficial separation was simply living apart from one another. I've often wondered why Rochester didn't simply move Grace Poole and Bertha somewhere else, but my main theory is that it would have been cost ineffective, and due to his family who were implied to be shitty, he probably really didn't want to live at Thornfield anyway so thought it would be convenient to place her there. Rochester says it would be dangerous to place her in his other residence of Ferndean:

"[..] though I possess an old house, Ferndean Manor, even more retired and hidden than this, where I could have lodged her safely enough, had not a scruple about the unhealthiness of the situation, in the heart of a wood, made my conscience recoil from the arrangement. Probably those damp walls would soon have eased me of her charge: but to each villain his own vice; and mine is not a tendency to indirect assassination, even of what I most hate."

6) Annulment was likely impossible given their circumstances.

Annulment means evaporating the marriage, acting as if it never existed, that it was a mistake. This was rare and only granted in unique circumstances, and I believe it was more common with aristocracy and royals. I believe you could possibly get an annulment if you could prove that the spouse was insane at the time of the wedding and you did not know. However, Bertha did not begin to truly deteriorate until after they had been living together for a bit. And while Rochester says that he did not know her mother was in an asylum until after the wedding, having an insane mother doesn't mean that you are insane, which Bertha clearly wasn't at that point, at least not in a way that people would have publicly acknowledged, since Rochester says she attended parties and her hand was highly sought after.

Generally, the longer a marriage had gone on, the harder it was to prove why it could not go on. Rochester says that he and Bertha "lived together" for "four years" in Jamaica while her condition deteriorated and he tried to make things work. And again, after the wedding he found out her mother was "mad, and shut up in a lunatic asylum." So we have more reasons for Rochester's difficulty: the fear of Bertha going to an asylum while she was still mostly lucid in those first four years, combined with the fact that they openly lived together and certainly must have consummated their marriage (things which would further prevent annulment), and were certainly publicly recognized as a couple in Spanish Town society, and her family wanting the marriage to continue so she could have children of "good race" i.e. to produce heirs.

Here's an important passage that to me suggests that Rochester and Bertha not only had an initial flirtation but likely consummated their marriage, likely had a passionate sexual relationship for some time, and likely implies his feelings for her were more complex than we'd initially assume, making annulment not so clear-cut of an option to him at the time:

"My father said nothing about her money; but he told me Miss Mason was the boast of Spanish Town for her beauty: and this was no lie. I found her a fine woman, in the style of Blanche Ingram; tall, dark, and majestic. Her family wished to secure me because I was of a good race; and so did she. They showed her to me in parties, splendidly dressed. I seldom saw her alone, and had very little private conversation with her. She flattered me, and lavishly displayed for my pleasure her charms and accomplishments. All the men in her circle seemed to admire her and envy me. I was dazzled, stimulated: my senses were excited; and being ignorant, raw, and inexperienced, I thought I loved her. There is no folly so besotted that the idiotic rivalries of society, the prurience, the rashness, the blindness of youth, will not hurry a man to its commission. Her relatives encouraged me; competitors piqued me; she allured me: a marriage was achieved almost before I knew where I was. Oh, I have no respect for myself when I think of that act! — an agony of inward contempt masters me. I never loved, I never esteemed, I did not even know her."

7) Spousal abandonment wasn't possible, and on some level he honored his legal and financial obligations to her and the Mason family.

Bertha's family likely refused to house her for legal and personal reasons, and spousal abandonment was forbidden due to the husband's financial responsibility as well as the law of coverture (a wife became her husband's full legal responsibility; some say "property"). Like we see in Anne's Tenant of Wildfell Hall, if a woman ran away from their spouse they would have to live in obscurity and be at risk of being sussed out. You couldn't just abandon your partner. Still, people did, because it was the easiest route to take.

But the more upper-class you were, and the more financial entanglements you had, the more inconvenient this was. We know that Rochester and his family became enmeshed with the Mason family, and he got a lot of money from Bertha, so her father likely would have taken him to court. At any rate, Rochester was legally bound to bring Bertha with him to England when he left Jamaica. If he attempted to abandon her in Jamaica, the backlash it would have brought would have brought him social ruin and foiled his chances at getting away with any bigamy attempts.

All this brings us to a further notice of Bertha's family situation. Based on Charlotte Brontë's positive comments about Rochester's character (https://www.tumblr.com/burningvelvet/731403104856195072/in-a-letter-to-w-s-williams-14-august-1848) I see no reason to suspect him, like many feminist critics do, of being an unreliable narrator or of lying about Bertha Mason's history. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and in mine, that is simply not the novel Charlotte wrote. By her own admission, she wanted his narrative to be a path to further goodness.

It makes no narrative sense for our explanation of his and Bertha's history to be full of lies when he's trying to make ammends with Jane, who never suspects him of lying during his admission, but who does critique him and figure he'd tire of her like she was one of his many mistresses. Jane wonders if Rochester would lock her in an attic too, which he refutes on the basis that he loves her more than he loved Bertha when she was sane, and so he would care for Jane himself. Jane also tells him that it's not Bertha's fault that she's mad. So in my opinion, if Charlotte wanted us to believe Rochester was lying about his and Bertha's history to make himself look better or Bertha look worse, I don't see why she would have been vague about it, and I don't see why Jane wouldn't have called it out like she does everything else. I don't think Rochester is really a villain who locked his harmless wife in the attic for giggles; I think he weighed most of his options and found, like most people back then and even today, that keeping his problems locked up and ignored was the best solution.

Now, on with the point. I have often wondered why Rochester didn't simply "unofficially separate" from Bertha by leaving her with her family when he left. Why did he take her to England? Why didn't he just run away? It wasn't because he was an evil villain who wanted to keep her as a trophy. It's because 1) I don't think her father would have let him, as he was so quick to marry her off, 2) he felt obligated to her, and 3) it was criminal for men to abandon their wives, and it would have attracted publicity, which is what Rochester was avoiding by taking Bertha to England and sheltering her in secrecy.

Many claim that Rochester's adultery is a betrayal of his wife; and while religiously, narratively, socially, we can accept this statement, it was not legally a crime. While Rochester does honor his financial and legal obligations to his wife and her family, he does not take the religious part of the vows into account, and that's why he's cosmically punished and only rewarded after he repents, as he explains toward the end of the novel.

Another interesting point is that when Rochester recounts his decision to move back to England, he tells us that Bertha had already been declared insane in Jamaica and that she was already confined there (presumably around the 4 year anniversary before they left), meaning her father probably knew about confinement:

"One night I had been awakened by her yells (since the medical men had pronounced her mad, she had of course been shut up) — it was a fiery West Indian night; [..]"

Locking away "insane" people was standard procedure then, and if this was done with Bertha's father's knowledge, considering he locked his own wife away in an asylum, then this further absolves Rochester of a lot of the blame in my opinion. It more than likely wasn't his idea to lock her away, but the advice of "the medical men" and presumably her father's consultation as well.

8) Even if he divorced or separated from her, he couldn't remarry. Attempting these, or getting caught attempting abandonment, would have brought negative publicity that would have likely prevented the success of any future bigamy attempts. To him, secrecy and bigamy seemed better chances at securing happiness than the social ruin and likely failure the other options would have brought him.

Aside from Rochester's own explanation (which I supplied in #2 re: the separation veto inherent to Bertha's insanity), the other biggest reason as to why Rochester wouldn't seek a separation/divorce even if she hadn't been declared insane and even if he were willing to accuse her of adultery truthfully or not, is due to the fact that one could not legally remarry upon separation or divorce (unless you were Henry VIII and got God's permission lol). Rochester's impossible dream is that he wants to be married to someone he really loves, and if secrecy and bigamy are his only options then he is willing to succumb; this is shown in numerous passages:

"[..] I could reform — I have strength yet for that — if— but where is the use of thinking of it, hampered, burdened, cursed as I am? Besides, since happiness is irrevocably denied me, I have a right to get pleasure out of life: and I will get it, cost what it may."

"I will keep my word: I will break obstacles to happiness, to goodness — yes, goodness; I wish to be a better man than I have been; than I am — as Job's leviathan broke the spear, the dart, and the habergeon, hinderances which others count as iron and brass, I will esteem but straw and rotten wood."

"Is there not love in my heart, and constancy in my resolves? It will expiate at God's tribunal. I know my Maker sanctions what I do. For the world's judgment — I wash my hands thereof. For man's opinion — I defy it."

Closing remarks on the above's validity: I can't cite all my sources because a lot of this stuff I learned from lectures via my professor who specializes in 19th century English literature & history. But here's some recently published information from a historian, taken from "Inside the World of Bridgerton: True Stories of Regency High Society" by Catherine Curzon (2023):

"And if you were one of the newly-weds, you really did hope things would work out, because in the Regency till death do us part wasn't just an expression. As the Prince Regent himself had learned when he separated from his wife within eighteen months of their marriage, obtaining a divorce in Regency England was no easy matter. He never achieved it, and for those who did the stakes could be high and the cost ruinous in every sense."

"Until the passing of the Matrimonial Causes Act of 1857, which legalized divorce in the civil courts, it was governed by the ecclesiastical courts, and the Church didn't end a marriage without very, very good reason. Even these divorces didn't allow a couple to remarry, though, and they were more akin to what we would today call a legal separation, with no shared legal or financial responsibilities going forward. It was freedom, but only to a point."

"The only way to obtain a complete dissolution that allowed for remarriage was to secure a parliamentary divorce, and these were notoriously difficult to obtain. They began with a criminal conversation case, because they relied on adultery by one of the parties to make them even a slight possibility. If a woman committed crim. con., her life in polite society was over."

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himexyandere · 8 months

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Leaves Fall Just Like Us

Pairing: Yandere Male!Spider x Female!Reader

Word count: 1750

Content Warning(s): Possessive behavior, manipulation, drugging (via venom), nonconsensual groping, slight mindbreak

A/N: So this is my first post on this separate, yandere-centered blog, I hope y'all like it! 💗 (Also, our ML's name is pronounced like "rain")

You weren’t sure how or even when you managed to get yourself lost in a mansion, which you originally assumed to be abandoned. That assumption of yours was swiftly proven false as you noted that no part of the mansion looked neglected. Aged, yes, but there were hardly any specks of dust to be found.

In contrast to the cleanliness of the place, there were spiderwebs in almost every corner, nook, and cranny that you’d laid your eyes on. The afternoon sun illuminated most of the space, but you could tell that based on the burnt oranges and light pinks decorating the marble floors, the light was fleeting and wouldn’t last for much longer.

You had to leave—now.

As soon as that singular thought crossed your mind, you began to backtrack immediately, feet seemingly on autopilot. You didn’t make it three steps back before you ran into something solid, eliciting a surprised-sounding grunt from whatever you’d collided with. Ignoring the fear sirens blaring in your mind, you whipped around without a second thought, only to come face-to-face (or more like face-to-chest) with a human. Or at least, that was what you would’ve liked to say—

Your eyes scaled the figure, just barely flitting to the side as inhuman appendages flooded your peripherals, continuing upward until you were gazing into the eyes—multiple pairs of eyes—of what you assumed to be a man-spider...? You were screaming before you knew it, which caused the humanoid spider’s eyes (all eight of them) to widen as he raised his arms surrenderingly, dropping a book he had been clutching onto in the process.

“Please, don’t be afraid!” He rushed to calm your fright while attempting to make himself look as disarming as possible; which, of course, wasn’t an easy feat as he was an intimidating height equipped with six pedipalps sprouting from his back and chelicerae framing his face. “I mean you no harm, I swear!”

“W-who—” Was all you could manage to say in response as your body trembled of its own accord.

The man-spider gave you a little smile then took a small step back to give you some more space. That didn’t really help, though, because now you could see just how tall he really was. For the most part, he was built like a normal, human man — if it weren’t for the obvious spider-esque parts, of course.

“My name is Raigne,” The man before you canted his head a little to the side. “May I ask what your name is, my guest?”

“[Your Name]...” You offered him your name without a second thought, leading you to wonder if it was out of politeness(?) or innate fear. Perhaps it was a mixture of both?

Then, as if you’d only remembered where you were and that you were indeed an active participant in this conversation, your eyebrows furrowed in confusion as you looked at Raigne.

“Wait, ‘guest’..?” He’d referred to you as “his guest” mere moments ago, but getting over the bizarreness of the situation was difficult, admittedly.

“Well, yes, you are in my home. That makes you my guest, doesn’t it?” The smile on Raigne’s face widened a touch. “Though it appears we’ve gotten off on the wrong foot, dear [Your Name]. Tell me, how did you end up here?”

Honestly, you were just as confused as he was. You remembered traveling with a group of explorers to find abandoned structures for an ongoing research project the lot of you were participating in, only to end up in this unfamiliar place. You were alone and there were no signs of your group. At one point, you tried writing it off as a convoluted dream until you came to realize that pinching yourself did not result in you waking up.

After racking your brain for a suitable answer to give the man, whose home you’d unknowingly intruded into, you eventually came up with nothing. “I… Don’t remember…” You felt bad, but you didn’t want to lie.

Fortunately, Raigne was pretty understanding and instead offered you a sympathetic smile.

“That’s perfectly alright, I’m sure the answer you’re looking for will come with enough time,” He said before bending at the waist to pick up the book he’d dropped. “In the meantime, would you mind coming with me, [Your Name]? Regardless of how you got here, I would still like to treat you as a guest, if you don’t mind.”

As apprehensive as you were to trust a complete stranger, (never mind the fact that he was, well… A spider) you didn’t see any other choice at the time being. After a few moments, you gave him a nod and a hesitant smile.

“S-sorry, thank you for having me, Raigne…”

The smile returned to Raigne’s face, wider than before in a way that seemed unnatural, accentuating his chelicerae.

“Please, it is my pleasure, [Your Name].”

You’re unsure of how much time you’ve spent with Raigne. Days? Weeks? Months? At this point, it very well could have been years, but you had no way of knowing, nor did you really care to. He provided you with a room, clothes, food, and entertainment — what more could you ask for?

Being with Raigne was a pleasant experience as well, once you overcame your initial fear of him. He was polite and accommodating, on top of understanding. He knew how scary spiders could be, so he took the time to ease your worries by reassuring you with some spider facts.

“Most male spiders don’t bite, nor do they produce much venom, so you’ll never have to worry about that!” Was what he told you in response to you asking if he was a venomous spider.

His answer brought you a sense of relief, and you noticeably began to relax around him afterward. Not only was Raigne a gracious host, he was also an interesting person overall to conversate with and you found yourself enjoying his company quite a bit.

As you sat with Raigne in his study enjoying a cup of coffee and chatting idly, your gaze was drawn outside the window behind him as the movement from a falling brown leaf caught your attention.

“Huh… Looks like it’s gonna be autumn soon.” You remarked as you swirled your finger around the rim of your now-empty cup.

Raigne stopped talking and followed your gaze out the window, staring in silence as the frequency of falling leaves increased. His odd shift in behavior should’ve been the first sign that Raigne was feeling… Off.

After your conversation, Raigne quickly retired to his room with the excuse of “feeling a little under the weather”, and shut his door without another word. It couldn’t have been something you said, right? Your conversation up until that point was light, amicable… So what the heck was up with him? You figured you could wait until later to ask him, since now seemed to be a bad time.

Later that night, after getting ready for bed, you decided to go back to Raigne’s room and check on him.

“Raigne? Are you in there?” You called out softly after knocking on his door twice.

No response.

You pressed your ear to the door, only to realize that it was already open. You pushed your way in, worry clouding your senses as you scanned the dark room. You’d only been inside Raigne’s room a handful of times before this, but for some reason, it was a little more… Foreboding during the night.

“Raigne..?” You tried calling him again as you stepped fully into the room, looking around the spacious area to find him.

A soft click sounded from behind you, but it was already too late.

Before you could even think to turn around, you were wrapped up in a familiar pair of arms and pedipalps, holding you rigidly in place until you felt a pair of fangs sinking into your neck. Then came the injection of an unidentified fluid—venom, you presumed, even in your stunned state. Who else could it be but Raigne clutching your body, back flushed with his chest as he bit you?

“I’m sorry, [Your Name],” Were the first words out of his mouth once he was through with the envenomation, followed along by a low chuckle. “You’re sweet, did you know that? A little too trusting as well… But that’s what I love about you.”

Raigne then nuzzled into the crook of your neck, right next to the spot where he’d sunk his pincers into you not mere seconds ago.

“W-why, d’you…” Your question was slurred and delirious-sounding, which only made Raigne coo at you in the same affectionate way one would do to a cute, struggling kitten.

“Hmm? Do you mean to ask why I’m biting you when I told you that male spiders typically don’t?” You couldn’t even nod, but he seemed to know that he’d hit the nail on the head.

“Well, my dear, I did tell you that most male spiders don’t bite… I never said that I didn’t,” Raigne chuckled again, still nuzzling against you. “Oh, and about the venom… It isn’t lethal, don’t worry. Why in the world would I want a dead bride? I’m a spider, not a specter~”

As he continued speaking, the frequency of his nuzzling increased, and you still found yourself unable to move a muscle. Your entire body was paralyzed.

“Did you know? Autumn is the mating season for most spiders,” Raigne’s unoccupied hands began to wonder then, starting from your shoulders and trailing down to your breasts. “I was wondering how I should court you... I truly apologize for not doing it properly, but I really could not help myself!”

He bent down closer to whisper in your ear, as if his words were much too sacred to be spoken aloud, “You are so alluring… I’m surprised by how uncouth I am behaving because of how much I want you.”

His words took on a somewhat warbly tone, entering into a raspy, dreamy-like pitch. It didn’t help that he was still groping you, hands eager and thorough in their exploration of your chest. In his mind, he had all the time in the world to do so, after all — and it wasn’t like you would be going anywhere anytime soon, what with his pedipalps still holding you and his venom in your blood.

Raigne fully intended to make you his bride.

Once that thought crossed your hazy mind, the idea of freedom slowly slipped away until you could think of nothing else...

#male yandere x reader #yandere drabble #yandere scenarios #yandere fanfiction #yandere x reader #yandere spider #my writing #yandere #yandere male #male yandere #yandere boyfriend #male oc x reader #original character #yandere teratophilia #teratophillia

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sparrowlucero · 2 months

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moffat's weird fetish for lesbians and general misogyny turns me off everything he does. he creeps me out. that said, he does make very good one or two episode stories, like empty child. but every time he gets to write a story that goes longer than four episodes, like some of his work outside dw, hyde comes to mind, it turns into a poorly written convoluted mess with the most insultingly written women and ridiculous plot revelations. i had to ditch 11th era who bc it got intolerable and it turned me off the show entirely till 13. but he could be the best writer of all time, and i'd still think he's a lesbian obsessed weirdo who can't write a realistic woman if he had a gun to his head.

weird ask to send a gay woman talking about how they like his work, especially since you say you didn't watch the show I was referring to...?

But yeah I, again, strongly disagree, I think his character work is compelling and his plotting is very layered and thematically rich, and I don't think the one lesbian lead in that era of doctor who is fetishized at all.

#it's kind of hard to respond thoughtfully to this because it isn't really applicable to the show i'm talking about #anyways i don't want to ramble about stuff I like on main

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collecting-dustbunnies · 30 days

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Obey Me Nightbringer Theory Time: MC is an Unreliable Narrator

Part 1: MC is an Unreliable Narrator | Part 2: A Clash of Ideals

What if the MC knows more than they are letting on? What if the MC's motives is different from ours, as the player?

(Disclaimer: Long post. Different from my meme content. Contains spoilers for all of NB and OG content. Also I may wake up tomorrow and cringe at this, but hopefully you can enjoy my delirium?)

OG = Obey Me Original

NB = Obey Me Nightbringer

It all starts from the beginning

We can see traces of this from when we first launch the game, with MC's first text messages with Nightbringer. And I'm not talking about the messages that we saw when the game first launched, but the new re-write of those same messages. You can compare the differences between the old texts and the new texts on @impish-ivy 's post here (thank you for allowing me to discuss it here). I'll include some of their screenshots as reference.

Let's take a look at the new version of the text exchange. Now, I don't know about you, but I have no idea what Nightbringer is talking about. But Sheep-chan apparently does! If MC answers that they think they understand what he's talking about, they get to keep their memories when they get sent to the past. But if MC says they don't have a clue? The game assumes that they have lost their memories. This seems like a strong indicator that MC knows something that we, as the player, do not know about Nightbringer and their powers. This exchange is very different from how things played out in the original version of these text messages where:

Yes I know them. Really well, actually = MC has their memories.

I don't know who they are = MC has no memories.

[The official reason for this change was "to make the game more enjoyable for new players", but I don't buy that. In the original version, it was quite clear which option you had to pick to signal to the game that you have not played OG. While in this version, it's way more convoluted, since the player will have no idea what Nightbringer is actually talking about. It just causes people who have played OG to accidentally signal to the game that they haven't. Why change the text to be even more confusing, when the original version would have sufficed for newer players?]

Now let's follow this line of thought for a moment. Nightbringer states that the MC has received "a second chance at a fated meeting", and MC has to answer that they think they know what this means if they want to keep their memories during the time jump. If they don't, then Nightbringer assumes that they have lost their memories.

Which leads me to believe that Sheep-chan is not entirely an innocent victim who was unwittingly sent to the past. Instead, they were a willing participant of the time jump. Maybe they have some understanding on how Nightbringer's powers worked and wanted to meet the brothers again. Maybe they too were curious to see what their ideal world looked like. With this idea in mind, let's re-evaluate everything MC has said and done in NB.

MC's interactions with Nightbringer (and Michael, I guess)

After the intro, the next time MC directly interacts with Nightbringer is in Lesson 12 of NB, where they get sent into a coma after breaking the rules at the Fountain of Knowledge. Let's look at what he says here for a moment.

The first thing Nightbringer asks MC is what they think of this world, a rather unusual thing to ask someone who is kinda sorta dying. If MC says they want to go home, Nightbringer expresses some confusion as to whether the brothers of this world are not to MC's liking. It makes sense for him to be confused here, since he sent MC to this timeline under the impression that they would like this world (or at least, view this world as a stepping stone to reach their "place of joy").

(Then again, if MC responds that they are enjoying this world, Nightbringer is even more perplexed that they can remain upbeat in such a precarious situation. But knowing what canon Sheep-chan is like, why is this surprising?)

After this, he explains that his motive is to lead MC to a place that will "bring [them] joy like no other". This fits what he had said in the beginning of the game:

"Shall I take you someplace you will be happy? Somewhere that will bring you more joy than any other."

"A world you desire, and where you will be desired."

- Nightbringer, intro text message

He then goes on to emphasise that both he and MC want the same thing. He comments on how MC has done a splendid job getting closer to Lucifer and his brothers. This is where I feel that Nightbringer was never MC's enemy, as both parties have similar goals, and they need each other to some extent. MC needed Nightbringer and other mysterious forces to set the gears in motion so that MC can become closer to the brothers, forge pacts with them, and reach their "ideal" world. Nightbringer wants to bring MC to this place of happiness, and he sees MC forming pacts with the brothers as the way to get there. In this case, Nightbringer is a co-conspirator here.

This idea then gets brought up again when MC sees Michael in Lesson 13, when he saves MC from their coma. He warns MC that the Celestial Realm would be less willing to tolerate their behaviour if they ally themselves with Nightbringer (which, is exactly what MC has been doing so far). Is Michael afraid of the MC trying to forge their ideal world together with Nightbringer? Or is he afraid that MC is getting tricked by Nightbringer?

This also explains why Nightbringer never interacted with MC again after this incident. Everything MC had done in NB was what Nightbringer had wanted as well. Nightbringer didn't need to intervene because everything was going according to his plan.

Comparison of MC's actions in OG vs NB

When we consider the fact that MC may have actually wanted to go back to the past and meet the brothers again, a lot of their actions (and even their inaction) makes more sense. When Solomon tells them they need to make the pacts to get back to their own time, MC is in no rush to obtain these pacts. In fact, they don't even think about making those pacts until Season 2 when they are faced with an ultimatum to make those pacts, which is, they have to forge the pacts before MC and Solomon lose their connection to their original time. This is different from the usual behaviour in OG, where they were extremely motivated to make a pact with every brother from Beelzebub -> Asmo -> Satan and employed help from multiple people to acheive this goal. They even took the initiative to ask Lucifer for a pact on the day before they left the Devildom, when they had no reason to do so.

This is very different from how Season 2 of NB played out, as MC simply waited around until each brother went beserk (in the case of Mammon, Asmo and Satan) before they even thought about proposing the pact. In Lucifer's case, even though MC (after much prompting) spoke up about needing to go back to their home, it was Mephistopheles advocating for MC that ultimately convinced Lucifer to let MC go. And later on, MC remained on the sidelines and let the other characters take the reign in rescuing Lucifer from Cocytus. Compared to the original game, where MC takes on a more active role in forming their pacts, MC is more passive in Nightbringer, simply biding their time until the opportunity to make a pact falls onto their lap. Is this how somebody who desperately misses their home and wants to go back ASAP would act?

Regardless of how you choose to play the MC as, they always express some hesitation in leaving behind the brothers of the past. No matter how many times you try to make the MC say they want to go back home ASAP, Lucifer will gaslight-gatekeep-girlboss MC into admitting that they do not want to leave. Simeon in Lesson 35 of NB even reaffirms this by saying "I'm sure you really feel that way deep down inside. Even if you don't realise it". Bruh.

But why? MC should know that their home is with the boys of the present timeline. Why has the MC never considered the repercussions of staying in a timeline that they don't belong in? Or even considered how Solomon could lose his powers for good because of MC's hesitance? Why had MC never once stopped to consider how the demon brothers they had left behind would feel about their absence? This shouldn't even be a dilemma.

Unless... this past was the place they wanted to end up in the first place. That, like Nightbringer had said, this place will bring them joy like no other.

As an aside: One of the few insights we get about Sheep-chan's inner thoughts is the nightmare they have about the brothers trapping them in the attic and preventing them from leaving (in Lesson 33 of NB). Which has horrific implications, considering the attic still did not exist at this point of time. Was Belphegor's imprisonment and the Lesson 16 incident so traumatic for MC that the attic is the place that they associate with imprisonment?

Note how some of the brothers keep suggesting that THIS is the outcome that the MC really wants. But this also provides another possible reason for the MC's hesitation to leave: The fear of how the brothers' of the past would react. The fear of brothers turning against them, despite everything MC had done to protect them. Speaking of what MC had done to protect them...

MC forging their place in the past Devildom

MC hasn't taken active measures to forge their pacts to return home, but you know what they have shown to be more interested in? Asserting their place in the Devildom of the past, and spending time with the past version of the brothers.

The best example of this is Lesson 11 of NB, where the MC hesitates to promise to Solomon to protect humanity, but with no hesitation, promises to take care of the brothers even with full knowledge that they would be punished for doing this. If we remember Lesson 35 of OG where MC, Solomon and the demon brothers went to the reaper's cave to break Beel's curse, Solomon was surprised that the demon brothers' punishments for breaking the reaper's rules (turning into a Little D) were so mild. It was implied that without MC unconsciously protecting them with their magic, the brothers could have died or been wiped out from existence upon breaking the rules.

A weakened MC of the past who retains their memories of this incident in the reaper's cave would know just how severe the backlash would be if they make promises in the cave. But this did not stop them from doing so anyway. This shows where MC's allegiance truly lies: Not with humanity, not with any mysterious forces at play, but with the demon brothers. It's hard to tell what the MC hopes to get out of making such a dangerous promise.

The most optimistic take is that they felt forced to prove their loyalty to Lucifer and his family by taking such a drastic action. After all, MC is used to sacrificing their life for the people they love. Throwing themselves at death is nothing new to them.

The most cynical take would be that this bold decision was actually a calculated move by the MC to assert their importance and their role in the demon lords' lives. To show just how bad things can get without them. To guilt-trip Lucifer and Belphegor who had doubted the MC's allegiance, so that they never doubt MC again.

Regardless of their motivation, the MC's actions showed that they are inseparable from Lucifer's family, and this incident served to further cement the MC's importance to them. This allowed MC to strengthen their bonds with the brothers once again. So that they can create a world they desire, and they will be desired.

Putting this all together

Obey Me: Nightbringer paints the image of a MC being ripped from their home and being thrust into an unfamiliar world. Yet, the MC's actions in NB tell a different story. It shows us that Nightbringer is turning the gears so that MC can go to a place surrounded by people that they love, and who will love them no matter what. Because it wouldn't be enough if the characters of the present were hopelessly in love with them, but the characters of the past should also feel the same way. Even if that is a world the MC does not belong in.

All I'm saying is, Sheep-chan is sus as heck.

#i told myself i would stop making theory posts for om #because what actually happens ends up being way more boring #but this brainrot has been consuming me for weeks #obviously i don't think the game will ever go this route #but it's fun to think about regardless #obey me #obey me nightbringer #obey me mc #obey me analysis #obey me theory #LONG #db rambles #btw this is the only time you'll see me typing metformin's name correctly

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riddlerosehearts · 6 months

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i am so tired of seeing this screenshot about wish's ending reposted everywhere and used to make fun of the movie:

and this is coming from someone who didn't even like the movie very much, but this is misrepresenting what happened. yes, there is a thing where asha wears a cloak resembling that of the fairy godmother and at the end star makes her a magic wand and the kids say she's like a fairy godmother, king magnifico does get trapped in a mirror, etc, and the movie was absolutely filled with easter eggs and references to previous movies--yep, when i saw the movie i did in fact take these scenes as just easter eggs! after all, think about this logically, if all currently existing movies in the disney animated canon were meant to take place in the same universe, and asha canonically grows up to be cinderella's fairy godmother, then...

how can you explain such a drastic difference in appearance? how can you justify asha, a brown-skinned afro-hispanic girl with a face full of freckles and long brown hair, and this old white woman being the same person? you can't, because they're not!!!! if i recall correctly asha doesn't even wear that cloak at the end when they're calling her a fairy godmother, she just wears it during one scene when she's a fugitive and has to sneak around. also...

the creators of the movie have directly confirmed that they were not trying to set up a disney multiverse and that it's not meant to be taken that seriously. rapunzel and eugene's cameo in frozen also wasn't meant to be taken anywhere near as seriously as everyone took it. neither were any previous cameos like belle in hunchback of notre dame or aurora in oliver and company (and if aurora being in oliver and company was canon, she'd be over 600 years old!). and, back to wish specifically, the little easter egg earlier in the movie where magnifico sees a wish bubble from someone who wants the perfect nanny to take care of their kids and says he's "poppin' that one" also doesn't mean the banks family from mary poppins canonically lives in rosas. the scene at the end where a boy named peter who wears all green and dreams of creating a flying machine goes to work with a girl in a blue nightgown whose wish is to fly doesn't mean peter pan and wendy actually somehow lived together in rosas and knew each other before the movie peter pan ever happened. it is literally impossible for all of these movies to take place in the same time period and universe, so it's a good thing that they, uh, don't, and were never intended to. please, if you don't like the movie, that's perfectly fine, but don't say disney is trying to create some convoluted multiverse and "MCU-ify" their movies when that just literally isn't true.

#disney #wish #disney wish #ughhhh #wish 2023 #nobody is even going to see this post or care but whatever. i am Tired.#one person i explained this to said even they KNEW it was all just easter eggs but they hated the movie and wanted to shit on it #and like??? what is the point??? if you hate it that bad then make fun of it for something that's actually true at least 😭😭#to be completely honest i feel like the fact that there is zero logical way for asha to be THE fairy godmother #should've tipped people off if nothing else!?!?!?#you can even tell that the cloaks aren't the exact same--asha's doesn't have sleeves and has purple inside the hood #anyway i'm so glad princess aurora really was literally there in the 1980s in oliver and company #even though she was born in the 1300s #we stan disney's first immortal vampire queen <3

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runawaymarbles · 2 months

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SGA Fic rec

I've never seen SGA but that's not going to stop me from making a rec list for it. Is the characterization accurate? who the hell knows. Not me. I'm just here for a good time.

These are not in any order whatsoever.

A Slightly Different Quality of Light by rageprufrock | M | 5k | John/Rodney

Rodney has to go through John's memories when he accidentally uploads them all to Atlantis servers.

Navigation by rageprufrock | M | 26k | John/Rodney

Trauma and therapy. Mind the warnings.

Whither by Daephraelle | 15k | T | John/Rodney

John learns Rodney has feelings for him and handles it completely responsibly and reasonably and ha ha ha ha jk

Oolon Colluphid Was Right by melannen | G | 1k | John/Rodney

Communication in pop culture references. Ask me about my translation.

Proof by Contradiction by astolat | E | 10k | John/Rodney

Sex pollen aftermath.

Friendly by Speranza | E | 6k | John/Rodney

Secret gay stargate network that John is left out of.

Sheppard's Law by Speranza | E | 40k | John/Rodney

Rodney time travels through John's life.

Kid A by Speranza | E | 8k | John/Rodney

John and Rodney are hooking up except John is definitely not gay about it no sir.

Just So Long and Long Enough by busaikko | T | 8k | John/Rodney

Dave Sheppard tries to send John care packages.

Weddings, Plural, and a Yak by Speranza | E | 18k | John/Rodney

John and Rodney keep getting married for convoluted reasons and it's funny until it isn't. Also Rodney adopts a chaos child. John is normal about it.

War Bride by Speranza | E | 9k | John/Rodney

John and Rodney have a weird dinner with Dave and his wife, then go to space and almost get ritualistically murdered. It's genuinely very sweet.

Ordinary Life by astolat, Speranza | E | 20k | John/Rodney

They get shore leave, go to Florida for one of Rodney's contracts, and things go about how you'd expect (people try to kill them.)

paper cranes (upstairs, downstairs) by verity | M | 18k | John/Rodney

Rodney stays at John's childhood home and is bad about opsec.

Decision Point by esteefee | M | 23k | John/Rodney

Rodney tries very hard to retire to Nevada and John tries very hard to go back to space.

Your Inevitable Unhappy Ending by Helenish | E | 15k | John/Rodney

Rodney tries to attract women by carrying around a baby, and there are some delightfully awkward conversations. And a sex temple.

My Home And Native Land by copperbadge | 17k | T | very very background Rodney/John

Ronan becomes friends with Chuck, and decides to become Canadian.

#sga #stargate atlantis #mcshep #john sheppard #rodney mckay #most of these are like 15 years old so everyone has probably already read them. However! I have decided rec lists are a good form of #fandom engagement because I do not actually want anyone to read my bookmarks since they all have spoiler notes #op

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the-martyrfication-of-the-matron · 11 months

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Hey new to the aphmau fandom, like days old, and i was wondering what order to watch her rps as its kinda confusing to me

This is going to be such a long post because there’s so much to say! (There is a TLDR at the end if you don’t care about specifics and just want a watch order)

The inclusion of side-series and stuff just convolutes things a tad. But I promise, you will get an answer.

First;

I suggest a side series to start. Which isn’t to say that they’re all short, they’re just not relevant to the Big Two.

But, yeah, just dip your toe in the pool first.

Dreams of Estorra- never watched it. But it’s popular. It should be on the Aphmau Stories channel instead of her main one, if you can’t find it there. If someone can offer me a summary for it I would love you.

A Royal Tale- a weird mishmash of Disney and the Aphverse. A lighthearted fantasy show with some adult humour, Lo (< an icon), and romance. It will introduce you to some of the characters from the other series without overwhelming you with references you won’t understand. Aarmau, but they’re exes who hate eachother. It’s only a roleplay

Mermaids Tale- similar thing to ART, a mermaid au for Aphverse. Very Aarmau centric, there’s lesbian mermaids. I cant actually remember the plot but it got me into my train (the singer) phase. It’s only a roleplay

Mod Mod world- never watched it, but it did get a sequel that I’ll bring up later. Again, would love a summary from someone.

My Inner Demons- it’s one of the only non-aphmau centric shows and doesn’t include ANY aphverse characters. The main character is Ava, and it’s set up like a Harem Anime with a bunch of male demon love interests for her. It has quite adult humour, but it’s pretty cute aesthetically and deserves a second season. It’s only a roleplay

HeartPoint- a girl sees how much people like her platonically and romantically by little stats that appear above their heads. I believe Aphmau is the only Aphverse character, and whilst the romance is pretty obvious to me, I’ll leave who she ends up with blank as that’s kind of a part of the series… iirc. It’s only a roleplay.

There may be more… I’ll have to look.

Anyways.

So.

Onto the behemoths.

Minecraft Diaries is the first of the Roleplays to really get her popularity. It’s a medieval fantasy, with both roleplay and let’s play elements in it. It ran for three seasons, seasons one and two being 100 episodes each, however season 3 ended short. It was never completed. Season three is regarded as the worst season, and most either don’t consider it canon or haven’t watched it at all, but I consider it canon solely because it introduces us Lo, who I love. The two main ships when it was popular were Laurmau and Garmau, and if it weren’t for MyS, they probably still would be treated as such.

If you want to watch the main series in chronological order, I would watch MCD first. It is my favourite tho so maybe I’m biased. The lore can be contradictory and the quality slowly improves over time. It started to get remade with Rebirth, which you can watch before hand to get a general gist of the show before you dive into it, though it isn’t incredibly accurate to how the original is. Seasons 1-2 are on Aphmau’s main channel (I think), but season 3 is on Aphmau Stories. You don’t need to watch MyStreet but, you will probably end up watching it anyways.

Brief intermission: Void Paradox. The Mod Mod world sequel, is also a side series for MCD s1, and was made years afterwards. Very high quality, probably one of the better side series in general, and deserved a continuation. MMW isn’t required to watch it, but for context on Laurence and what’s up with him, MCD s1 is.

The next is MyStreet. It started as a modern Au for Diaries with the side stories and The Big Move, however began to be made into its own series. It begins as a slice of life, and is very light hearted with an Aarmau emphasis. It faces a genre swap for Season 4, before reverting to a slightly more solemn version of what it once was, before it goes back to a darker vibe for s6. Until s6, it existed in a separate universe to MCD, and you don’t need to watch MCD to understand it (though it does provide some context for s6)

There are prequels and side series (and a three episode sequel, which is fun). PDH is the main one, and because MyS was made first, they can contradict, however you will need to watch PDH S2 for context for MyS S4. Otherwise you won’t know the villain or understand what the fuck he’s doing. After them, there is PDH: Graduation days, and FalconClaw University. Neither are particularly important, but again, FCU offers some context for s4, so… you could watch it. It’s just not mandatory. There’s Aphmau’s year after s4, which is just a recovery mini-season, and there’s Her Wish which was released before s6, but set after it. And I will give them credit, they did preplan when they wrote her wish and watching it after s6 and realising everything they did to retain continuity… oh it’s good. Her wish does require watching MCD S3/late s2 though, it won’t make sense without it.

TLDR;

If a series isn’t Void Paradox, Mystreet, MCD, Phoenix Drop High or FalconClaw Uni, you can just watch it whenever.

MCD / PDH / MYS is my personal favourite watch order, because it’s all chronological. But just go with whatever you vibe with!

MCD is the OG and fantasy Medieval, but is a mix of roleplay and let’s play, and doesn’t have entirely consistent lore. It has a partial remake and it’s final, incomplete season, sucked.

PDH is higher quality and a highschool drama with fantasy undertones but less relevant, and is a prequel for MyS

MYS is the most popular and is a slice of life with more fantasy undertones, as well as very high quality, but suffers through genre swaps, and requires some context from the other two in later seasons.

#aphmau #aphverse #aphblr #minecraft diaries #mcd #mystreet

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babyangelsky · 18 days

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Two Worlds: Novel vs. Series (Part 1)

A few days ago, I mentioned that I had begun reading the novel for Two Worlds because I was curious about the changes that had been made for the adaption. Truthfully, I've been curious about it since the special and enough people liked my post to encourage me to put this together, so here we are!

Few things. Firstly, the official English translation of the novel is only updated through chapter 7 which equates to about episode 3 of the series. Approximately.

Secondly, good god is it convoluted so to make things easier on myself and on you, I'm going to break down the changes to each world in two separate posts and not jump around which is what the novel does.

Thirdly, if you'd like to read the novel yourself, the first seven chapters are available for free here! It's the official translation and updates are a bit irregular but it is being updated! Trigger warning for discussion and sometimes graphic mentions of suicide. Please proceed with caution.

I also have to thank @thainovels for being so lovely every time I've asked them for help. What are the odds the novel updated the day after I asked you for help finding a complete version?!

This is gonna be LONG so to spare your dash and anyone who doesn't wanna be spoiled, I'll begin under the cut.

World 1, aka our starting world in the series

Okay so, broad strokes. One of the biggest differences between novel and show so far is how much time we spend in Phupha's perspective and indeed, in perspectives other than Phupha's or Kram's. We really only get Kram's perspective in the chapters dedicated to World 1 and he's barely appeared in the chapters dedicated to World 2 so far.

This author also really loves to go on a tangent which kinda bugs me in a "I'm a writer too and I wouldn't do things this way dammit" sort of way and while that's my own cross to bear, objectively it does pull focus from the main plot and make the story more confusing than it has to be. Although I do appreciate the insight into the other characters.

How Things Start Off

Unlike the show which opens with Kram painting by the river, the novel opens with Kram trying to make friends with Phupha. At this point it's unclear how long Phupha has been staying at Kram's house but it doesn't seem like it's been very long.

In the show, Kram is the grumpy one who doesn't wanna talk or hang out and Phupha is the more open one, but it's flipped in the novel. Kram is a lonely lil ball of sunshine and he's excited to make a new friend and Phupha's generally very grumpy about his circumstances.

Kram also calls him "your grace" which I suspect is what the translator chose to use in place of "khun chai" since Kram also calls him that in the show a few times. I really wish the show had kept this detail because unlike in the show, Kram uses khun chai playfully and eventually affectionately. It's also worth noting that he doesn't call Phupha "phi" despite their age difference because he doesn't want to create distance between them.

Their first bonding experience is going for a walk just like in the show rather than walk aimlessly in the forest, Kram takes him to see the waterfall that is so central to our story. The locals refer to it as Moonshadow Cave.

We learn that Phupha is afraid of heights (and very traumatized) because of the circumstances surrounding his mother's suicide. He opens up to Kram about it and also tells him why his father sent him to stay with Kram and his father.

At one point, Kram steps onto a little ledge around the back of the waterfall and gently coaxes Phupha to join him so they can see the view. But remember, Phupha is afraid of heights and traumatized so after a few moments he panics and goes to turn back. But he turns back a little too quickly and stumbles and ends up face to face and very close to Kram.

SO THEY KISS ABOUT IT. Maybe it's adrenaline, maybe it's horniness, who knows! Certainly not Phupha!

It's getting late so they come down from the mountain to go home. Kram's head is spinning from the kiss, he's confused, he can still taste Phupha. Phupha's confused too, he doesn't know why the hell he kissed Kram, and just as he's in the middle of telling Kram that it was just the adrenaline and didn't mean anything, they hear something rustling in the tall grass.

The Tiger Incident

Yep. The thing they hear is a tiger smack in the middle of having a deer for dinner. Here is the first of two or three major plot points (so far) that were cut from the adaptation entirely.

They come across the tiger and even though they try to move as quietly and slowly as they can to get away, they don't get very far before the tiger notices them and starts chasing them down. As they're running, Kram falls and hurts his leg. Kram knows of a small cave where they can hide, and They manage to duck into it just in time. Fortunately the entrance is too small for the tiger to follow them in there so they're safe but homeboy is still waiting outside to eat them, so they're forced to stay there until morning or until he gets bored and leaves.

Kram and Phupha snuggle together for warmth because of course they do and in the middle of the night, Phupha realizes that Kram has a fever.

The next morning, Phupha sees that Kram hasn't gotten any better so he decides to go and get help for him. Luckily the tiger is gone, so he leaves the cave and marks himself a path so he can find his way back. When he exits the forest, he sees Kram's dad and a group of villagers talking amongst themselves. They'd been looking for the two of them since they hadn't returned from their walk and are very relieved to see Phupha.

Phupha tells everyone what happened and they go back for Kram, and this is where things get very weird. He notices that the branches he broke to mark his path aren't broken anymore and when he and the villagers arrive at the cave, the weeds that were covering the cave entrance are thicker than they were before. And Kram?

Kram is fucking gone.

He is straight up gone. He is not in the cave where Phupha left him despite being sick and unable to move because of his injured leg. Phupha obviously begins questioning his sanity as a search gets underway.

Fifty people including police search the forest for two entire days to absolutely zero avail. Kram is nowhere to be found. It's like the forest swallowed him whole and Phupha is feeling so guilty and Kram's dad is being so kind and not blaming him at all and it's all very fraught.

The search is paused on the third day because of heavy rain but that's not about to stop Phupha. He needs to find Kram and he's in the forest desperately wracking his mind for every last detail of the path he took from the cave and the surroundings while rain is pouring down on him. He thinks he might've found the right spot and sees a cave, but passes out before he can reach it.

When he wakes up, he's back at Kram's house being tended to by Duandow, Kram's childhood friend (we'll get to her in a bit). First thing he does is ask about Kram and miracle of miracles, KRAM HAS BEEN FOUND AND IS OKAY! His leg wasn't broken and he's in rough shape after not having any food or water for a couple days but he's expected to make a full recovery.

Duandow tells him that the cave Kram was found in--the one Phupha passed out in front of--was in an area that had already been searched by the police and that the locals believe that dark magic blocked the entrance to it, which is why they hadn't been able to find Kram before.

If that sounds really goddamn weird to you, THAT'S BECAUSE IT IS. Something fucky is going on with this forest but there are absolutely no answers I can give you as to the why and the how. The novel hasn't given us anything yet.

Phupha and Kram

Another huge difference between the show and the novel is just how much the relationship between Phupha and Kram progresses and how physical it actually is. In the show we only get a few kisses and some snuggling but they go a lot further in the novel.

A lot further.

After the tiger and the fucky forest trauma bond them, they're hanging out on the mountain near Kram's house one evening and as they get to talking and open up to each other some more, they're interrupted by a swarm of fireflies. Kram tries to catch one for Phupha but can't quite manage it, and somehow they end up very close together again.

SO THEY KISS ABOUT IT. AGAIN.

Not only do they kiss about it, clothes start coming off and things start getting hot and heavy before Kram's dad calls up and interrupts them. He doesn't actually see anything (since they're horizontal and shielded by the brush) but he does notice the state they're in when they come down.

Which leads me nicely to the painting.

The Nude Portrait

Remember the nude portrait Kram did of Phupha? In the show, it comes about after Kram accidentally paints Scarface Tai. Phupha sees the painting and realizes how skilled Kram is and hires Kram to paint him.

In the novel, Kram shows Phupha a spare room where he stores all his works and as they're looking through them, Phupha comes across a nude portrait Kram had done of DUANDAOW. KRAM'S CHILDHOOD FRIEND.

Kram tells him that she had agreed to pose for him one day so he could practice painting figures, as all artists do, and Phupha gets all quiet and grumpy and jealous about it. So what does he do? Hire Kram to paint a nude portrait for him like the one Kram had done for Duandaow.

If you'll recall, this is pretty much what happens in the show when Tai asks Kram do paint a nude portrait of him. He gets jealous because Kram had done one of Phupha and asks for one just like it. It seems like the writers reworked that bit since they also wrote out that Kram had done a portait of Duandaow.

And that's not all they reworked.

The painting session with Phupha in the novel begins the same as it does in the show. Kram is doing his thing while Phupha looks all pretty with his cloth in the river. But just like the nude painting scene with Tai, Kram starts getting distracted because of how good Phupha looks.

And I just have to say, the author always makes a point to describe how beautiful Phupha is, but I especially appreciate them taking the time to tell us that Phupha has lovely ample breasts and pretty nipples. Especially because wiping sweat off those lovely ample breasts is what brings Kram so very close to Phupha for the third time. Except this time, they don't just kiss about it.

THEY FUCK ABOUT IT. RIGHT BY THE RIVER. AND THEN GO RIGHT BACK TO THE PAINTING SESSION WHEN THEY'RE DONE.

In the show, this painting scene is where we get their first kiss but as you have seen, beloved reader, we are several kisses in by this point in the novel

Dilok

It's after this that we cut to Kram's dad's perspective for a bit, and I only mention this because it's so goddamn funny and also serves to highlight a few of important points.

The man is just so endearingly oblivious. He saw how disheveled Kram and Phupha were when they came down from the mountain as I mentioned above and assumes they fought each other after having an argument. This man interpreted two horizontal silhouettes moving together as a FIST FIGHT. He assumes they're angry at each other when they won't even look at each other.

THIS MAN THINKS KRAM AND PHUPHA ARE FIGHTING TO THE DEATH EVERY TIME THEY GO UP TO THE MOUNTAIN AND COME BACK LOOKING SWEATY AND FLUSHED AND RUMPLED AND IF THAT'S NOT THE FUNNIEST THING GODDAMN THING I'VE EVER READ I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS.

In one instance, Dilok catches Phupha leaving Kram's bedroom early in the morning and believes Phupha when he tells him he "fell asleep" after he and Kram "talked" all night. Dilok even thinks to himself how proud he is that they're so mature and communicate so well! I love Dilok so much, you don't understand.

That aside, however, his hilarious misinterpretation tells us that unlike in the show, Kram and Phupha are fucking on the reg. And bear in mind that Kram still technically has an ash exchange ceremony coming up with Duandaow but before I get into everything with her, I wanted to share this passage where Dilok happens upon both her and Phupha's portraits because it says something important about Kram's relationship with Duandaow. Also because I love it.

Duandaow

Duandaow's presence is yet another major difference between the novel and the show.

The show doesn't tell us a whole lot about her. We know only that she has an ash exchange ceremony coming up with Kram and that when she realizes that Kram has feelings for Phupha, she takes herself out of the equation so they can be together.

The novel gives us so much more. She's featured prominently when Kram disappears in the forest, she cares for Phupha when he passes out, she appears every time Phupha goes to her grandmother's store to get medicine for Kram, and of course there's the fact that Kram painted her.

She has been in love with Kram her whole life. In addition to getting her history, we learn that they've known each other since childhood and that they were very close since they were the only two children in the village that were the same age. And it's partially because there's no one else for either them that being with Kram is a foregone conclusion to her and it's why she assumes that's the case for him as well.

She confesses to Kram and he responds with something along the lines of "Who would I love if not you? It's just us here." It's not an "I love you, too" but she takes it that way. Kram literally has no one else so his response may seem sweet but to me, it reads as him accepting on some level that there's no other option and settling.

I do think he cares deeply for Duandaow but I don't think he's in love with her. Several things drive this home for me (including that passage above) but the one that stands out the most is actually when they lose their virginity to each other.

It happens one day after they go swimming together (at the infamous waterfall I might add). She makes the first move and he hesitates at first but he gets swept up in the moment and it's all very shy and sweet. Thing is, after it happens, Kram keeps things strictly friendly between them. So much so that she thinks the whole thing got wiped from his memory.

And this sense of "who else if not you" persists pretty much their whole lives up until this point. They have an ash exchange ceremony coming up because why wouldn't they? There's no other option. Oh, the comphet of it all.

She isn't stepping aside for Phupha because she doesn't realize there's something between him and Kram. She notices something there that makes her suspicious but those suspicions are nebulous at best. It never occurs to her that they could have any relationship beyond friendship because why would they?

The Other Love Triangle

Phupha has had silent, one-sided beef with Duandaow ever since he saw that painting of her. He's polite to her but just barely, he doesn't make any effort at friendliness or real conversation. He's jealous and he has good reason to be, because he and Kram haven't declared any feelings for each other or had the "what are we" conversation.

Not only that, there is an ash exchange ceremony coming up. Phupha has no idea what that ceremony is until he asks Kram's dad one day and Dilok tells him IT'S A MARRIAGE CEREMONY. Show!Kram had some nerve getting pissy at Phupha for having a fiancee he didn't tell Kram about when Kram had one too!

Here Phupha is, so very in love and in a very physical relationship with Kram, and then he learns Kram is about to get married to someone else. He doesn't know whether Kram returns his feelings, he doesn't know where he stands, there's been no hint of calling off the wedding, so what does he do?

He takes himself out of the equation just like Duandaow does in the show.

Phupha chooses not to confess his feelings to Kram, he spends one last night snuggling him, and then he takes the L and quietly goes back to his life in Rattha.

Oh, what's that you say? You wanted some salt in that wound? How about the fact that KRAM GOES THROUGH WITH THE CEREMONY AND MARRIES DUANDAOW?

More? HE ONLY REALIZES HIS FEELINGS FOR PHUPHA AFTER HE'S ALREADY GONE AND ONLY MARRIES DUANDAOW OUT OF OBLIGATION AND BECAUSE PHUPHA IS NO LONGER THERE.

It's a MESS and there is no resolution for it because the novel translation isn't done!

*screams*

Tai

You might have noticed that I haven't really talked about Tai and that's because he only shows up once in these few chapters we have so far. The ones that take place in World 1, that is. But boy howdy does he come in with a bang when he does. Literally.

When Phupha hires Kram to paint him, Kram asks him to take him into the city as payment. There's an arts festival happening and Kram wanted to go so he could show off his dad's paintings.

Everything is going lovely, everyone is having a good time. At least until Duandaow shows up and Phupha turns into a salty salmon about it but we already talked about her.

The brand new chief of police has been asked to make a speech to inaugurate the festival and a short while after he gets on stage to make it, there is a bang. It's followed by screams and a second bang.

Tai showed up at the festival, shot an officer in the gut, and then killed the chief in cold blood to get revenge for the chief recently killing his father.

Bedlam ensues. People are screaming and terrified and fleeing the scene and Tai is looking to flee the scene too, but it just so happens that Kram is blocking his escape route. Tai shouts for him to move but something comes over Kram and he's not budging. Doesn't matter how much Tai threatens him or how much Phupha pleads with him, Tai belongs to the gang that killed his mother and he ain't moving.

My boy doesn't move even when Tai points a gun in his face. That's how much he hates this man and everything he represents. And Tai fully intends to kill him, but there's a moment where he locks eyes with Kram and something shifts within him.

There's a shot, but because we switch to Duandaow's perspective in that moment, we don't know exactly what happens. We know only that the shot missed and that Phupha rushed to hug Kram to his body and shield him from the shot.

Kram was in point blank range. There was no way in hell that shot missed unless that's what Tai intended. But that's all we've gotten of Tai in World 1 so far so there hasn't been a chance to dig into anything more.

The Stabbing of Viroj

There's one more thing I wanna mention, which also happens to be the stopping point for the translation at this time.

In the show, in World 1, Phupha's biological father Viroj gets attacked after Phupha and Kram go talk to him about the incident in the gallery with Tai and the conversation Phupha had with his father.

In the novel, that conversation with Adisak and Phupha's aunt and stepmother takes place right after Phupha goes back to Rattha and for the subsequent conversation with Viroj, Phupha is obviously alone.

The circumstances that precede the stabbing at a little different but that's a whole other tangent so I'm not gonna get into it. The rest of it is largely the same as in the show.

Someone breaks in, stabs Viroj, Phupha hears a scream and comes upon the scene, he has the realization about his hemophilia, he calls an ambulance and the police.

Only a few details are different. In the novel, he does actually manage to call for help but help never comes so he decides to take Viroj to the hospital himself. Unfortunately Viroj dies before Phupha can take him.

After his death, Phupha calls his dad Adisak to tell him that someone killed Viroj and to ask him to call for help. Adisak does, and when Phupha gets a call from the paramedics asking for more information, the paramedic asks where the patient was stabbed.

Problem is, Phupha never told Adisak that Viroj had been stabbed. Phupha immediately suspects that Adisak knows more about the attack than he let on and was possibly even behind it.

This is as far as the translation has taken us so I have to stop here. Sometime before the finale I'm gonna write up part two to this absolute saga, which will be the differences between World 2 in the novel and show.

If you've read this far, thank you. You're lovely and I love you. ❤️

#two worlds #two worlds the series #two worlds spoilers #two worlds novel #two worlds novel spoilers

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suzukiblu · 5 months

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Look we all know the existence of certain risks of things like child stardom, mediocre adult supervision, and people who go for specific kinds of positions of authority being fucking bastards, SO: there is an unnecessarily involved omegaverse AU in my head where Rex Leech takes way, WAY worse advantage of a freshly-decanted omega!Superboy in order to pay off all of that money that he owes to assholes, and instead of JUST betting on metahuman fights and making shitty investments and selling Superboy's likeness to anyone who's buying and all that, he kinda just . . . gives Superboy some "tips" for how to win over or get favors from certain people in the entertainment industry and similar fields. Or just anyone Rex is trying to wring some cash out of, basically.

So Rex makes better money! Pays off a couple of debts! Is still irresponsible and shitty with it and making stupid decisions, but look, a couple extra bucks never hurt, and the Kid is fine with it! ‘Course he is!!

And this read-more will DEFINITELY support that POS POV! Definitely!! For sure!!!!

And so not-even-technically-presented, definitely-not-legal Superboy is hanging out with and being encouraged to FLIRT with skeevy older people and general creeps who are taking full advantage of this naive teenager with Superman's face every chance they get. Superboy doesn't know better, and he trusts Rex; the guy can be a little sleazy sometimes but he's still watching out for him, so . . . this is normal, right? And Rex says they REALLY need this investment/this opportunity/this money, so . . .

So like, Superboy gets abused and doesn't have the frame of reference to understand it. He really doesn't like that part of this gig, but Rex says it's important and, well, if it's just this once . . . if he already did it last time . . . if it'll only be a night or two, or maybe a long weekend . . .

It's not technically prostitution, but also Rex absolutely DOES just fucking sell the Kid a few times and repeatedly justifies it to himself with crap like "he's a teenager, he's a horndog and a flirt anyway, and obviously he likes the attention" and other fucking awful bullshit like that, because he is more concerned with the money than, idk, anyone’s mental health?? Though he doesn’t mention it to anybody who’s not a client, obviously, Roxy’d kick up a fuss and Moon might get territorial and talk the Kid out of it, and Dubbilex, hell, he doesn’t even understand how show business WORKS!!

But of course word DOES get around about it, just a little, and then it starts happening more and more often, and Superboy likes it less and less and starts to halfway HATE it, honestly, but Rex keeps saying it's IMPORTANT and NEEDS done and just . . .

He gets–used to it, kind of. Almost.

It’s just how it is.

And then like, hand-wavey convoluted I’m-still-undecided-what-exactly shit happens and Superboy somehow ends up in alpha!Lex's official custody, probably through Lex bribing a lot of people and committing some fraud and shameless lies, and Superboy assumes . . . alright, well, he guesses now he's like a fucking kept boy or something, huh. He doesn't like that idea at ALL, but at least Luthor's only one guy. And he seems like the jealous type, so he probably won't wanna share too much. Right?

So that could be worse, Superboy guesses.

Lex, an oblivious supervillain who is actually NOT aware of what kind of way worse advantage Rex was taking: this is great. I’m going to get a good grade in clonefather, something that is both normal to want and possible to achieve, and then we’re going to conquer the world. >:3

Superboy, simultaneously: . . . seriously, I’ve been here like a WEEK already, is he gonna fuck me or NOT??

And thus ensues a not-actually-funny comedy of errors where a traumatized kid keeps expecting to get abused and even Lex FUCKING Luthor is not that much of a prick and therefore totally misses literally every sign of the Kid trying to follow the appropriate “script” with him. Hm, Superboy wants attention for some reason, fine. MERCY, get the kid a black card to entertain himself with.

. . . now the kid wants attention even MORE?

baffling.

Superboy, internally: if he keeps buying me all this stuff he must REALLY want something BAD, but where the fuck else would I go anyway, so . . .

Lex: I’m putting on a movie and reviewing my files in your general area. Congratulations on receiving my attention, now don’t interrupt me.

Superboy: . . . . . . what is even happening right now.

And then a very peculiar experience of very slowly accidentally making a pack happens to both of them, wherein Superboy did not expect a dad out of this kept boy scenario and Lex did not expect an actual PUP out of this world domination plot and they’re both increasingly bewildered by everything the other does.

#kon el #conner kent #superboy #lex luthor #meta ecetera #rape mention #dubcon mention #omegaverse

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