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pessimisticpigeonsworld · 1 month

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Mad Queen Misogyny

All the mad queen Dany takes, from both D&D and the audience, are just plain misogyny. They are literally just repeats of common misogynistic ideas. D&D have given a few reasons for why they wrote the mad queen ending for Dany, and all of them are the same old misogynistic tropes of fantasy and mythology.

The Mad Queen:

I'm going to start this off by going into how the mad queen trope itself is rooted in misogyny. This is one of the oldest tropes in fantasy/fairytales. Whether it's Snow White's evil step mother or the Queen of Hearts, literature is riddled with mad queens.

The idea of the mad queen is informed by the desires of men to keep women out of power. Yes there are historical women who were horrible people and unstable when in power. However, those examples are not enough to justify the amount of times the trope occurs, especially since some of the examples occur after many stories have already been written (ie, Mary I and medieval fairytales). These fictional women were written as cautionary tales of what happens when a woman is placed in power.

By writing the mad queen Dany arc in GOT, D&D are perpetuating an old trope rather than "subverting" anything as they claim. The most powerful woman in the world turning out to be a war mongering and mass murdering tyrant isn't subversive in any way. The only reason it was surprising was because it came out of nowhere narratively.

ASOIAF fans who constantly try to justify this turn for Dany's book character are attempting to do the same thing D&D did. They want to employ an ancient trope to justify their dislike for her in name of being "subversive".

The Violent Woman:

A trope that stretches back all the way to the Ancient Greeks is that of the angry, homicidal woman in power. From Hera to Medea, the myths are full of women who commit atrocities simply because of anger. This trope isn't just about avenging a slight or retribution on the guilty; it's about a woman taking out her anger on innocent parties.

Daenerys has fallen into the role of the avenger many times throughout both the show and and book. She killed Mirri Maz Duur for the murder of her son and husband. She killed the Undying for attempting to trap/kill her. She kills Kraznys mo Nakloz and many other slavers for the atrocities they commit constantly on the people they enslaved.

In the show, she imprisoned Xaro Xhoan Daxos and Doreah in a vault for killing Irri and helping the warlocks steal her children. She killed the Khals who threatened to rape her. She kills the Tarleys for rebelling against the Tyrells, thus getting them killed, and refusing to bend the knee.

Every time Dany killed up until season eight, it was purely because those she killed harmed her or her allies/children. That is why none of her past kills justify her burning KL. The people of KL did nothing to her; it's not an established part of her character to harm innocents out of anger. She even outright condemns the killing of innocents in earlier seasons.

The inconsistencies show how D&D chose to blatantly ignore the complexities of Dany's character in favor of a sexist trope. They perpetuated the idea that a woman in power who is angered will ultimately commit injustice and atrocities.

Dany antis in the ASOIAF fandom are no different from D&D. A common argument used by Dany and Targaryen antis is that they are bound to be corrupt and tyrannical because they have dragons. Essentially saying that Dany was doomed to be the villain the moment she hatched her children.

They point to her dragons' existence and her conquest in Essos as reasons for her "villain arc", despite the fact that none of her actions reflect the things they claim. Dany is simply being condemned for being a woman with power; it's expected of her to be a tyrant for those reasons alone.

The Woman Scorned:

This reasoning given by D&D in a behind the episode interview is probably the excuse that I hate the most. They said that one of the reasons for Dany's descent into madness was because Jon Snow refused to kiss her back once he found out they were aunt and nephew. This is an insanely misogynistic trope.

Used time and again by writers (mostly male), this trope is about a woman who becomes an antagonist due to rejection, unrequited love, or betrayal from a lover. In the case of Dany and GOT, it's Jon refusing to continue their romantic relationship.

For some reason, this is seen as a breaking point for Dany. A woman who has endured poverty, homelessness, sexual slavery, a traumatic miscarriage and death of a spouse/protector, and the stresses of war was broken by a man refusing to kiss her. Doesn't that sound fucking stupid? Well that's because it is.

Dany has never felt entitled to people's love (with the exception of shitty writing from D&D) let alone someone's sexual/romantic reciprocation. It's out of character and flat out insulting to women to believe that is enough to make Dany into a mass murdering tyrant.

Once again, there are members of the fandom who espouse this reasoning into their own theories and metas. Jonsas especially are guilty of this; some claiming that Jon's rejection of Dany in favor of Sansa will be a catalyst for the "mad queen".

An offshoot of this thinking, is the idea that Dany went/will go mad because she was rejected by the realm.

In the show, the Northmen are dismissive or outright hostile to Dany when she arrives (even after she saves them). Due to this rejection by the Westerosi people, Dany decides "let it be fear" and chooses to burn KL to the ground.

Once again, this idea isn't grounded in her past actions at all. Dany has always known she needs to earn people's love and respect as a ruler, why should she change her mind the moment she steps onto Westerosi soil? The answer is simple: she's a woman, so she can't possibly be able to deal with rejection.

Fans theorize constantly that Dany is going to go mad and destroy KL and Westeros because the people will definitely reject her in favor of Young Griff/Jon Snow/any other king they can think of. This theory is simply clinging to misogynistic ideas about women and it's disgusting in every iteration (it also dismisses the fact that there are people in Westeros excited about the idea of Dany and her dragons in the books but that's a different post).

The Woman Bereft:

This argument is probably the least outright in its misogyny. The idea that a woman who has lost everything will lose her mind isn't a new one and it can be played in a non-sexist way. However, GOT played it completely in the sexist roots of the trope.

Throughout seasons seven and eight, Dany loses basically everything. All but one of her children, her closest advisor and best friend Missandei, Ser Jorah, a massive chunk of her army, her other advisors, most of her allies, and is rejected by Westeros and Jon. That's a lot of loss to endure.

However, Dany has endured severe loss before and never reacted by murdering a city full of innocents. Again, this decision and descent isn't backed up by anything else in her storyline.

The sexism of this idea, that loss produces mad women, is that it's rarely applied to men in the same situations. For example: Tyrion lost everything he cared about, yet he's never written by D&D to be in danger of becoming a mass murderer. He even outright says he wishes he'd poisoned the whole court, but is never portrayed as a mad man by D&D or fans.

Dany is expected to go insane after enduring loss because she's a woman. She's perceived as being fundamentally weaker, mentally as well as physically, so she must be more vulnerable to madness than the male characters.

The Foreign Seductress:

The idea of the foreign seductress is a xenophobic and racist stereotype. For Dany, her antis use the instances of her exercising sexual autonomy and her life in Essos as fodder for this disparaging trope.

In the books and the show, Dany pursues sexual and romantic relationships outside of marriage. This is something that doesn't fall in line with the medieval setting of the world. In Westeros and Essos, it's common for men to do that, but not women, due to systematic misogyny. Because of this, Dany's antis often feel free to argue that because she doesn't act "pure", she is wrong and evil. Dany's bound to become a villain because she isn't a chaste and "good" woman.

In the same way, Dany is painted as wrong for wanting to take her family's throne purely because she wasn't raised in Westeros. She's perceived as a foreign invader by both her antis and D&D.

D&D wrote many scenes of outright xenophobia from the Northmen, Sansa, and Arya towards Dany and her forces without ever condemning those ideas. In fact, they justify them by writing the mad queen ending. The fact that Dany isn't "one of them" is used as an excuse for her descent.

Dany antis also employ this rhetoric, especially when people compare Dany's conquest for the IT to the Starks' desire to retake Winterfell. It's good for the Starks to want to retake their throne because they were raised in Winterfell, but Dany has no right to her ancestral home because she wasn't raised in Westeros.

However, this idea is never applied to Young Griff, who was also not raised in Westeros. Despite this, people will talk about how excited they are for his story and how sad it is that he's totally going to be murdered by his evil aunt. Once again a double standard is applied to Dany.

All this is because Dany is a woman who refuses to conform to patriarchal standards and was raised in a foreign country.

Never Good Enough:

Dany antis and D&D thrive on applying a different set of standards to Dany than other characters. They do this an a way that's reminiscent of the double standards set for women even today.

No matter what Dany does, it's never good enough for them. She dealt with Viserys and his death in the wrong way. She didn't protect her people in the right way. She tried to abolish slavery in the wrong way. She saved the goddamn world wrong. Like nothing Dany does is right in their eyes.

In their minds, Dany should've died in AGOT being a perfectly passive woman. She refused to submit to those (men) around her, and for that they punish her.

She's wrong for fighting the slavers, she's wrong for trying to avenge murdered children, she's evil for killing to protect herself. D&D used each of her actions throughout the show that they seemed too aggressive as justification for what they wrote. Dany's antis do the exact same thing in their theories.

The mad queen Dany theory is rooted completely in misogyny. It has no true justification in the narrative and every argument conjured up is just as sexist as the trope they want to perpetuate.

#daenerys targaryen #asoiaf #anti got #anti jonsa #anti sansa stans #anti dany antis #anti targaryen antis #asoiaf fandom #fandom misogyny #fandom critical #anti d&d #asoiaf meta

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linkspooky · 4 months

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You need to make another one of those "metas written by comparing characters with another show you liked" post about Getou now that you experienced FGO Morgan/Aesc.

Time to compare two characters from two different shows I liked (in this case Jujutsu Kaisen and Fate Grand Order: Cosmos of the Lostbelt 6 Faerie Britian) to illustrate what makes a good corruption / fallen hero arc. Two of the best examples I can think of in recent memory are Geto Suguru, and Morgan le Fay of Faerie Britian. They both have tragic arcs which follow similar beats which I think will illustrate exactly why audiences find these characters so compelling.

Both of these characters have their stories told out of order, appearing as villains first before their backstory is revealed but for the sake of simplicity I'm going in chronological order, the heroes they started as all the way to the villains they ended up being.

Before beginning though, a brief lesson on tragedy. Aristotle's poetics argued tragedy runs on the principal of catharsis. The audience feels for the characters on stage, no matter how terrible their acts may be. He argued in favor of moral ambiguity in its heroes. The tragic hero must neither be a villan or virtuous man, but a "character between these two extremes, ... a man who is not eminently goo and just, yet whose misfortune is brought about not by vice of depravity, but by some error or frailty [Aristotle's Poetics.]

The protagonists of tragedies are still heroes, but their good qualities are twisted against them. A tumblr post I see going around from time to time makes the argument that if Othello (the protagonist of Othello) were in Hamlet the story would not be a tragedy because Otello would just stab his uncle and avenge his father. If Hamlet (the protagonist of Hamlet) were in Othello, the story would not be a tragedy because Hamlet who is a characteristic overthinker would probably not fall victim to Iago's manipulations and jump to conclusions the way Othello did. Both of these characters are heroic, Hamlet is a clever and scheming prince, Othello is a talented general a moor who's managed to rise up the ranks in a racist society. However, they are both put into stories where those heroic values are twisted against them by the narrative framework itself. So to make the protagonists of tragedies into villains who were evil all along, ruins the moral ambiguity and therefore the catharsis of a tragedy.

Geto Suguru and Morgan Le Fay are heroes, placed in a narrative framework that twists their own heroic traits against them in ways they can't endure. They fall because of frailty, not because they were inherently evil to begin with. They are antagonists who have the qualities of protagonists, and once were arguably protagonists of the story, which is probably why they have so many fans in the audience despite the fact that they are both of them mass murderers and tyrants.

Now with the long preamble let's look at the stories.

Both characters start as essentially protagonists, and they foil the protagonists they are fighting against during their villain phase. Geto Suguru is a heavy foil for Yuji (we'll talk about this later) and Morgan so heavily foils Castoria because they are both the chosen one.

I'm going to start with Morgan because Fate/Nasuverse lore is a pain to explain. To simplify her story, Morgan Le Fay is from an alternate universe version of Britian. In that Britian everything is ruled by faeries. These are trickster faeries who are total jerks and extremely murderous at times. They were supposed to forge excalibur, but they just didn't do it because they were lazy. This was very bad, so the universe sent a big huge guy to tell them to forge the sword. They were lazy though so instead of listening to him they murdered him in his sleep and he died a horrible death.

The faeries could no longer be forgiven for failing to craft excalibur which is a really important sword that needed to exist, so god or heaven or fate or whoever decided to punish them and sent Aesc who will later be known as Morgan le Fay.

There's some time travel shenanigans but I'm going to skip it because it's confusing. Basically Aesc's job is to wipe out all fairy life and bring an end to their alternate universe, but she decides to defy her destiny instead. The heavens or whoever keep conjuring calamities to wipe out the fairites to punish them for their sins, but instead Aesc fights against them and saves the fairies.

I had a duty to paradise, but I knew that duty would result in Britiain's destruction. This other me, though... She loved Britiain dearly, even the lostbelt version of it. I thought about it, and I realized I wanted the same thing she did. From then on I chose to live as her. (Witch! Witch! Witch! You were the only one to survive the calamity) Countless times, I stopped the calamities. Countless times, I mended clan disputes to end wars. I did not mind. It was not the fairies I loved. I only loved britain itself and the home I would make here. It would be my very own Britian - something that was forever beyond my reach in Proper Human History. I did everything I could to make it a reality. Eventually though, I realized the best way to do that was to keep the faeries safe.

However, because Aesc is not one of them the fairies are generally ungrateful for her saving them again and again. Aesc gathers comrades around her to help ward off these calamities and save people, but she's often attacked by the same fairies she's just saved.

She continues fighting the system of her world again and again, until she's betrayed for the last time in her attempt to save Britan. The final straw is when after years of hard work she's finally brokered a piece and made a king who rules over all the allied fairy tribes, only for his coronation to be ruined, the king to be assassinated along with the entire round table. The king was also her lover, Uther.

Aaah! Aaaah! Why? Why? Why? This was supposed to be the greatest day in fairy history... Everything was supposed to change for the better! BUt they killed Uther! They slaughtered my entire round table like they were trash! They asked the world of us! They thought the world of Uther! BUt now, they've poisoned him...THey were too afraid to even face him cowards. Uther talk to me, please say something! I never let failure stop me! I've kept trying all these thousands of years! Am I doomed to failure here, too! Is it still not enough? Am I not enough? Is it not... Can I not save Britain? Is there no Britain that can be mine! Peace, equality, I never should have tried for either! How dare they! I can never forgive them ever!

You see much like Geto Suguru which I'll later illustrate, Aesc is caught in a cycle where she must continually fight disasters for the faeries to save them only to be met with their continued disdain. Her own higher minded intentions to save the people are what damns her to this painful cycle. If she'd been less heroic, if she didn't care she wouldn't have suffered. She's sacrificing herself over and over again, but sacrificing yourself is in a way just suffering. No one actually wants to walk the thorny path of the martyr, you'll get your feet hurt from all the thorns.

The people who are now accustomed to being saved despite doing none of the work themselves, are by and by completely ungrateful for Aesc's sacrifice. Aesc is a hero, but she's not in a hero's story so she doesn't get any of the benefits of a hero really. She's working with higher minded and more idealistic goals in a deeply cynical world and punished for it. I remind you, she was just there to kill all the faeries and end the world but she tried to save them instead.

It's important to emphasize their good intentions, because a shallower character reading would suggest that they just came out of the womb wanting to murder people. However, they're driven to it because they tried to be good, because they tried to be a hero. They are like Hamlet, and like Othello in the wrong story. They're also sacrificing themselves going against the system of their world and trying to be better than it, only to get dragged down. Their resentment grows against the people they are trying to save, the selfish and weak people who don't seem all that grateful for their heroism. The ones who aren't making sacrifices, the ones who are just content being saved.

I finally understood. My enemy wasn't just the calamities, it was the faeries of Britain as well. They were pure and innocent in the truest sense, they enjoyed both good and evil things alike without losing either that purity or innocence. They are at their core, no different from the loathsome humans who drove me from britain. So I crushed every possible source of malice. Vested interests. Discrimmination. Oppression. Envy. Mockery. All of it. But it wasn't enough. A few fairies took a look at the foundation of peace so many had worked so hard to build ... and tore it apart, because they didn't like it, because they could.

This is what finally leads to Morgan's breaking point, to decide that actually... fairies don't deserve rights. Morgan decides that the fairies are unworthy of salvation and rather than being the hero the only way to accomplish her goals is to become the oppressor and tyrant.

I give up, if everything has failed if it has all come to nothing, then I can never believe in people's so called goodness or understand it. Even if I did, what would be the point? Everything I did, everything I worked for... was just a waste of time. After all the times they betrayed me I should ahve known better... but I still clung foolishly to a sliver of hope. ANd now, because I wasted my time caring about something so utterly absurd, I've failed yet again. If my intent was to keep britain alive, then I was a fool to think being its savior was the way to accomplish it. No more. I will find another way. A better way. ...That's it. I won't deliver the fairies to absolution; I won't deliver salvation. Enough of this faerie of paradise, enough of being Avalon le Fae, I should have ruled this land from the start.

However, as I said it's only Morgan's repeated attempts to be the hero and save the fairies that drove her to this conclusion. However, I'd be amiss to say that Morgan didn't have flaws or selfish qualities from the start. Morgan le Fay is created from the Morgan le Fay we created with from proper legend. I'm not going to explain the lore, but basically she's an alternate universe version, who received memories from the Morgan le Fay of our universe. She knows the story of Morgan le Fay who tried to steal King Arthur's kingdom out from under him.

Alternate Universe Morgan le Fay still had the same chip on her shoulder, and entitlement that our Morgan did. She wanted the kingdom, and wanted Britain for herself. Her desire to play savior might have come from that very same entitlement that she deserves britain. Similiarly, she was most likely hurt so badly from the lack of praise because she also deserves praise for her actions. She has a bit of a superiority complex that places her above the fairies and makes her believe she has the right to rule.

However, as I said Morgan didn't start out as a tyrant she did earnestly try to save the faeries despite harboring those more negative qualities and selfish intentions. She may have had a more self-serving variety of selflessness but it's more the fragility of her that causes her fall. She didn't fall because she was rotten to begin with, she was just not strong enough to withstand years and years of ungratefulness from the faeries and betrayal. She has all the makings of a proper hero, she decides to defy destiny to save the people of faerie britain when she was supposed to be their destroyer. However, because she's in a tragedy she falls due to her insecurities and flaws overwhelming her rather than rising to the occasion.

Her manga chapter and the FGO Lostbelt game prose itself uses the light in the distance as a metaphor for this. Morgan continues going forward on the faint light of hope that things will work out for her and that even as a tyrant she can save Britain. However, it's that same light that damns her. In tragedies heroic qualities become flipped into flaws. Morgan's most heroic quality is her determination, the willpower to endeavor for thousands of years to try to save Faerie Britain, but that determination makes her unchanging, causes her to make the same mistakes over and over again, and just makes her continually suffer like Sisyphus pushing his boulder up the hill.

But that light is just an insect trap - or at least that's how it is for the protagonist of the tragedy. Road to hell, and all that.

After reaching her breaking point Morgan decides she'll no longer try to save the fairies but rather only care about saving the kingdom itself. She goes from the kingdom's hero to its oppressive tyrant after seizing the throne for herself.

That's where we meet the villain we know today.

Now shifting gears to Geto Suguru, he is someone who starts out his story trying to be a hero. A little bit of context on the world of Jujutsu Kaisen, it takes place in an urban fantasy version of Japan where the jungian collective unconscious and the negative emotions of humanity create curses that kill and eat people. These curses need to be exorcised by a few special humans who are given superpowers known as jujutsu sorcerers.

There is an institution of sorcerers known as Jujutsu High, which raises sorcerers from a young age gifted with these powers to exorcise sorcerers. THese teenagers are often sent out on msisions. This is different from most stories of teenage heroes with superpower, because fighting curses is brutal and dangerous and most of these kids are going to die young. There's also no end in sight to the fight against curses, because no matter how many curses are exorcised humans will just keep making more.

Not only do they live in a cynical, and brutal world but most sorcerers are insanely selfish. Just to give an example of how immoral sorcerers are, one of the allies of the main characters is implied to molest her brother, and if she's not she still uses her like 12 year old brother as a child soldier. Nobody ever bothers to question this because the institution of sorcerers are inherently corrupt, it's an instituion that continually sends children off to their deaths and uses people as nothing more than cogs.

Caught within this unfair system and trapped in a cycle of exorcising curses that are just going to come back anyway is Geto Suguru, who is not only a model sorcerer he's presented as much more selfless than your average sorcerer. He's directly contrasted against Gojo Satoru who is kind of just a petty kid with a god complex.

Gojo uses his powers selfishly, he only fights because he's really powerful and killing curses is a way to test and use his abilities. (This is literally stated as canon by Nanami don't fight me on this I'm simplifying his motivations because this is not a Gojo meta look at the entire fight with Sukuna saving Megumi was a secondary concern he wanted to fight a strong opponent). Whether people are saved by his actions are a secondary concern.

Geto on the other hand goes against the grain for most of Jujutsu Society, and believes that they as stronger people have a duty to use their strength to protect the weak. This idea of noblesse oblige is way way different from the attitudes of most sorcerers, who as I said usually turn into petty little people with god complexes.

Not to say Geto doesn't have a god complex, but we'll get to that later. Geto is explicitly contrasted against Gojo who's the only other powerful sorcerer and his best friend, but doesn't think they have an obligation to use their powers to help anyone.

Right away we have two things in common with Morgan le Fay, number one they hold themselves to a higher minded ideal that of using their powers to act as a hero and protect the people underneath them. Number two, this is a choice they make to be better than the people around them. Morgan's destiny is to destroy the faeries and she tries to save them. Sorcerers usually just keep their heads down and do their jobs, they're not heroes, they don't save people they kill curses. In fact, the sorcerers who are selfish assholes (Mei Mei) are wildly succesful, the ones who try to help other people like Nanami die young.

They sacrifice themselves for others. Geto pursuing his higher minded ideal is faced with the same kind of tragedy that Morgan is, where his attempts to save a teenage girl named Riko not only blatantly fail, they fail because of Toji a person who cannot use cursed energy. Everyone they tried to protect died, and they're shown first hand not only does the world not really care about their idealism, but they're not really powerful enough to change this world in any way.

Morgan's lover Uther and all of her allies is ruthlessly slaughtered, by the same faeries she was trying to save after she brokered peace. Geto tries to save a little girl, and he not only watches her die, but he sees an entire crowd of normal people, the people he is fighting to save applause for her death. They all applaud her death because they're a part of a cult that believes that the girl was an affront to their god, but she was mostly just a normal teenager. He witnesses first hand that normal people do not care for the fate of Jujutsu Sorcerers whatsoever.

If Geto were more selfish he would be rewarded. If he didn't attempt to save people, if he just only cared about exorcising curses like Gojo did he'd probably become more powerful and he wouldn't succumb to despair the way he had. Geto exists in a narrative where selfishness is rewarded, and his selfless, heroic traits are continually punished.

This traumatic event makes him aware similarly to the brutal cycle he is caught up in. Morgan le Fay can't save the faeries, because faeries are jerks who can't change. Geto will just continually exorcise curses over and over again. Not only is humanity just going to keep producing more curses, but humans are vastly indifferent to the sacrifices that sorcerers (who are mostly children) keep making to try and save them.

Geto's choice to protect people is the cause of his suffering, because sacrifice is inherently taking on suffering for the sake of someone else - therefore sacrifice is suffering.

This too, leads to Geto's eventual breaking point where he lets his resentment for the same people he's trying to save corrupt him. An incident where just after seeing his dear friend die because of a curse, he's brought to a village of people. The whole village put two little girls in a cage, who were capable of seeing curses and blamed them as the scapegoat for a curse reflecting his village. Geto sees a flash of what happened to Riko again, a crowd full of normal people who don't have to fight curses applauding for the sacrifice of a little girl who was innocent. It's the macrocosm, all of society forcing a few sorcerers to die exorcising curses for them, shown on the microcosm, one village scapegoating two little girls who did nothing wrong.

That's what leads Geto to snap and massacre the whole village. He's now turned against the masses he wants to protect. He then decides that instead of protecting the masses, he's going to kill them and build a world of only sorcerers. He's no longer trying to save them, like Morgan le Fay he's turned to the hero and the Tyrant.

They both even utter similiar words.

I will never save the faeries! I will never forgive the faeries! I don't like monkeys. That's the truth I chose.

Monkeys is by the way, the word Geto uses to refer to normal people who cannot fight curses or even see them. People who don't have superpowers.

One more time I want to emphasize Geto did not come out of the womb wanting genocide. Hamlet didn't start out the play stabbing people. He does have his flaws, just like Morgan by assuming the role of the hero he sees himself in a separate, superior category to the people he wants to protect. There's a line I like in a youtube analysis for for Yuji that applies to Geto as well.

(Other people exist to be saved, which gives Yuji a role in the world) In a way Yuji thinks other people exist to validate his own existence.

Geto begins the story not seeing other people as people. They exist in a category separate from himself. Part of the reason that his failures hit him so hard, is because they disprove this idea of superiority he has for himself. He's shown his god complex is just a complex and he's as flawed and capable of failure as any mortal.

It's an inability to recognize that failure, learn from it, and reconcile it with themselves that causes both Morgan le Fay and Geto to spiral. They are the hero, they are trying to be just, they should reap the just rewards for being a hero. Geto even says as such in a moment of rare jealousy for Gojo, that Gojo is someone who also has godlike power and if Geto had that same power he could change the world the way he wants. He could create his more just world.

Morgan and Geto are characters who begin their narratives with superior complexes and senses of entitlement, selfishly selfess heroes and those negative qualities eventually lead them to fail. Geto thought being a sorcerer made him superior, he just also thought that with that superiority came a responsibility to protect others. Morgan le Fay thought she was the rightful king of Britain, she also thought that divine right to be king also came with an obligation to protect Britain. However, they're not meant to be seen as people who all along wanted to oppress and hurt others.

The key word with tragedy is catharsis, we are supposed to feel for the protagonists of tragedies. We're supposed to see our own traits reflected in them. It's their human qualities to drive them to tragedy.

After all, you reader on tumblr would probably not be able to be a perfectly selfless hero. If you saved someone and then they immediately tried to kill you, you would probably just be a little bitter about it. If you were like Geto and you were working tirelessly to exorcise curses, and all you got was your friends dying, I don't think you'd be like "This is okay :D". If anything, going mad in their extreme circumstances seems like a reasonable response, because could we as the audience do any better in their situations?

Of course the last similarity between Geto and Morgan (besides the fact they both adopt daughters they raise up to be little psychos but this post is getting too long already) is the fact that they both heavily foil the heroes of the story they occupy. They see themselves as villain, they play the role of villain, but they're really just heroes of another story.

Paradise or god or fate or whatever in Faerie britain eventually conjures up another chosen one. This chosen one Altria or as the fandom calls her Castoria is far less heroic. IN fact unlike Morgan who embraces the role of savior she would rather do anything she could to avoid Britain.

This is because for similiar reasons as Morgan, the faeries have basically abused her and tormented her all her life. Yet they still expect her to selflessly step up as their chosen one and save the day from the evil oppressive tyrant Morgan.

You have one protagonist who embraces their heroic quest, and even goes above and beyond by ignoring her destiny to wipe out the faeries and saving them instead. You have another who continually runs away from the heroic quest, and honestly doesn't seem to care that much about saving faeries.

Morgan is actually openly sympathetic to Castoria, and even offers to ally with her a couple of times because she bears the same burden as chosen one. This is another example of how Morgan doesn't quite fit the role of either hero or villain, the ambiguity who makes tragedy.

However, while Morgan does everything to defy fate, Castoria just kind of keeps marching along every step of Joseph Campbell's the heroes journey until she ends up defeating Morgan. Well she doesn't truly defeat her, but Morgan meets her tragic end and gets stabbed a whole bunch of times.

There's a similiar foiling between Geto, and the series protagonist Yuji who both start out the story believing that as sorcerers they have a duty to save others. There are several in story comparisons and direct parallels between the two.

Yuji attempts to save others with his power as a sorcerer over and over again, and is met with the same continual failure that Geto has. Yuji is the only real sorcerer in his generation that cares about saving strangers with his powers. Nobara wants money to live in Tokyo, Megumi only cares about protecting Yuji and his sister, Yuta only cares about his friends, Maki only wants revenge against her clan. Like Maki blatantly says whether people get saved or not by her actions is none of her business.

His own attempts to save people not only fail badly, but he watches people die. He watches a lot of people die in a situation where he is powerless to stop them.

He's met with the same tragedy of Geto but he doesn't succumb to it. The same for Castoria she doesn't decide to be a Tyrant the way that Morgan le Fay did. I would argue this isn't because of any inherent goodness that Castoria or Yuji have but rather because both of them are able to let go of their egoes. Yuji kind of believes the same thing Geto does, that other people exist to be saved by him. He's broken when he realizes that he's not a savior after all...but he's able to continue in a way that Geto isn't.

Yuji lets go of his ego entirely and believes that he's just a cog in the machine and he doesn't need to be some big hero or be rewarded at the end of his hero's journey.

Geto and Morgan le Fay both long for a role in the grand scheme of things. They are still employing narrative thinking, they need to play a story role to validate their existences. It's just that they flipped their role, they tried being the heroes but it didn't work so they're the villains now.

Geto is similiarly rebuffed by Yuta who is his eventual killer by saying that he doesn't actually care about saving the world or if Geto is right that sorcerers are superior to humans, he's only fighting for his friends.

I would say for both castoria and yuji it's not a matter of being inherently good people, but rather of being better at enduring than their counterparts are. Morgan le Fay and Geto try to take the world's suffering on their shoulders, and it breaks them because they're not heroes they're just normal people. Yuji, Castoria and to the same extent Yuta kind of learn to let go of their great heroic aspirations but because of that they're able to take on suffering better. They're trying to live in reality not a grand heroic fantasy.

To bring the example back to FGO, for Castoria and for Morgan the light of hope that led them down their heroic journeys mean two different things. For Morgan that light is an insect trap. Her flying towards that light just causes her to keep suffering through her sisyphian task. Castoria has a much more realistic point of view, she's not trying to get a happy ending or even save people, that light is the hope that at the end of her journey her actions will have meant something. It's more about the journey itself and the people she met along the way, then some big grand reward at the end.

Morgan le Fay and Geto both fail because they are fragile, because they are human. That's the most important takeaway of this long rambling post. They may be selfish, they may be entitled but they're flawed in human ways. After all, who doesn't want a happy ending?

#jjk meta #fgo meta #morgan le fay #fgo morgan #camelot #fgo lostbelt #geto suguru #suguru geto #idk what else to tag this #for the three people who are going to read this post #i hope you like this comun #the things i do for love

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beanghostprincess · 5 months

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i would care if you talked about luffy's issues please talk please tell me all your takes, genuinely (< anon who enjoys your takes)

I am so thankful you asked me this because Luffy is genuinely one of my favorite characters of all time, especially when it comes to shonen protagonists. I'm always saying I don't like shonens (says the one that watches a lot of shonens) but that's mainly because the main characters never feel... Well-written enough for me to like them. But, well, One Piece is different. With all characters, really. It's one of the first shonens I watch that I genuinely love and enjoy because of the characters (shout out to Mob Psycho 100 being one of my favorite animes of all time too because of that same reason).

Luffy is a very complex character and I think that's why he gets mischaracterized most of the time when it comes to the fandom. Some people make him too dumb. Others make him too childish. Others make him way darker and more depressed than he truly is. And I'd say that's weird, having in mind how much the show talks about Luffy and is focused on Luffy's POV, but I kind of understand because people aren't used to characters that are both optimistic and realistic at the same time. Most of the time people consider an optimistic character to be completely idealistic (a good example here is Uta. She is idealistic because she's been sheltered for so long and thinks something as complex as the corruption in the world can be solved with a few songs and love) and refuse to acknowledge the fact that somebody with hopes and dreams can also understand (first-hand, even) the suffering within the world. People like extremes. They like to make both Law and Zoro extremely edgy. They like to babify Sanji and Koby. They forget about Nami's character depth to make her only "the mean lesbian" of the group (that term makes me so fucking furious you don't even know). Etc. Etc. Etc. The thing is: Luffy has layers. His personality varies. He's optimistic. He's realistic. He's stupid. He's emotionally intelligent. He's impulsive. He cares about the safety of the people around him. He's careless. He feels guilt. He's confident. He's so damn insecure. He's playful. He's the most serious character too. Etc. Etc. Etc.

What I want to say with all of this is that Luffy, despite being always perceived as this childish, dumb, and careless character within the fandom, has so much depth and trauma he deals with every fucking day. I once saw somebody saying Luffy is "not smart enough to understand the feeling of sadness" and I started laughing because what the fuck does that even mean. And... Is that person watching the same thing as me? Because the guy has suffered the injustice of the world so many times and so many losses that I can't even count them.

Basically: People portray Luffy as if he hadn't gone through any type of trauma when OP has shown countless times that he has been through a lot. A fucking lot. Perhaps it's the fact that he's the one hiding it all the time in the show, always replacing sadness with the need to be stronger so he doesn't feel like that ever again (aka protecting everyone so he doesn't lose anybody again. And not even in a selfish way to not be alone, although we could say that he does feel like that to some extent. But because his loved ones do not deserve to disappear or die in those ways and he feels guilty whenever it happens because every time, he says it's because he wasn't strong enough to protect them) and that's why most people don't realize how much pain he has gone through. But that's not a very valid argument because we have a lot of arcs that prove it otherwise (Sabaody, Marineford, Film Red, Wano...). So, yeah, I guess people just don't know how to read.

Starting through chronological order, I want to talk about his abandonment issues and savior complex that always seem to go hand in hand.

Luffy doesn't like to be alone. He's a very empathetic and extroverted person. He doesn't like to be bored, always loving the company of somebody else. But, sadly, he has always been kind of alone? People come and go for him all the time, and you can't tell me that doesn't affect him psychologically. He's 7 when he meets Uta and Shanks and the kid has never been more excited! That's when his dream of being a pirate begins and it's the first time he has a friend. A real friend, not just random animals he manages to find or older people that sometimes take care of him. Luffy gets bored easily, so of course, Shanks and Uta, being something new, make his life brighter. With dreams and new experiences and hope for a newer, better life outside his village. And then Uta and Shanks have to go, of course, and he stays all alone again. From what we've seen, the only thing Luffy did when they weren't around was just... Waiting for them to come back to him. That's it. Luffy's joy basically comes from being with people, and especially when he's fixated on somebody in particular, he doesn't let them go. Then they come back... But Uta is not with them anymore. That's Luffy's first heartbreak, in my opinion. It's when he decides that he has to be stronger. He loved Uta so damn much. She meant the world to him. And suddenly she isn't there, giving him no time to say goodbye, and... He only has Shanks. But Shanks refuses to tell him the truth about what happened with her. So here you go! It's the first time Luffy loses somebody this dear to him and the first time Shanks betrays him enough for him to get angry at his hero. He ends up accepting it, of course, but not because he has moved on, but because both Uta and Shanks told him to be stronger. More mature. And he forces himself to grow up faster because he wants something. He wants to know where his friend is, and if Shanks refuses to tell him because he's just a kid, then he'll just have to grow up and become stronger. To become a pirate and to keep the promise he made with Uta. The movies aren't canon so I just keep thinking about Luffy wondering where Uta is, and it breaks my heart every time.

Then Ace and Sabo appear in his life and... They are literally everything to him. I like Garp. He did what he could do. Kind of. But he leaves Luffy on his own with Ace under the care of some bandits (Dadan we love you, queen). So he can't really blame Luffy for the way he turned out to be, honestly. The thing is: Ace and Sabo are, again, something new to Luffy. They are not just friends. They are his brothers, now. We don't talk enough about Luffy's maturity and respect for other people's dreams even when he's just a kid. Luffy literally was kidnapped and beaten up and he didn't dare to say a word about Ace and Sabo's treasure because he respected their dream. He's loyal and understands other people's feelings and hopes perfectly. His empathy and emotional intelligence are just perfect. Then, well, you all know the story, but these two become the most important thing in Luffy's life, not only because they are his brothers, but because they are the representation of their dreams and future. And then it crashes into a million fucking pieces because of Celestial Dragons and classism and rich people quite literally saying "We are burning down the poor because they don't deserve to live! Woohoo!". And it's Luffy's first time realizing that the world is unfair and fucked up and that there are people that believe to be superior to others, a thing that Luffy fights against all the time.

So, Luffy learns that the world is extremely fucked up at a very young age. He has first-hand contact with the abuse rich people inflict on others, in every way. He suffers from the torture that is fighting for your life in the world of pirating and thieves when he's not even a pirate yet. He's just a kid. What the fuck. And then he loses Sabo. His older brother literally is killed by a celestial dragon and he can't do anything about it. He can only cry, of course, he's just a kid. What is he going to do? So he decides to become stronger. Because he feels weak in the hands of what is the injustice of the world. He feels trapped by that injustice, in my opinion, and wanting to be stronger is just the path to freedom. Because freedom means being able to save the people he cares about.

And here's the thing: Luffy's need to become stronger always comes from the guilt he feels after losing somebody, blaming himself even though he literally could have done nothing at the time to save Uta or Sabo. He has a severe savior complex, not to feel better about himself (although you could say that it would certainly fix his fear of being weak) but to not lose anybody else. For some reason he always feels responsible for the faith of the people he loves, he's constantly putting others first and sacrificing himself and then feeling guilty and weak when he can't save them when it wasn't even in his hands to save them in the first place.

Kid Luffy goes through a ton of stuff in his early years and the fear of being alone... Of losing somebody he cares about... It haunts him. He sees Shanks and piracy as the meaning of freedom and strength. It's just that simple for him: If he becomes a pirate, he'll be strong. If he's strong, he'll be free. If he's free, he'll never lose anybody again.

And yet, even if he's confident he'll manage to do this... He's still a kid. He's still a little brother. Ace's little brother. He depends on Ace, too, because that's the one person he has left. Ace promises him he won't die because he's just as confident, and says this as if Luffy was stupid for thinking something could happen to him. Not to get too into Ace's character right now, but the fact that he's constantly wondering if he should be alive to then realize Luffy needs him to stay alive... Is so damn beautiful.

And then he literally dies in front of Luffy. Protecting Luffy. And Oh, boy if that doesn't kill him... But that comes after Sabaody! After losing literally all of his crew! God, stop hurting this guy already for fuck's sake-

Long story short, Luffy manages to get a family. Not a crew. A family. He's not alone anymore, and he proves constantly that he won't let any of them go or die on him the way it happened with Uta and Sabo.

Water 7 is... Rough for Luffy, to say the least. Because it's the first time he sees everything he has built crumbling down. Robin is taken by the Marines. Usopp wants to leave the crew because he doesn't feel like he fits in, even though Luffy knows he is perfect for the family (Usopp just can't believe him because, you know, insecurities suck). And he has to learn how to be a captain. A true captain. He has to make the harsh decision of fighting his best friend and letting him go (his worst fucking fear) at the age of 17 because he's the captain. He has to be mature. And strong. And he definitely doesn't feel like those now. Not when Robin is also on her way to be executed.

Usopp is leaving. Robin might die. And it's just like Uta and Sabo all over again.

So, basically, Luffy grows up too fast. He grows up too fast, with the fear of abandonment and being weak, and the weight of being the captain of a whole crew resting on his shoulders. Besides, he fights against the world government for Robin because he refuses to let her die thinking she doesn't deserve/want to live, and it reminds me a lot of Ace's story. Ace doesn't think he deserves to live but then stays because he realizes that Luffy loves him and needs him. Robin, thanks to Luffy, realizes that she wants to live and that she has a new family to fight for.

Nobody dies and Usopp comes back this time, so everything ends up turning out fine after all! Yay!

Then Sabaody happens and I swear my guy can't have a fucking break.

Who has suffered more, Jesus Christ or Monkey D. Luffy from Sabaody to Marineford? I think we already know the answer.

He loses all of his crew. All at once. His worst fucking fear. They vanish right in front of his eyes and he can't do anything. He feels weak. He's shattered. Completely broken. But he's optimistic, still, because he believes in his crew and he knows they'll find a way to be together again! They've ben through a lot together, and they can find each other in a few days in Sabaody again. It's fine. But he has to delay it, of course, because his other biggest fucking fear is happening right now: Ace might die. His older brother might die.

So if you mix the trauma that caused him to have abandonment issues and a savior complex with the fact that Ace is the only sibling he has left and he is completely alone because his crew isn't by his side anymore... You get the most heartbreaking arc of the show! Awesome.

He does everything he can to save Ace. Ace complains about it, begging him to stay away from danger. And he refuses because he's his brother. He has to fight for him. And he does. And Ace dies anyway. Ace dies protecting him, too, and the hope that was left within him dies completely at that moment. Everything is shattered. His whole world is crumbling down. And I think that Luffy dies too at that moment.

For Luffy, losing Ace is not like losing a limb. Losing Ace is losing his everything. Ace meant the world to him. He was the representation of their dreams and hopes and past and future. He was the only person who knew Sabo like the back of his hand, too. And now Luffy is the only one carrying their souls. All alone.

That's probably Luffy's rock bottom. He doesn't think he deserves to be a pirate (or alive, either, but I don't want to get too deep into his suicidal thoughts I definitely think are a real thing because then this becomes too dark. But yeah. I think he does think about that too). He doesn't think he's strong enough. And he's completely broken.

There's this line from Fleabag that I absolutely adore: "I don't know what to do with it." / "With what?" / "With all the love I have for her. I don't know where to put it now."

Because Ace is gone. He's completely gone. And all the love Luffy has for him turns into grief and he doesn't know what to do anymore if Ace's soul isn't in the world to look after him. He doesn't know what to do if all the love and feelings he has for his brother go to waste. And it's his fault. Because he wasn't strong enough to protect him. Because he wasn't able to protect himself, Ace having to sacrifice himself for him. (And we know he feels guilty about this because he tells Sabo the second they meet again. He apologizes for not protecting Ace. He feels guilty about what happened still. And Sabo is just glad Luffy is okay because he knows his brothers too well to know already what happened).

Then our beloved Jinbe comes along (I love you. Please adopt me) and, following that quote of Fleabag: "I'll take it. No, I'm serious. It sounds lovely. I'll have it. You have to give it to me." / "Okay." / "It's got to go somewhere."

Jinbe reminds Luffy that he still has his crew. That he still has people who need him alive. People that love him and care for him. That he can't be weak if he has helped so many people already. That they're willing to take both the love and pain Ace makes him feel. And it's such a great character development for Luffy... It makes me go insane. He remembers his crew one by one and realizes that he's not alone anymore. That he has to be stronger for them and for Ace. And for Uta. And Sabo. Jinbe is there with him when the others couldn't, and it has nothing to do with Luffy's issues but I just want to mention how much I love Jinbe for this.

But he still feels the need to be stronger and the fear of losing his crew and the people he loves still haunts him. He tells the straw hats to meet after 2 years (that's a long fucking time. Like. Longer than the time they've spent together. Imagine the loyalty, damn). And it's... It's so beautifully written. The 3D2Y scene is one of my favorites because it shows the loyalty and love they have for each other, and how Luffy is willing to become stronger for the people he loves and the ones he has lost along the way. I literally have the tattoo. I am obsessed with the whole concept.

As I said, Luffy's abandonment issues and the fact that he wants to become stronger to never lose anybody again (Savior complex much?) still remain even after his character development. Because that's not something you get rid of. That's just how he is. And I think that, as long as he is with the straw hats, it won't be a problem.

Also I wanted to mention his reunion with Sabo! The guilt he feels for losing Ace? The way he clings onto his older brother as if they were going to take Sabo away from him? They're extremely codependent and I am here for it, honestly. Sabo would die for Luffy and Luffy would kill him if he did that. Also, I don't know where the fuck Sabo is now because I'm only watching Wano but I swear to God if something happens to him I will murder somebody with my bare hands. :)

Oh! And then it comes my favorite arc of all the show: Whole Cake Island (to the surprise of literally no one!). Luffy, in the beginning, is extremely optimistic when it comes to rescuing Sanji. He's simple like that. "If he doesn't want to get married, we rescue him. If he wants to get married, he just brings his wife with us!". And if Sanji didn't want to come back to them (truly not wanting to) he would accept it. But Sanji wants to. Luffy knows Sanji wants to go back to the Sunny with them. He knows Sanji isn't being true to himself. And God, he's desperate. Because Sanji is stubborn and his self-sacrificing and deprecating thoughts are even stronger than Luffy's, and he won't give up until Luffy lets him go. But Luffy doesn't want to fight him, he just wants his cook back. Because he knows that, no matter how much harm he does to him, Sanji is only doing it to himself (one of my favorite quotes from OP). So, Luffy goes again through the desperation of not losing a crewmate, but losing one of his wings. Without Sanji, Luffy can't become the king of the pirates. He's willing to die from starvation for him. Are you- Are you all aware that he almost fucking dies from starvation? I don't think we talk about that enough because what the actual fuck. There's this thing they tell Luffy (I don't remember exactly when or the exact phrasing) about him wanting Sanji back out of selfishness and not because of Sanji's well-being and... I partially agree? Don't get me wrong, Luffy does everything here for Sanji because he knows Sanji is suffering and lying to himself. But Luffy is selfish, too. Luffy doesn't want Sanji to go away because he loves him. That's his cook. He doesn't want to lose anybody else, even less knowing that they're going to be unhappy. That's kind of for me the confirmation of Luffy's abandonment issues. Like- He does everything for his crew, of course, but he's so scared of losing them. Then Sanji comes back to them, of course, and they have their own Pride and Prejudice moment. Not even Jane Austen can write shit like this.

I kind of want to talk about Wano but I haven't finished it yet (I'm like, on episode 1056) but I would like to mention how beautiful it is for Luffy to carry Ace's soul and promises like that. And also the responsibility he carries during the whole arc to save Wano? That's so- It's so fucked up. He's such a good leader and captain and everything I said in this post and all the things he does in Wano show that he will become the king of the pirates. I love him so damn much. I can't even write it down properly.

Anyway, summarizing everything: Luffy has a lot of abandonment issues and a savior complex that becomes unhealthy to the point of sacrificing himself and always carrying the burdens of everyone else. Because he fears he might lose his loved ones if he isn't strong enough. So. You know. It would be great if people stopped saying he's just childish and fun and that he doesn't have any character depth because he's probably the most complex shonen protagonist I've ever seen! He has suffered so damn much it hurts! Live Laugh Love Luffy! <3

#......... i love him a lot #he makes me go insane #please i swear i am okay mentally he just makes me ill #i truly thought this was gonna be longer ngl #one piece #monkey d. luffy

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moon-andstardust · 7 months

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So I've come across a lot of posts that basically say that the only reason people didn't like Steve's ending was because they didn't want him to be happy/they didn't allow him to be selfish. And the last one riled me up enough to post this.

Disclaimer: I'm not trying to attack anyone's opinion, I'm stating my interpretation of Steve's ending and the reasons why I, personally, didn't like it

My reasons for hating disliking Steve's ending, in no particular order:

1. He wouldn’t fit in

Steve has been out of ice for at least ten years, give or take a few. He has had time to adjust and somewhat get used to his new reality. He has also changed as a person(even if his core character traits remained the same). To say that Steve went through a lot would be an understatement: Chitauri invasion, Ultron, Sokovia accords, the whole Thanos shitshow. Anyone who could've understood these things he left behind.

His loneliness isn't necessarily a new thing either, Steve didn't have all that many friends besides Bucky even in the 19s.

By the time endgame rolls around, I think his trouble with fitting in has less to do with what year he was born in and more with other people's reluctance to see beyond his captain america mask.

He'd be just as out of place in the Past as he was in the Future.

2. Peggy has already lived her life.

It's been made obvious that she lived quite a happy life without Steve even if she mourned his death. Peggy had a husband. She had children. All of her life choices were completely disregarded by Steve when he shoehorned his way back into Peggy's life.

Also, she has been dead for about seven years now. And Steve, whose entire character arc before this movie was about changing and adapting, never giving up despite the trauma he experienced, never came to terms with it? He hadn't even known her all that well before going under the ice.

3. Steve can't back down from a fight if his the only one who can help

It's been established many many times that Steve hardly ever backs down from a fight, he's always trying to help people: "If I see a situation going south I can't ignore it." This guy. This guy proceeded to ignore: His best friend being tortured, experimented on and brainwashed by nazi scientists for seventy years; His other best friend being tortured, experimented on and turned into a child assassin by kgb; A secret nazi organization keen on murdering twenty million people slowly corrupting an organization his girlfriend/wife is trying to build.

I can see Steve retiring because he trusted his friends to do the right thing and protect people when he couldn't, but I can't see Steve turning a blind eye on the aforementioned when he was the only one even aware of them

On top of it all, Bucky's family was still around when Steve came back. Did he look Bucky's grieving family straight in the eyes as he told them that their son, their brother, was dead and never coming back? Did he toast in honor of Bucky with the Howling Commandos all the while knowing where he really was? I'm sorry, but I really can't reconcile this version of Steve with the one depicted in the earlier films.

In conclusion, my dislike for Steve's ending wasn't because I didn't want him to be selfish or happy, it was because his decision was extremely out of character and badly written.

#steve rogers #captain america #captain america the first avenger #captain america the winter soldier #captain america civil war #infinity war #avengers endgame #the avengers #anti endgame #meta #captain america meta #mcu #marvel #marvel cinematic universe #mcu meta

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mxtxfanatic · 1 year

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Another pro-reader tip for mxtx novels: they are all stories with clear-cut good guys and bad guys and a strong moral message, BUT you have to actually read what the story has to say about characters without taking anything at face value, relying on genre tropes, or using identities and statuses as shorthand to your understanding of the moral system and themes of the story. So no, most characters in her stories are not morally gray (though some are, most can be definitively categorized as either morally good or bad, and ALL of her main characters are definitively morally good), and no she does not write morally gray plots where “morality is just subjective!” If anything, the term I think people are looking for is “morally neutral” (meaning that the thing is not assigned a morality in and of itself) in many cases.

An mxtx character is never designated as good or bad based off their backgrounds or class: Wei Wuxian, Jin Guangyao, Shen Jiu, and Mu Qing all grow up outside of the elite class, but Mu Qing (eventually) and Wei Wuxian are unquestionably good guys while Jin Guangyao and Shen Jiu are unquestionable villains. Shen Yuan, Lan Wangji, and Xie Lian all grow up within the gentry class but are all good guys while Jiang Cheng, Jun Wu, and The Old Palace Master are bad. Likewise, life circumstances or tools don’t determine morality. In mdzs, the sword path (which is the orthodox one) is used to commit genocide by the general cultivation world just as easily as Lan Wangji wields it to protect the forsaken commoners. Wei Wuxian’s ghost path was created to protect himself before being used to protect others, but Xue Yang and the Jin Clan pervert it to cause mass destruction for their own wishes. In tgcf, Xie Lian uses his god powers to attempt to help the Yong’an people while the other gods simply collect worshippers to increase their power and oppress lesser gods. Every character I’ve listed minus the Old Palace Master has experienced intense trauma that has informed their lives and colors their morality, but it does not define why they have chosen to take on certain moral stances.

(This is not to say that mxtx doesn’t have certain tropes she dislikes, as she clearly hates the “dedicate their whole existence completely to another person” trope. Su She, a villain dedicated to Jin Guangyao, dies. Zhuzhi-lang, a sympathetic antagonist dedicated to Tianlang-jun, dies. Hua Cheng, A WHOLE LOVE INTEREST dedicated to the literal main character, dies a whopping three (3) times before he learns his lesson.)

Mxtx does not condemn those who stray from orthodoxy. In fact, every story she’s (currently) written is about the dangers of entrenched and unquestioned hierarchy and status quo giving way to corruption every time. She wants you to question the dominant narrative of the benevolent group who descend from on high to “save the ignorant masses.” She wants you to question the idea that the only people with the right of choice are those at the top of the hierarchy. She wants you to question the idea that even the smallest decision of “powerless” people does not matter in “the grand scheme of things.” She wants you to actually think about the story conventions that you accept as infallible and question whether or not it would make for good shorthand by which to understand well-written characters and story arcs (and also, hopefully, how society is structured at large). So if you find yourself reading an mxtx novel and siding with the mob characters or lamenting how x character was locked into making certain choices “against their will” or being unable to reconcile how a recognized trope led to an unexpected conclusion because “that’s not how it’s supposed to go,” then it may do you some good to stop and ask yourself “was this idea supported by the narrative that I read in the book, or is this an idea I’ve come to entirely from my own preconceived notions of how I wanted the story to turn out based on how other, similar stories have panned out?”

#human metas mxtx #mdzs #svsss #tgcf #and this isn’t to say that you can’t question mxtx’s choices #again her work BEGS you to do just that #but you can’t have an adequate critique of something you refuse to even see for what it is #if you are expecting a normative genre piece from mxtx #you will leave disappointed with the ways in which she specifically breaks those norms #you will walk away without understanding how or why she chose to do so #and you’ll misunderstand her intentions and her works by foregoing this understanding

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snowswan-royalehigh · 4 months

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My personal thoughts on Remarried Empress

Hi there! I'm not going into an too much of an in-depth analysis, so please take my words with a grain of salt. I'm going to focus on Rashta's past.

Rashta is a very well written character, she's shown to be naive and innocent, with underlying layers of cruelty and a character development towards greed which is wonderfully executed. However, the fandom refuses to allow her to have nuance to her character.

When the webtoon and novel start off, we already know Rashta is somewhat portrayed as a villainess, and during my first readthrough, I also wanted to sucker punch her in the face. (I would be publicly executed by Sovieshit) But when I reread I realized how much nuance I missed, and some nuance the fandom ignores entirely.

We start off knowing Rashta is a runaway slave. Which already starts us off on a generally sympathetic note, because we can tell she's had some form of a bad life prior to becoming Sovieshit's concubine. We know she has an annoying habit of speaking in third person, she's a crybaby, she's incredibly controlled by her emotions, she lacks critical thinking skills, and she doesn't even know how to read or write.

Rashta is incredibly easily manipulated, she shows that with her interactions with Sovieshit and especially Duke Ergi. Duke Ergi influences almost all of Rashta's moves, such as the Christmas tree wedding dress, which was a huge embarrassment. In defense of Rashta's lack of knowledge, she was a slave. How was she supposed to know about how these things, when she had spent her life, being forced to clean, with no hope of escaping. She hadn't even done anything to become a slave in the first place, she was made one so her father wouldn't have to pay for his crime. She was uneducated as can be. Reading and writing at that time was only for the highborn.

Rashta is confirmed to have had a lot of love for the idea of her children, and she carried that baby to full term. Imagine how mortifying it was when Lotteshu showed her that corpse. (How the hell did he even get his hands on the corpse. We should be focusing on that a lot more) So could we really blame her for running away, Alan abandoned her as well, and Lebetti always treated her like trash.

Rashta undergoes a corruption arc because of the people around her. Navier remarks in her head that Rashta has no one good around her to inform her, in the webtoon.

Now, imagine this situation from the point of view of Rashta. You just saw your supposed dead child with an obvious great amount of trauma via your whole childhood, and now, the emperor, an incredibly powerful man, has proposed to become your lover. He's going to give you protection, and most likely save you from your horrible life. Everyone forgets the power dynamic of these two. Rashta is the lowest in society while Sovieshit is the highest. What terrible consequences would Sovieshit's pretty ass conjure from rejection? Even the webtoon remarks that it's like a fairy tale.

Navier and the rest of the nobles are her enemies, because of how she was raised. She actually started off the webtoon looking up to Navier, and seeing Navier as someone she could basically worship, and believed that Navier would act as a motherly figure although she was greeted with Navier's justifiable pettiness although Rashta didn't know what she was doing wrong.

If Rashta was the protagonist everyone would be gushing about her, because she is manipulative, but so is Navier. The people around Rashta fail her, when she could've been so much more, and she has so much underutilized potential. Rashta would've been incredibly hyped up for kicking Navier out, and Navier would be seen as cold hearted and self centered.

TL;DR, Rashta is still an antagonist, but she is not a straight up villain. She's complex, and she's more human than any other antagonist. She's only hated on for being the 'other woman' and the fandom acts like she seduced Sovieshit for the funsies.

(Fuck Sovieshit, all my homies hate him!!!))

#the remarried empress #Rashta #Sovieshitslander #Characternuance #Nuance #mischaracterization #character arcs #sovieshu #Sovieshu slander

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see-arcane · 2 years

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Jonathan Harker: The ‘Absolute Love Corrupts Absolutely’ Villain That Almost Was*

*LONG before Francis Ford Coppola’s Cinematic Gary Oldman Fanfiction

Spoilers ahead for the Dracula Daily enjoyers, because I’m whipping out all my literary receipts on this.

I recently finished speed-rereading Dracula because I have no self-control. In doing so, I got a refresher on quite a few incendiary factors of the book that time had dulled in my memory.

1. There’s a TON of ‘I’m not like other girls!’ and ‘men good, women dainty,’ and ‘What no I’m not projecting, honest, I just really like the words manful, voluptuous, manful, aquiline, manful, God, and manful again. –Bramothy Stoker,’ so brace for that from basically the whole cast. I’m blaming it partly on Bram Flakes’ own prejudices, of which there are plenty, and the fact that he’d clearly never met a thesaurus in his life.

(I appreciate everyone’s mental revamp of Mina as the New Woman to Lucy’s Classic Damsel, but…oof. Everyone’s in for a harsh Period/Stoker Accurate reminder.)

2. Brammy Pajamas was either hanging around some exceptionally devout Christians to write some of the second/third act scenes with everyone basically thrashing and wailing and falling on their knees and clasping/kissing hands as they pray to/thank God, all while thinking it was perfectly natural behavior for these characters…or he legit had no clue how any kind of ordinary human being, Christian or otherwise, would react to the situations he puts them in.

(Seriously, it’s not even that everyone’s devout, it’s that they’re all written to act like they’re in a soap opera where the only direction they got was to be as hammy and histrionic as physically possible. You’ll know the scenes when you see them.)

3. Jonathan Harker has not only been done dirty by every adaptation since the book in terms of being a main character, along with being the character to spend the most time with Dracula in close quarters, period, and being the love interest for Mina—his whole character arc by the second half of the book is the most blazing hot, “If my beloved is destined for damnation, I’m heading to Hell with her, fuck all else,” shit I have ever read in classic literature, full stop.

Not Dracula. Not any character based on Dracula.

Jonathan fucking Harker is the OG archetype for Love Corrupts (Violently), and the canon story avoided him going full tragic villain by t h i s much. You want proof? Let’s go.

NOTE: MAIN SPOILERS STRAIGHT FROM THE BOOK, SHIELD YOUR EYES

Here’s the part most Harker fans scream over, myself included:

“To one thing I have made up my mind: if we find out that Mina must be a vampire in the end, then she shall not go into that unknown and terrible land alone. I suppose it is thus that in old times one vampire meant many; just as their hideous bodies could only rest in sacred earth, so the holiest love was the recruiting sergeant for their ghastly ranks.”

Good shit, good shit! Jonathan was already prepared to risk falling to his death from a cliff or being eaten by wolves rather than stay in Castle Dracula for a bloodthirsty eternity with the ladies. But now? Mina is quite literally his, “You are worth Hell,” Beloved. But there’s more. Fast forward to one of Team Fuck-Up-That-Old-Undead-Man’s first head-on encounters with the Count. As they’re waiting, Jonathan gets impatient, declaring:

“I care for nothing now,” he answered hotly, “except to wipe out this brute from the face of creation. I would sell my own soul to do it!”

He says as much in front of his Christian+ buddies who, by now, had pretty fair reasons to believe in the legitimacy of Hell and all its demons. Van Helsing is definitely startled and seemingly talks him down from such an oath. Key word being seemingly. Because we jump forward again to a point where Mina, in full saintly forgiveness mode (and apparently selectively forgetting Van Helsing’s history lesson about Dracula’s pre-vampire days being ones of a slaughtering tyrant), saying that if/when they destroy the Count, oh, how happy his soul will be to be free of his torment on Earth, et cetera. Jonathan Harker has a rebuttal to share. Namely:

“May God give him into my hand just for long enough to destroy that earthly life of him which we are aiming at. If beyond that I could send his soul forever and ever to burning hell I would do it!”

God forgives. Jonathan Harker emphatically does not.

Onward again, and he speaks volumes by what he does not say. Chiefly, there’s a point where Mina, now in full martyr preparation should the worst happen, makes the boys swear an oath to destroy her body if/when she succumbs and dies to Dracula’s vampiric poisoning so she cannot rise again as one of his ladies. The boys swear. Mostly. What we get from Jonathan is…

“And must I, too, make such a promise, oh, my wife?”

“You too, my dearest.” (Note: The rest of her paragraph here is full of the most knife-twisting, utterly warped martyr ‘pep talk’ I’ve ever read, and I have no idea how she/Bramarama thought it would remotely convince Jonathan this was all a reasonable and chill thing she was talking about. Anyway.)

It’s important to note that absolutely nowhere in the ensuing text does Jonathan ever speak the promise out loud. He does read the goddamn Burial Service at Mina’s request, which he barely chokes his way through. But he never makes the oath.

Another jump ahead. They are on the hunt for Dracula and, alas, have just missed him at a key point. Most of the gang are shaking their fists at the sky, cursing up and down. And what is Jonathan doing? Well, to quote Jack Seward, just before the epiphany…

“We men were all in a fever of excitement, except Harker, who is calm; his hands are as cold as ice, and an hour ago I found him whetting the edge of the great Ghoorka knife which he now always carries with him. It will be a bad look-out for the Count if the edge of that ‘Kukri’ ever touches his throat, driven by that stern, ice-cold hand!”

And upon discovery of the Count slipping them…

“Harker smiled—actually smiled—the dark bitter smile of one who is without hope; but at the same time his action belied his words, for his hands instinctively sought the hilt of the great Kukri knife and rested there.”

For context, by this point Jonathan had already come at Dracula with said Kukri knife a while back, having nearly landed the blow after charging out of the pack and nearly fucking gutting the Count. For extra context, this is a Kukri knife:

He’s just been walking around with that. For half the book. Plotting.

And, with all of this in mind, we can only assume Jonathan had two plans of action in mind.

Plan A, follow Van Helsing’s lead.

…Not counting the moment he almost bit the Professor’s head off for saying he had to bring Mina along with him to Castle Dracula. Another good scene which includes his very succinct reaction to Van Helsing’s suggestion, even if he does have to agree in the end:

“Not for the world! Not for Heaven or Hell!”

Anyway. If the plan works out, cool. He gets to kill Dracula, Mina is saved. Best case scenario!

But then there’s the unspoken, explicitly unwritten (in case his pages need to be read), but heavily foreshadowed Plan B. They cannot destroy the Count, in time or otherwise. Mina is now either a corpse waiting to awake as a vampire, or a vampire already. The others, true to their vow, mean to destroy her.

Jonathan Harker, true only to Mina, in whatever form she may take, still has that Kukri. And the element of surprise. And a full acknowledgment of the realities of Heaven, Hell, and his holding Mina’s continued existence above them, his friends, his sanity, his humanity, and himself.

In short, all your tragically romantic Draculas can kindly go fuck themselves with a wooden stake. Jonathan Harker is the first and best gothic horror example of a person in love to the point of madness, damnation, and willingness to deceive or destroy anyone who would endanger the one he loves. The only reason we never got to see it in action was because Stoker had to tack on a happy ending. If he hadn’t?

The census would be less four unsuspecting heroes and plus two newlywed vampires.

The End.

Suck on it, Francis.

#Jonathan Harker is a good boy a lovely young man and he Can and Will Kill for His Wife :) :) :)#seriously there's a whole other essay to go with how gloriously fucked up-passionate this stance is within both the time it was written #and the novel itself which is SATURATED with God Christ and more God #for this fucker to have gone through what he did in the castle on top of all the very clear proofs of divine VS infernal goings-on #this dude is flipping the bird to all of it #the whole mess (be it of God or the Devil or fucking Dracula)#none of it ranks higher than Mina in his mind #my guy is fucked up and I love him #jonathan harker #dracula #mina murray #mina harker #dracula daily #spoilers

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aboutzatanna · 7 months

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Hey, remember that JLU episode titled ‘The Once And Future Thing: Weird Western Tales’ where a couple of JL members ended up stranded in the old West thanks to time travel?

Well, turns out there was a comic book very similar to it written by Gerry Conway with art by Don Heck but starring a different set of JL members which may or may not have been the inspiration for the episode:

The episode was written by the late Dwayne McDuffie who was no stranger to writing in references to older comics. For instance, the two parter ‘Brave and the Bold’ Flash’s hallucinations were references to various Silver Age Flash comic covers and he was also very open about the fact that the line up for the Terra Beyond two parter was based on Marvel comics Defenders (no not the Netflix team, the one with Namor and Dr Strange). Even the episode title itself, ‘Weird Western Tales’ is a reference to the long running anthology series of the same name featuring DC’s western characters.

The story arc in the comics ran from Justice League of America Vol 1 #198-199.

While it’s hard to conclusively say that the episode was inspired by the comic, there are some interesting similarities like Batlash’s introduction here:

I posted Zatanna’s meeting with Cinnamon earlier in another post but here is a little excerpt:

Interesting to note that one of the goons calls her an ‘Eastern Filly’ (is it because of the way she was dressed or a subtle hint that she is not 100% Caucasian?). The heroes and their new Western cowboy friends all meet at a Saloon:

Then they all ride off on horses out of town to confront the villain and of course, faces robot cowboys:

The differences begin with the choice of the time travelling villain, the comic went with classic JL villain: the Lord of Time:

JLU went with David Clinton, aka Chronos. He’s a different villain who is primarily the enemy of the Atom/Ray Palmer but has also fought the JL on occasion.

The Lord of Time on the other hand, is a conqueror from the future who travelled back in time with future technology to conquer the past and rule the future. Sound familiar? He was Kang before Kang. Since JLU’s version of Chronos comes from the future, you could make a case that version is a combination Chronos and Lord of Time.

Then of course, there is the line up, the comic features Zatanna, Elongated Man, Barry Allen and Hal Jordan whereas the show features Wonder Woman, Batman and Green Lantern. Superman also appears trying to thwart the Lord of Time in the present day.

On the Western heroes side, we got Diablo instead of Cinnamon and Scalphunter is replaced by Pow Wow Smith (and it only takes a cursory glance at the characters wikipedia pages to see why the socially conscious Dwayne McDuffie made that choice).

The plot of the JLU episode involved a corrupt sheriff using future technology to take over the town but the plot of the comic is a little different. The Lord of Time sent the heroes back in time, erased their memories, because an anti matter meteor was set to strike earth on that day. The LoT is counting on the heroes to stop the meteor so he can have it for himself so he can use it to conquer the world. (Why he doesn’t just get the meteor himself? Maybe he didn’t have the technology to?)

Anyway, the heroes learn about the anti matter meteor heading towards them, Zatanna is reluctant to leave her new found cowgirl girlfriend with her friends to fight the robots:

But she ends up going anyway:

Can I just say, I really like this shot of Zee and Green Lantern flying together? Even though she is depowered during this period, they never really stuck strictly to the ‘she can only manipulate the elements’ ethos. Having her flying alongside GL and being unabashed powerhouse is really cool and shows her place among the DCU. There is no ‘she has to be taken out so someone else can shine’ bs here. Also, reading these comics, I have felt that GL makes the most sense as the field leader of the JL; power based on creativity and will power and they are specifically trained to work together and take on strange extra terrestrial or otherwise threats. I think any of the human GL’s (except maybe Guy) can lead the team.

Zatanna and GL manage to stop the meteor. But in present timeline the Lord of Time ends up defeated by Superman (early on he got in a kryptonite trap set by the LoT but managed to escape) just as the time trapped Leaguers make their way back.

Awww, a krytonite waterfall wasn’t that bad, Clark.

Overall, the issue was alright. It does feel like placeholder (albeit a fun one) before the big #200 celebration issue (I posted some scans from that here). Come to think of it, the episode came off as filler as well, with the Western parts feeling like a fun romp and ultimately inconsequential to the arcs of the main heroes but the follow up portion set in the Batman Beyond timeline was more impactful and memorable.

#zatanna #zatanna zatara #flash #barry allen #green lantern #hal jordan #superman #clark kent #elongated man #ralph dibny #john stewart #justice league of america #jlu #justice league unlimited #dwayne mcduffie #gerry conway #dcau

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halogenwarrior · 1 year

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I feel like the large amount of capital-r Rationalist Worm fans has really negatively influenced some people’s interpretations of Taylor and her motivations. I sometimes see people treating her as this sort of platonic idea of utilitarianism or whatever moral philosophy you think she subscribes to, whose strengths and flaws are entirely the strengths and flaws of that philosophy in its ideal form. And having read the “rational fic writing advice of Eliezer “famous Harry Potter fic writer and comparer of Taylor to Hillary Clinton” Yudkowsky I can see where this idea comes from, because this is exactly how he says characters should ideally be written. He says he dislikes “gray and gray morality” where everyone is shown to have their flaws and hypocrisy, instead he likes conflicts where both sides are truly good rather than gray and the conflict is that they are completely true to different philosophies of what good is. To some extent, he has a point in this; there are works that use the existence of hypocrisy and self-serving as a “cheat” out of and easy answer to a conflict that really is supposed to be a clash between two pure “good” philosophical ideas (Pokemon Black and White my beloathed...). But in the end, characters who are just platonic ideas of philosophies are for philosophical essays and tracts; literature is for portraying humans in all of their psychological complexity, sometimes self-serving motives, and ways that, due to their individual humanity, they aren’t just walking philosophical mouthpieces and don’t match up completely with an ideology.

That being said, Taylor is actually quite human (and a human teenager at that, with all the expected immaturity) in this way and from author comments it seems that this is completely intentional. She doesn’t simply state her belief that Benevolent Warlordism is Better than the Corrupt Current Authority throughout the story and spend the whole time as the embodiment of that ideal. Instead, she starts out wanting to be a hero, and then she has a complete failure of her typically paranoid mindset with regards to Coil (taking him at face value of wanting to improve the city even though every politician says that and look how that usually turns out) because it’s what she WANTS to believe, so she can keep her new friends after feeling isolated while morally sanctioning her actions, and then does a surprise Pikachu face when it turns out Coil actually does bad things and her support is helping him do bad things, then spends the next few arcs running around trying to fix the one bad thing she feels particularly guilty of. It’s only after already setting herself up as a warlord to fix said guilt, solely caring about Dinah with the people she saves being incidental, that she justifies herself as the lesser of two evils compared to the corrupt status quo, a lot of the corruption of which she didn’t even KNOW ABOUT before already going ahead and deciding she was going to be a criminal. I’m saying this with genuine love for her character and acknowledgement that she isn’t a horrible monster and does some pretty admirable stuff, especially given her age and situation, and she certainly was always cynical, paranoid and judgmental with a determination for justice even if she didn’t know all the details of what was wrong with her world at the beginning, but it’s ridiculous and detracts from understanding of her character as a character and not a rationalist talking point to see her as some pure philosophical ideal from start to finish who is never making up her ideology as she goes along.

#worm #parahumans #wildbow #Taylor hebert #rationalism

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witheredoffherwitch · 5 months

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So TG enjoyer here, I'd just like to share some opinions about the dreaded Daeron cut. First, your anon is probably right about Helaena being the only other dragonrider for TG. There is really no way Aemond can't do it all by himself being the sole dragonrider. Helaena would be the only one left to fill that void while Aegon is out of commission. The Reach plot would need one, which I think Aemond would be taking, especially once Hugh and Ulf betray TB. He can't be holding both the Riverlands and the Reach by himself, which is where Helaena comes in. I think many of you have this fixed idea of Helaena being a pure, incorruptible victim but I think she fits parts of Daeron's arc well. She can start off just like Daeron who was kind then got corrupted along the way. Helaena has a bigger stake than Daeron which could be used as her motivation. This is why I disagree with you wanting Helaena to be just a "plot device". They didn't give her the dreamer ability for nothing, not with all the other dreamers that are going to be adapted in the future. Idk how they'll do it but it could be visions of the prophecy and rumored past Targaryens through her.

I'm also going to be honest here: Aemond was NOT doing anything important in the Riverlands. He just burns smallfolk, makes stupid decisions that costs TG greatly, then he gets killed by Martin's favorite Daemon. He wasn't fighting any army while there and neither was he getting Riverland lords to pledge for TG. This was all Criston Cole's work during Rook's Rest and he dies shortly after he steps in the Riverlands because of Aemond's indecision. His whole arc in the book was written to look pathetic compared to Daemon, so I really wonder why some people are looking forward to his arc where he was rendered useless compared to say Daeron or Aegon. There wasn't much about Alys either except for her association with Aemond and she didn't make any significant impact to the plot during the Dance. So this is like people in glass houses throwing stones when you talk about Helaena being just a plot device.

I also don't think the TG Riverlands plot would do well long-term in a tv adaptation because of how skippable it would be. Most of the Riverlands plot is about TB. For TG, there isn't much happening there until the Battle Above God's Eye. It wasn't just because Aemond makes stupid decisions, but other plots happening to other characters just completely eclipses his arc while he does nothing of import. His mass murdering is also going to be a tired act so this is why I can see him getting parts of Daeron's arc too. So if he's going to be the biggest threat in the show, then he has to be moving around. This can equalize him and Daemon in the show and give him something significant to do.

In conclusion, to all TG enjoyers here, I think what many of you fear with Daeron being cut is not as bad as you think. Imo the show is already giving more to TG than we think and Ryan Condal seems to favor TG a bit more.

Daeron will be featured in the show!

He's introduced in the opening sequence and his dragon is mentioned by Daemon in Episode 10 (Edit: the dragon part is disputed but he will included either way). Rest assured, he will make an appearance either in season 2 or 3!

No need to twist someone's arc out of shape to make it fit with our own wacky idea. Instead - let's just wait and see what happens!

#anon asks #hotd discourse #broke my own hiatus to answer it lol #helaena taragryen #aemond targaryen #aegon ii targaryen #daeron targaryen #alicent hightower #team green #hotd season 2 #hotd speculations #hotd leaks

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misrepresentedmorallygrey · 4 months

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PROPAGANDA

Rose Quartz Propaganda

"We saw her character arc in reverse!! We first saw all the good she did and then learned of her terrible actions in the past. If her story was told the other way around, it would have been a great redemption arc. Yes, she did some terrible things, but she had no choice. She did everything she could to stop the colonization of earth peacefully buy nothing worked. Blue and yellow diamond just didn't listen to her and when they did, THEY were the ones who made the zoo and shit. Rose wanted to free them but couldn't get to them after the war! And with the corruption, there's no way she could have known that'd happen. There's so many things she wanted to do but just couldn't. And with spinel, yes it was shitty to leave her alone for so long, but again, between running her court, running the rebellion, dealing with earth, she likely wasn't a very high priority and like with the zoo, there was no way to get to her after the war since the galaxy warp was destroyed. And don't forget, she was practically a child around this time. You're saying you didn't do any stupid, selfish, or harmful things as a kid? She learned from her experiences and grew, we just saw that growth in reverse, leaving us as viewers with a poor perception of her."

"Rose Quartz is Steven Universe’s dead mom. Initially, she’s set up as sort of an ethereal perfect figure who everyone misses and compares him to. Later we get to see more of her backstory and discover that she’s actually like, a person, with flaws, who has done some bad things, but she did those bad things largely in the course of trying to escape an abusive home life and save the people and planet that she fell in love with. It’s very clear that despite her flaws she was trying to do the right thing and that she deeply cared about others. Unfortunately, a woman who was not a Perfect Martyr was way too much for the Steven Universe fandom to handle. She pretty much set off the wave of SU crit blogs because these people were furious either that she had taken violent measures to solve her problems, that she hadn’t taken violent enough measures to solve her problems, or both somehow. Lots of “Why didn’t she just murder her abusive parental figures?” Lots of “She was evil for having a baby even though she knew she’d die in childbirth!” Lots of “She should’ve been able to protect everyone from a magic nuclear weapon with the power of love somehow.” Lots of “She shouldn’t have rebelled (even though not rebelling would’ve meant the destruction of Earth) because her abusers retaliated and that’s her fault.” LOTS of people drawing her as stick thin even though she was fat in the show. People treated her like she was on the same level or even worse than her abusive parental figures who were also the main villains of the show. It was unbearable to witness."

Katara Propaganda

"She's smart. She's powerful. She an eco-terrorist. She's got the ability to grow as a person. She's a victim of misogynistic fans who codify her as an annoying bitch (sadly not affectionate) cause she's the "mom character." And that's all she will ever be is "The mom character." She bested Azula and could blood bend your ass but won't cause she's chosen not to be a monster! But she's the annoying mom instead."

"if i have to hear ONE MORE *touches necklace* joke i’m gonna mcfreaking lose it"

"despite being one of the most well-written feminist characters of children’s TV, the fandom decides to define her based on her very realistic 14-year-old girl flaws. Ignoring her complex independent arcs and motivations, people love justifying their hatred towards her based on her one line directed at Sokka that he didn’t love his mother as much as she did. Which, if we’re being nitpicky, isn’t so harsh given that it was Katara who shouldered most of the burden of her death, as well as Sokka’s admittance that he doesn’t even remember his mother. Not to mention that ALL the characters make selfish mistakes given the fact that they’re all aged 12-15??? (Aang hiding Katara and Sokka’s father’s letter, anyone???) She really is an elegant breakthrough of the typical female character molds of “girl who is badass” and “girl with a crush on the mc who sits on the sidelines” and it’s so frustrating to see her get the most hate out of the Gaang"

Mabel Pines Propaganda

"[insert "i am 12 years old" comic]"

"You probably already know about this but back when the series was airing people were really pissed at Mabel because she was supposedly selfish. Yeah ok guys asking for a fucking megaphone to help a merman find his family was TOTALLY unreasonable. Dipper giving up one (1) "date" with a girl way older than him to save Mabel's pet was SO not worth it. (This is sarcasm btw. Side note a lot of these have to do with Dipper's crush on Wendy which is a whole other discussion.) And then there's the big one. Mabel causing Weirdmageddon. What people fail to realize with this is that 1) she was extremely stressed when she handed Bill the rift 2) she was tricked by Bill, a being that is A MASTER AT TRICKING PEOPLE, into thinking that she was being handed a magic solution to what felt like the end of the world to her, and 3) she was TWELVE. Not to pull out the "she is literally neurodivergent and a minor" card but do you really expect a 12 year old who's just been told that she's gonna have to face a big and difficult transition WITHOUT her brother who's been there for her all her life to make a rational decision? Y'all seriously fell for Bill's empty words in Sock Opera. Absolute bufoons. You would not survive Weirdmageddon."

"Oh wow, a preteen girl under extreme distress acts like a preteen girl under extreme distress. Whoda thunk?"

#finals #females fucked over tournament #steven universe #avatar the last airbender #gravity falls #rose quartz #katara #mabel pines #raise of hands whos actually surprised that this is the finals

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