#a character doesn't have to be actively in a queer relationship to be 'good queer representation' but | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

mishapen-dear · 10 months

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no but im thinking about how 4halo could be together while keeping their dynamic intact. forever asks bad on a date and bad is like yeah :D friendship date. several dates later bad's the one to propose and he says "will you merry me" as in like. be merry with me. feel joy forever for we're together and we have 11 children aka all of the eggs we have forcefully adopted from the other parents and i dont know what life would be like without you. you changed my life for the better. besties 4evar, forever

#and then richarlyson falls into pieces #and dapper gets to be smug #i don't super enjoy the ship when theyre lovey-lovey but oh my god its so fucking funny to be in a relationship and just Deny it #to each other to everyone else to themselves #is that a wedding ring no its a donut #made of metal #a decoration i wear that's inscribed with my bestie's name because i just like him so much :3 #do you see the vision the vibe is queerbait themselves to Hell while being Actively Queer #more thoughtful examination of bad's character is that i think a relationship that actively rejects sincerity is what he'd be most #comfortable in #he's Full of compliments for the other players and eggs but he will Never say that to their faces. he uses sillytime and insincerity as a #shield. if he ever trusts someone to be like. close to them. to consider them a teammate like he considers dapper a teammate #then it doesn't matter what label it gets -qpp or genuine besties or romantic or another option i cant think of- i think that not #acknowledging that sincerity is the only way he could bear letting them into his heart #i don't know forever as well to give a thoughtful analysis but i think that giving him something low pressure that isn't a Romance might be #good for him too if only for the fact that his Romances have all failed p badly. better to just be silly about it yknow just joke around a #lil if it doesn't mean anything then it wont hurt #<- basic angst trope im not sure fits him but be rest assured i am Looking at him. studying that beast.#qsmp #4halo #qsmp shipping

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themoonking · 2 years

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i understand that if you’re sapphic and also incredibly and unironically into the mcu like i was a few years ago then the hand kiss from love and thunder might seem like a big deal and might make you feel really good but. it’s nothing. it’s literally fucking nothing. it’s a few seconds with an unnamed character and then valkyrie talks about her dead, also unnamed girlfriend for a bit. there are movies and television shows and books and idk podcasts that actually feature sapphic characters and/or relationships. you cannot, should not, and do not have to rely on the fucking marvel cinematic universe for queer representation. and the mcu should not be praised for “steps in the right direction” or whatever when we have actual representation elsewhere, and they are the ones lagging behind.

#yes this is somewhat paraphrasing another post (that i already reblogged) but #idk its just that as someone who used to be an mcu stannie who wanted gay rep from it i understand where the people #who are hyped about love and thunder are coming from but also like. they're really just deluding yourselves.#and if you just love popcorn entertainment so much there's stuff that isnt 'pretentious' bc i know some tumblr folks hate art /hj #like there's but i'm a cheerleader (a cultural reset) more recently there's first kill #i promise you that there is actual tangible sapphic representation that will fit your tastes you do not have to rely on the fucking mcu #for your queer rep #and you also SHOULDNT #anyway this is why i feel a similar way about baymax cartoon trans man like. there's actual trans representation elsewhere #yes there isn't a lot but it exists and its better than this #we don't have to give disney this much credit when they want us dead #people act like this is the first time trans characters/queer characters in general have been done when it isnt #its just the first time DISNEY has done it #disney does not care about us and just wants our money i stg get that in your heads before you freak out over #the next disney's first gay character that comes around #also side note that i already said in the tags of another post but #a character doesn't have to be actively in a queer relationship to be 'good queer representation' but #that doesnt mean that valkyrie is good queer representation #especially compared to everything else that's available #like besties maybe val would be good sapphic rep fifteen years ago??? 🤨#i speak #mcu #mcu critical #thor love and thunder

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dinodogs · 2 months

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I hope yall realize what an incredible loss RWBY will be if it doesn't get picked up.

Two of the main female characters are sapphic and in a relationship. Blake is canonically bisexual and a survivor of abuse. Yang is disabled and went through an entire arc about her ptsd and dealing with her trauma. Its also worth mentioning Blake is voiced by an openly bisexual woman.

the main character of the entire shows VA (lindsay jones) is gender queer and Ruby canonically neurodivergent, as well as aroace coded (she is not canonically confirmed to be aroace but she's widely considered to be at least ace)

It has one of the best written trans characters I've ever seen, voiced and written with the assistance of a trans woman.

The show openly shows other queer romances, with at one point a pair of married women being shown on screen with their baby, and yes the two characters had a real role in the plot.

While they haven't been amazing about poc rep before they are actively taking criticism and in recent years have learned how to write good poc rep.

RWBY, at its core, was an indie animation project. It was created by a small team of people on an incredibly small budget. Its gotten bigger and bigger over the years with a larger budget, RWBY is proof that an indie series can get massive, it is a massive win for indie animation all together.

#rwby #personal #rooster teeth

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justrustandstardust · 3 months

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Why y'all pair Geto and Gojo? They're both men it doesn't make sense at all. They are just friends. Respectfully l know people have different views, but why can't men just be friends?

when people say "why can't men just be friends" they seem to think they're making some kind of outstandingly intellectual point. i'm not only going to explain why that is blatantly untrue, but also why this claim imprisons gojo and geto in the very cage you seem so desperate to free them from.

in making this claim, you've created a binary with "friends" at one end and a (presumably romantic) "pair" at the other. you understand the two locations to be diametrically opposed, at opposite poles in a fixed landscape.

queerness, as you understand it, is attached to the "romance" pole within your binary, and heterosexuality is fixed to the "friends" pole. these poles are antithetical to you— either they're friends, or they're lovers. the binary only permits one or the other.

to you, queerness is a a consumptive vacuum that subsumes everything "good" about gojo and geto's relationship. you understand gayness to be the antithesis of heterosexuality; you relegate personhood and agency to the latter whilst deriding the former, resisting what you perceive to be the deliberate action of Turning Them Gay.

this deliberate twisting of their characters then makes them not gojo and geto anymore but two men in love, voiding the intricacies and complexities of their relationship and reducing their dynamic to a one-dimensional romance because that's all you understand queerness to be. either they're regarded as friends and they remain people (retaining their personhood) or they're queered, abandoning their identities because now their only identity is gay.

in attempting to defend them from being queered, you think you're saving them from subsumption by the label. in your mind, you're preserving their nuance and complexity because you seek to protect them from being whittled down from unique individuals into gay-shaped men, who now exist relationally to each other along one axis: romance. to you, there's gojo and geto, the characters you know and love, who are then twisted from their "original form" into being queer.

in seeking to free them from your understanding of queerness, you reify the very structure that you think you're dismantling. you attempt to defend their agency and personhood but you achieve exactly the opposite: you forge their identity on your own terms, pigeonholing them into fixed categories because of your own limited understanding of what it means to be queer.

in constructing queerness oppositionally to heterosexuality, you flatten their characters and push them into a prison of your own making. relegating them to heterosexuality does to them exactly what you're afraid of will happen if they're deemed queer: they become one-dimensional, actively stripped of the agency, dignity, nuance and complexity that you so righteously seek to defend. people cannot be Turned Gay because they are not straight by default; gojo and geto's characters are not being twisted into unoriginality—they are gojo and geto, and they are queer. it is one and the same.

gojo and geto are enemies, and soulmates, and partners, and friends, and lovers, and so much more. what draws people to their connection is that it transcends the binaries of friendship and romance that you so eagerly defend. in pushing for them to be regarded as "just friends" you flatten their characters, imprisoning them in the very cage that you think you're saving them from by rejecting the label of queer.

queerness is not a reductionist subversion of heterosexuality— it constitutes dimensions and layers to identities and relationships, not all of them romantic. queerness goes beyond the static conception within your binary; it is dynamic, complex, agentic and relates to more than merely sexual orientation. in rejecting queerness, you actualize the one-dimensional characterization you so fear through stripping away the integral complexities of their characters that can only be understood through a queered lens. queerness does not reduce— it is constitutive.

gojo and geto are not merely straight or gay, according to your limited understanding. they transcend the binary in which you've imprisoned them, queered in more ways than one. queerness does not take away from the parts of their relationship that make them unique; it is what makes them unique. gojo and geto's connection remains profound, not in spite of their queerness, but because of it.

and to address your comment about how "they're both men"— men have been queer for centuries, regardless of time or place. pick up a fucking book. (or just take a good, hard look at the jjk manga).

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mysterycitrus · 4 months

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Hey there, Happy New Year! Sorry if this ask seems confusing.

I've really come to enjoy your blog as someone who is kind of new to navigating the world of comics and how to read them and you seem to be one of the people that's more vocal about all the fanon and canon differences and how that damages people's perception of characters. I'm just a bit confused in what you consider to be the difference of headcanons and fanon, I know fanon is a more of something that a big number of people believe, but if someone headcanons something that isn't covered in canon, would that be "bad" or fall on the fandom category?

Hope this doesn't sound mean or anything, I'm just a bit confused

hello!! welcome to batburger!!!!

wrt fanon vs canon my issue is this — parts of comic fandom are very vocal about not engaging with the source material. deciding what fanon is “good” vs “bad” isn’t the point because im not interested in policing peoples fandom experience. however there is a point where i don’t understand what exactly some people are fans of, because what they talk about is so disconnected from the original text.

imagine meeting a hunger games fan, and when u ask about their favourite movie or book, they instead tell u that they’ve never read or seen any part of the series, exclusively read fanfiction, and then inform u that they believe president snow is peeta’s grandfather and that actually haymitch was the authoritarian mastermind behind the hunger games. that doesn’t make any sense, and has no basis in canon. it’s a very extreme hypothetical, but i wouldn’t really take what they say about the hunger games seriously. it also reminds me a bit of the hp marauders fanworks that exist almost autonomously to the books (while still containing the same issues as said books).

most fanon enjoyers (and this is particularly pervasive with batfam fans) enjoy characters and relationships that simply do not exist. that alone isn’t a problem (crackships and headcanons have existed since ye olde star trek zine days) but the issue is that these fanon interpretations are loudly asserted as being the correct way to engage with the characters. i do not believe it should be controversial to prefer characters in their canonical text, or to ask why some fanon content is taken as gospel, especially when so much of it is racialised.

this lends into a wider trend where these headcanons are respected more than canon despite often being actively reductive, accidentally demeaning, or just plain bad faith interpretations. it’s much harder to combat the racism present in conversations about damian wayne when the people in question aren’t grant morrison or judd winick or scott snyder, but instead a nebulous group of people on twitter.

flatly, i encourage people to read the source material. there are a lot of comics, but googling ‘[literally any character] reading list’ has literally never been easier. start by consuming the movies or cartoons or films or shows or the one volume graphic novels, then pinpoint what u like and start from there. people are discouraged from reading comics — and they shouldn’t be!! especially for popular characters there are very accessible starting points!! u will find characters to love with rich history and lore!!!! support queer artists and artists of colour who are actively changing the industry!!! i guarantee that the fanon version of that male character u love is actually originally from a female character with a great miniseries written by greg rucka!!!!

#anyways…. can’t wait to get more anons about this #anti batfanon #dc comics #the ask and the answer

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asexualenjolras · 2 years

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I've just finished Heartbreak High (delayed, I know) and I was so excited about the asexual representation we were given ... just to jump on here and find that a lot of people are saying that Cash's asexuality story was handled poorly because he doesn't explicitly say he's on the asexuality spectrum, or because Darren didn't respond very well but I disagree with everything that's being said.

I think Heartbreak High handled this storyline in the most authentic way and let me explain why:

Firstly, I think it's important to remember that Cash is an eshay. He's grown up around a very bigoted group of young people, who - you can assume - hold very extreme, neagtive opinions about the LGBTQA+ community. Despite this, we see him accept his love for Darren in a very real way. He's not afraid to be seen with them in public but he does panic a little when his fellow eshays see him with them - even going so far as to say that Darren is a "customer" when asked who they are. We see at the Mardis Gras that he panics when he sees his eshay friend dealing. He isn't afraid of being out, he's afraid of their opinions of him being out. He's afraid of the eshays, not of being queer.

If you think that Cash and his eshay friends would have a deep understanding of sexuality - let alone asexuality - then you're very mistaken.

Not only that, but asexuality is massively misunderstood anyway. People on the asexuality spectrum can go years without finding a label that fits them. I was 18 when I discovered the spectrum. I spent 18 years of my life thinking I was broken.

We see that Cash has accepted this part of himself - he doesn't worry about him being broken or a disappointment, he just worries that he will lose Darren because of it. That's actually really advanced, considering he doesn't even know what asexuality is.

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Secondly, Darren is a non-binary, queer person. They have a good understanding of the community and different sexuality but one thing that they don't understand - or even know about - is asexuality. This is common in the community. Asexuality is massively unrepresented and there is a lot of false information out there about it.

From Darren's perspective, their partner didn't want to have sex with them. They've grown up feeling like they were unlovable, it's a very authentic reaction for someone to have. And it's a barrier that a lot of asexual people have to overcome in relationships because their partners just don't get that it isn't personal.

Quinni says it the best, she says that "Cash might just be wired differently", and that's what makes Darren a little more understanding - that and speaking with their dad about their trauma from their parents' divorce. They finally understand that Cash didn't have bad experiences with sex but doesn't have that attraction or urge to sleep with someone. They have a lot of unresolved trauma from their childhood, and hypersexuality can be linked to that.

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Thirdly, it is so beautiful that Heartbreak High have explored the asexuality spectrum in the way they have; usually, ace characters in shows and movies don't have a love interest while they figure out what they feel about or want out of relationships. In Heartbreak High, we see Cash understand that he is attracted to Darren romantically - he actively says he has loved them since he was in Year 8 - and not be afraid of that.

He also knows he is repulsed by sex and doesn't feel anything towards it. He knows it isn't anything to do with the other person and tries his best to communicate that to Darren. And then we see Darren accept Cash's boundaries and we seem them really try to support him through this development.

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Additionally, we don't see Cash label his sexuality at all. He doesn't say "I'm bisexual but don't like sex", or "I think I'm gay but sex isn't for me". This is really important because it gives room for the show to explore his sexuality in further detail later on. We can still get him discovering the word, and we can still see him finding a term to identify with (if he wants to, some people don't need a term to understand themselves).

There is so much room to talk about the difference between sexual attraction and romantic attraction, and room for the show to explore where Cash lies in that bracket of identification. We don't know if he's homoromantic, greyromantic, demiromantic, biromantic etc, and I really hope we get to see him explore that. Because it's a challenging thing to have to try to understand after coming to terms with being on the ace spectrum.

There is so much pressure to label yourself at that young age. I think it's rather positive that we have a character that understands his preferences and knows how he feels about sex without having that pressure so early on.

Sure, he likely doesn't know what asexuality is but it will be really interesting to see where the show takes this in future.

As I said, I didn't find the word to describe my sexuality until I was 18. Some people don't until they're middle aged. There's still time for Cash to discover the term and identify with the asexuality spectrum.

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We see that Cash has tried sex and didn't enjoy it. He doesn't have that urge to go further, and when he does he doesn't enjoy it. That's such good bloody representation. I can't get over it. Despite being shown to be quite anxious about how he feels around sex, he isn't shown to be ashamed of it. That's so healthy and so important.

He doesn't get it and he is still having those confusing problems with his sexuality but he isn't ashamed of it.

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Finally, I just want to reiterate that Cash not explicitly saying he's asexual does NOT mean that he isn't asexual. The writers and directors of the show have expressly said that he is asexual representation. This pressure to label yourself when you're still trying to figure things out - as Cash says directly - is really dehumanising.

Cash is a human being. He's a young person that is really confused about why he isn't like everyone else. He's having an internal struggle with his preferences and he doesn't understand why he feels the way he does, why he's "wired differently", why he doesn't "feel the same shit" as Darren and other people his age.

It's a really confusing time when you are growing up ace. It makes no sense until you find the community and you find that you're not alone.

Cash Piggott is canonically asexual and it's even more raw that he doesn't label himself so early on because that is the ace experience for so many people.

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I love Cash. I love him so much. And I hope the show explores his asexuality in more detail in the future. I think the show did this so well.

Cash's experience isn't every asexual person's experience - it's his experience. The ace experience is a very personal thing and to see it brought to life on screen in such a raw way is SO IMPORTANT.

I LOVE DOUGLAS PIGGOTT WITH MY WHOLE ACE HEART.

#heartbreak high cash #heartbreak high #cash #douglas piggott #cash piggott #ca$h #asexual #asexuality #asexual representation #aspec #asexuality spectrum #graysexual #greysexual #ace spectrum #ace #canon asexual character #darren rivers

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gold-snek-hoe · 2 months

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Hello and welcome to Opinions from an Internet Nobody. Today's essay:

"Ger therapy" is the new "You need Jesus": One Weirdo's Navigation through Cultural Shame

This is a supposedly well-meaning sentiment that is often weaponized against people who are behaving outside of perceived cultural norms. It's a favorite of homophobes who see queerness/transness as a mental illness, but I've been seeing it used to demonize kink (which historically is often linked to queerness), and more generally any "weird" behavior that makes people uncomfortable.

For example, otherkin, systems (especially those with fictives), and people who take fictional characters as partners. Y'know, "weirdos" who "can't separate reality from fiction." And, sure, sometimes there can be a problem with that distinction, but I know as well as you that most internet strangers saying "get therapy" don't actually give a shit about the mental health of those they target. It's code for "your behavior makes me uncomfortable, stop it."

Same sentiment as "you need Jesus."

This has actually taken me a long time to figure out. I've been in therapy for my entire adult life, working through various traumas, severe depression, anxiety, all that. Those were the biggest problems as they negatively impacted, and often endangered, my life. It was only after my hospitalization in 2020, where I was finally put on much needed medication, that I could start to grow into myself.

I changed my name. I top surgery. I came out as polyamorous. I finally got my official autism diagnosis. Now I'm fuckin' married! But... there are still things I'm working through in therapy. Mainly, shame over my "weirder" behaviors. My current therapist has been a huge blessing in helping me accept the things I was too ashamed to admit.

Now, I feel comfortable enough to share.

I'm otherkin. Always have been. My connection to my humanity is tenuous, and I'm sure that's connected to my autism. When mad, I feel phantom horns sprouting from my forehead. I have a tail that swishes back and forth at the base of my spine. In my soul, I am monstrous, and years of therapy has not erased that.

I feel like I'm only half in the physical world most of the time. This doesn't hinder my real-world success (I graduated college Summa Cum Laude, have an IMDB page, and am on my third book), but informs the way I look at the world. There's a whole other universe in my head that hums along with me in my day-to-day. That's part of why I'm so skilled as a writer. To ask me to divorce from that is to tell me to stop existing. Sorry, it's how I've always operated.

Lastly, and this is the one I'm really anxious about, I have a fictional husband. Now, looking at my blog, you might say "yeah, no shit," but I don't just ship myself with him. I mean I practice pop-culture Witchcraft, and the Goblin King is my patron. I mean I have a Labyrinth-themed tarot deck that I talk to him with. I mean I held a ritual to spiritually marry him. Basically, I Snape-wived myself.

And guess what? My therapist isn't concerned. It's not hurting my ability to live my life. I have other interests, hobbies, and goals outside of him, which he actively encourages in all our tarot sessions! I wouldn't be doing this if he didn't support me. My IRL spouse is usually there for whatever magical shit I'm doing, and supports me! Some of my closest friends know, and the only complaint I've gotten is "this guy seems important to you, I wish you told me sooner." Hell, my MOTHER knows and supports me, which is huge, because our relationship was pretty damaged after I came out as trans.

If you have a problem with the way I live my life, when literally nobody else does, take a good long look at why. You don't give a fuck about my mental health. You just don't like that I'm weird.

Tl;dr: My mental health is better than it's ever been since embracing the weird, so leave me and my imaginary husband Marak Sixfinger alone.

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absolutebl · 11 days

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Hi! apologies if you've answered this before, but can you recommend some bls that deal with homophobia, be it internalised or external? or more generally, bls that are not set in the bl bubble where gayness is 100% accepted?

Thank you very much <3

Ooo, sure thing!

BL's Not Set in The Bubble

BLs that deal with homophobia (internal or external) and rough coming out sequences

Began Beginning from Myanmar is all about this. It's not a BL I would necessarily recommend but it is interesting for many reasons. Both leads are dealing with massive internalize homophobia, among other issues.

Similarly: Like in the Movies and Tie the Not from the Philippines.

And Goodbye Mother and Nation's Brother from Vietnam.

From Thailand

To Sir, With Love - witnessing his family's massive homophobia that results in major tragedy as a child is what drives our main character's whole personality and self hatred. Massive trigger warning.

Until We Meet Again - the pair in the past, of course, it's the driving trauma of the relationship reincarnated. Massive trigger warning.

I Feel You Linger In the Air - fear of being caught is a through line in this drama.

More modern set stuff:

City of Stars deals with having to leave the closet as a super star. So does Close Friend Season 2 a little. The OhmFluke pair also deals with coming out to parents. Love Stage!! (Thailands version) contains one couple that chooses to remain closeted for the good of a career and another that risks it.

Moonlight Chicken - mostly about self hatred and difficulty in being out, to the point where his young nephew challenges him on it and provides a foil.

Also, ya know, TharnType and Why R U. Both have self hated and challenging coming outs because of trauma and daddy issues.

Dark Blue Kiss - Kao is terrified of being outed and it's used to blackmail him.

Similarly although he is out of Ae, Pete is being abused and blackmailed because he is gay in Love By Chance. Also Ae doesn't manage to come out... yet.

I Told Sunset About You - of course.

My Gear and Your Gown final episodes contain homophobic (or are they?) parents.

Second Chance heavily implies that there is something going on with Paper's inability to accept Fah.

Similarly Gene accepting Sib in Lovely Writer.

I'm pretty sure there's a ton of homophobia at the back end of My Tee, but honestly it's been years sicne I watched that mess.

Charming little pulp 21 Day Theory deals with quite a bti of this, but our main character has a lovely gay uncle to guide the way.

"Punch the homophobe" my favorite trope of all time, happens in Oxygen. But otherwise they neatly circumvent the patriarchs objection by defacto adopting a child to inherit.

TonhonChonlatee is all about one characters inability to acept his own queerness as encouraged by his homophobic family and various other evil characters.

My Only 12% actively tackles and calls out cultural homophobia and damaging misrepresentations.

"Why does everyone think that both of them are strange? If it's not wrong, why does everyone hurt?"

The show he's talking about is Thailand's first proto-BL, love of Siam and it is about an inability to come out.

From Japan

Life: Love on the Line - it's parental disgust and personal self hatred and paranoia that breaks them up (they get back together but he as to get over it)

Similarly His - is a kind of reunion romance after self-homophobia drove one half of the pair to marry someone else.

Actually the original series with the same characters, His the series, also deals with self acceptance around gayness, and it's subtle (Japan) but it's pretty clear one of them was kicked out of/ or left his previous school because he got outed. (Light on Me references a similar situation, but it's ultra subtle.)

If It's With You also kinda falls into this category. Not sure these can be called "dealing with" it tho, more side stepping and alluding to it.

Tokyo in April is - yeah it's kinda the whole thing from one half of this pair

What Did You Eat Yesterday also has a coming out to the parents thread throughout, and a coming out at work thing, but it's not really the point of the show.

From Korea

Most Korean BL are gonna be out. The specialize in the bubble. Although a case could be made for Love For Love's Sake and Love Class. And, see comment, Jazz for Two.

One noted exception is Just Friends which is a short piece about coming out to mom while on leave from the military. This is one of Korea's earliest BL pieces and not strictly BL, but it's fascinating in that neither theme (military nor coming out) would reall be reused again.

From Taiwan

My Tooth Your Love - has a kinda different take and we aren't sure, as viewers whether it's because he's gay or because he's not doing what the Patriarch wishes. But trigger warning for [physical abuse.

DNA Says Love You deals with this and other forms of queerphobia during the later half. Slow start but I do love this show.

Faded is a propaganda piece (pro marriage equality) which is all about coming out to a parent.

In H4CTY Xing Si (of the side couple) is having a hard time coming out but that's complied by the fact that he's fucking his stepbrother, it's a mess, bit I enjoy them - v problematic couple tho.

Papa & Daddy actually has a coming out sequence (GASP!) where the parents don't take it well as does Love is Science? (sides) - but the later is mostly because disaster bi is also baby daddy.

Red Balloon, of course, and it's sibling movie Your Name Engraved Herein are kinda all about self loathing and suffering because of gayness and lack of acceptance.

Unknown is certainly tackling some of this.

In which I talk about some of my favorite coming out sequences:

He's Coming to Me has my favorite series of coming out sequences to both friends and mother.

A few more that I really don't like (Promise) and probably Together With Me should be here, but I willfully can't remember them.

(source)

#bls with angst around coming out #bls that deal with homophobia #bls that are not set in the bl bubble where gayness is 100% accepted #mostly thai bl #thai bl #japanese bl #taiwanese bl #historical bl

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the-crooked-library · 5 months

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Hannibal and Control

Alright so out of all the Hannibal interpretations out there, I don't think there are any that irritate me more than the idea of an unequal balance between him and Will. There's this opinion floating around - that he is so much of a control freak that he can never let Will make his own decisions; I've seen it in fic, in Tiktok videos, an occasional textpost, and it is just so grossly incorrect that I have to say something on the subject.

As early as season 2, we get this:

This is perhaps one of the most famous scenes in the series - in which Hannibal states, out loud, canonically, that the reason he is so fascinated by Will is because, unlike most other people, he can never truly predict him. No matter how much he may "whisper through the chrysalis," Will Graham will find a way to surprise him; he expressly doesn't follow the lines Hannibal has written for him, and that is a key element of their relationship throughout the show.

Now, I am not denying that control is a prominent element of Hannibal's life - it is indubitably important; but it is not everything - especially in this particular context. As much as he maintains that iron grip on himself, it does not reach nearly the same extent with Will; and it falls apart entirely by season 3, in which Hannibal explicitly gives up his control of the story, risking his life and freedom - both things he valued above all else earlier in Mizumono.

The message here is clear; as much as his control, his liberty, his own continued existence matter, Will Graham is infinitely more precious to him; and to suggest otherwise - that he would attempt to fully subjugate the man he views as his only equal, as the only deity he recognizes - frankly, he'd call it blasphemy.

Moreover, this interpretation of their relationship stems not only from a mischaracterization of Hannibal himself, but also from a rampant infantilization of Will. There is a tendency in some areas of the fandom to entirely absolve Will Graham of his guilt; and, with the culpability handed over to Hannibal in its entirety, he assumes the role of an innocent, redeemable, good person in the eyes of such viewers - which could not be further from the truth. Will Graham's agency is integral to the story; though he wrestles with some moral dilemmas throughout the series, he is ultimately responsible for his own choices, especially post-season 1. There is a clear distinction between circumstance and desire - for instance, Randall Tier did invade his home, which did force him into violence; however, it did not force him to throw aside his gun, or relish the brutality, or bring the body to Hannibal, or eat of it, or display parts of it, or store the rest in his freezer.

He did all that himself.

He knows that.

Will Graham's infantilization (no, he was manipulated, he was tricked, Hannibal tempted him into something he didn't want, he didn't want to be a murderer, he is a sweet darling boy) is rooted not only in homophobia, but also in the same sort of ableism real-world autistic adults face every day. His own desires and agency get overwritten by that ever-present bigotry; the same way that some people believe that autistics cannot give consent to sexual activity, or participate in nuanced discussions, or understand the harm or violence they do, the other characters assume that he is fundamentally an innocent right until the very end. Jack, Alana, Molly, even Chilton make that mistake; and Will does play on their ignorance within the world of the story - but it is truly discouraging to see the success of his act extend to the viewers, who should have the necessary context to understand it for the lie it is.

He has agency, and it is paramount to the themes of a series that explores queer desire, internalized homophobia, and the guilt that often surrounds this sort of experience.

As such, the story, from Hannibal's perspective, is about learning to let go of his otherwise unwavering control; it's about finding a common ground with someone that understands him, and allowing himself the final trust fall. From Will's perspective, it is a coming out story, with everything that entails - which also culminates in him taking a leap of faith into the arms of the man he loves. The reason why Hannigram is so enduring as a ship is because it is founded on that balance; to deny this equality, therefore, is to fundamentally undermine the theme of these characters' narrative, and twist them into caricatures of themselves.

In short, it does them a disservice.

#hannibal #nbc hannibal #hannigram #hannibal lecter #will graham #if you think that will is somehow innocent in their dynamic. you should watch seasons 2 and 3 again. then go back and rewatch season 1 #that man has been a freak from the beginning #hannibal nbc

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jesncin · 2 months

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Do you have any favorite books or comics that you'd recommend?

Superhero comics or in general? I'll go in general, haha:

Our Dreams At Dusk by Yuhki Kamatani

This is the book series I'm most obnoxiously recommending people. It's influenced me ever since, Lunar Boy is a direct homage to this short series in many ways. It talks about the lived realities of being queer and Japanese in Japan- the queerphobia, the mental health struggles, the relationships (romantic and platonic) in an in depth way. It opened my eyes to what the queer narrative can be, and I'm forever grateful for it. This story is so good it actively ruins all other queer media for me, haha.

Superman Smashes the Klan by Gene Yang and Gurihiru

This is the book I most successfully recommend to people. What can I say that I haven't said many times before? A reimagining of the classic Klan of the Fiery Cross arc from the classic Superman radio show, empathetically revitalized. A story that actually acknowledges and understands Superman as a direct immigrant allegory?? Where he relates to a Chinese American family being targeted by the Klan?? I love it, and many people have picked up how I'm influenced by it! You don't need to know anything about Superman or his lore, this is a very accessible story for newbies. If you want to know why I love Superman, this is it. This story is so good it actively ruins all other Superman media for me, haha.

Salt Magic by Hope Larson and Rebecca Mock

One of my recent all time favorite graphic novels!! This story is everything I love about fairytales perfectly told in the graphic novel format. When a mysterious woman curses a family farm by turning their water supply into entirely undrinkable salt water- Vonceil must embark on an adventure to uplift the curse that hangs over her family history. Also Rebecca Mock's art is INCREDIBLE.

Homunculus by Joe Sparrow

Shortbox, the publisher for this comic, is retiring soon so order this book now! Or any books from them that you fancy (discount code here)! From the indie scene, Homunculus is a beloved short comic about a machine with growing sentience witnessing the end of the world, and what comes after. The style is lovely and the story is deceptively simple! It's heartbreaking by the end.

Berrybrook Middle School Series (Awkward, Brave, Crush, Enemies) by Svetlana Chmakova

This series is the reason I wanted to make middle grade graphic novels, and is in my humble opinion- the best in the business. Each story is self contained, with a cast of recurring characters that all go to Berrybrook middle school. It covers a wide variety of young experiences in an empathetic way that doesn't feel like you're being talked down to. It's a book series that nurtures the children it's for. I cried reading Brave, and Crush is such an important book that I'm ecstatic that kids get to read.

The Weight Of Our Sky by Hanna Alkaf

If you liked my Who Is Superman: A Private Interview with Lois Lane comic and want to learn more about the historical context behind it- I recommend The Weight Of Our Sky by Hanna Alkaf. It doesn't cover the same history (this book is about the 1969 race riots in Malaysia), but it's such an eerily similar incident that I felt myself reflected in it. Hanna is an incredibly vivid writer, and she handles so many topics with sensitive care. She highlights that historical events like this need to be remembered, and how fictional stories can breathe new life into an increasingly forgotten history. Also Hanna is so nice.

A Monster Calls by Patrick Ness (original idea by Siobhan Dowd)

One of my all time favorite novels, with hauntingly beautiful mixed media illustrations by Jim Kay. I love how this book covers grief in such a messy and fantastical way- showing how its young protagonist has larger than life feelings he's trying to contain from the looming eventual death of his mom's illness. This book is special because it was conceived originally by Siobhan Dowd as she was going through terminal cancer, in collaboration with her editor and Ness. It feels like an intimate experience, and this heavy feeling of grief carries the whole book in a memorable way.

Those are my fav books off the top of my head! Happy reading :>

#askjesncin #booklr #longish post #i miss having time to read novels i should do that again before work piles up #[proceeds to read cape comics instead]

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oneangstymotherfucker · 11 months

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Another thing that bothers me is the way antis will use the word "coded". Coded is a word for groups that aren't allowed to have explicit representation to use for when authors make something that's obviously for them under the radar. Like queer coded. In kids shows there can also be stuff with coding for neurodivergent characters, and race coding can also be a thing. The idea is authors can't directly do what they want because society is being a dick (like they want to make x and x characters gay or have a Black main character) and so they code it so that people of those groups can still see themselves in it and Understand What They Mean.

So "child-coded" and "family-coded" are not things that even make sense. If the author wanted a character to be read as related or a child they would have simply written them that way! Nothing was stopping them! I respect all headcannons, but you headcannoning someone as a child or related and seeing your own evidence for it is not the same as coding.

Do you know what is coded though? Sebaciel. That ship is so heavily queer coded- in everything from the way the characters are drawn to the age gap to the campiness to the contract, the relationship-that-isn't-a-relationship-because-taboo!

These are classic queer tropes. They are all over the place in queer fiction, especially older queer fiction, to illustrate and emotionally navigate relationships that are considered by society predatory and taboo. Queers have always been painted as predatory. Because when you kicked out your teenage kid for being queer, guess where they went? They found some older queers to take them in. And support them in ways you never could, and see their strengths. And then people would say little Johnny was "seduced" or "taken advantage of" by some "degenerates" and "perverts" because they didn't want to take the blame of putting little Johnny on the streets. (Ofc sometimes im sure there were predators doing this maliciously, but that doesn't mean it was always the case. Not everyone wants to take advantage of people.)

Queer people also tend to have overlapping relationships because of social ostricization. For example, your dating history is your friend group and back in the days of Houses and mentors, your dating history might also have them in it too.

Age gaps are also a very quintessential trope in queer fiction. It makes a lot of sense when you think of how someone whose family life was suddenly cut short (or never really there in the first place) would end up wanting the sort of dynamic where someone was there to take care of them. And again- I'm sure that this was sometimes abused by a handful of people, but it as a fiction and as a desire is part of queer history and has been for hundreds of years. Most people whose parents pushed them aside or actively hurt them end up with daddy/mommy issues! Not everyone of course but a good amount! I want a daddy! I feel so much younger than I am because I am only just now getting to live my life as me!!! So of course i project myself onto and want to read stories about some little victorian boy and his op demon butler!!

Do you understand what I'm saying?

Ciel is very heavily queer coded. He was ignored by his family and then forcibly removed from it (because they died here, ofc) and the fact that he is essentially rescued from his powerlessness, aloneness, from being abused and taken advantage of by Sebastian, who is also very queer coded, ticks a lot of boxes. Then there's the whole messaging of Sebastian being seen as an abusive monster (when he is really quite caring of Ciel) and Ciel being seen as some perverted, broken, godless freak (ey what queers haven't heard those?), the religious implications of "making a pact with a demon" ("you can't be holy because of this relationship! Satan made u gay!!!!"), the victorian setting, the costume choices, the idea of being eaten, hell even the kinky undertones of the power dynamics- there are too many queer tropes to count. Even Ciel's age, when taken metaphorically- someone who hasn't been given the chance to have much experience, who isn't taken seriously, who does not have the social standing of someone who can hold their own against "grownups"- can all be read as coding for someone being descriminated against. Raise your hand if you're queer and have been called 'boy' or 'girl' derogatory/been treated like a kid for no reason!

I'd go so far as to say that most of the reason Black Butler squicks so many people is because the coding is so overt and obvious, but people still take it literally and think it just means "p3dO!1!!!1!". Probably because ya'll stay away from queer history because the Elders reclaimed slurs and that makes u angry lol.

The fact is even if Sebastian and Ciel never "get together", their relationship is still inherently queer and always will be. And quite frankly if it was cannon then it wouldn't be coded anymore it would just be gay. :)

Anyways thats how i feel about coding thanks for comin to my ted talk. x

#sebaciel #proship #queer fiction #queer coded #coding #black butler #kuroshitsuji #ciel phantomhive #sebastian michaelis #sebastian x ciel #queer history #im not even halfway through the show yet and i have so many feelings god #yaoi

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ilovedthestars · 4 months

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and also just. the way ambiguity in relationships is assumed to be romantic, too. see, i wrote that whole post a while back about how I loved ambiguous fictional relationships, with deep devotion but no clear label as to the type of relationship. i called it love as in significance--that's where my tag comes from. love as in being important to someone, in whatever form that takes.

and what I said then about how this applies to romance still applies--when I'm reading about a fictional romance, I'll be much more engaged with one that feels built on that foundation of significance than one that isn't. flirting, the trappings of modern courtship, those feel empty to me without the feeling that these characters already matter to each other. (this is why in real life I'm so perplexed by things like dating apps, or people who actively seek out romance with strangers--I just personally can't fathom the idea of wanting that kind of closeness with someone you don't already know and care for.)

but in regards to ambiguity....I feel like I've been burned a little. I loved ambiguity because it meant you could take many things away from it. other people could see romance, but I could see the kind of deeply devoted platonic relationship that, let's be honest, is incredibly rare in fiction. but I'm starting to feel frustrated by the way ambiguity is assumed to be romance, without an explicit statement that it's not. (I've joked about the obligatory "no hetero" moments that have to be inserted into the start of a piece of media that has a male and a female protagonist with any kind of relationship other than romance--the "not with those lips" moment in the D&D movie, for example. It's funny, and i appreciate it being made very clear, but it's kind of sad that it has to be.)

and...okay, there's an elephant in the room that i really should acknowledge. I was talking about it in that first post, but I made a point of never mentioning it, although i'm sure plenty of people guessed.

I haven't watched Good Omens season two. I'm not sure if I'm ever going to. When I first wrote about my love for ambiguous relationships back in February of 2023, Aziraphale and Crowley were at the top of my list. When I wrote about how ambiguity left room for anyone to see themselves represented, and how i wished that a little more space was left for aro voices, I was talking about them. I was frustrated by people who saw that ambiguity as "queerbaiting"--didn't they see that the story was already queer, that Aziraphale and Crowley cared so deeply for each other, and whether they kissed or not wouldn't change anything?

But they did kiss. And it did change something. I don't feel like there's a place left for me anymore. And there's social pressure to celebrate, to be happy for another canon queer love story on TV, and god I'd love to celebrate that, but I can't help but feel a little betrayed by a story that I thought would leave space for me.

(and yes, a kiss doesn't have to mean romance--but in this, in hollywood, it's assumed to. the creators and the audience both understand it as such, unless someone stops to say no, we're friends who kiss each other the mouth, we're subverting your expectations. because the expectations are inescapable.)

I've been trying to give myself the space to feel upset about this. To remember that aro stories are queer stories too. And I think I'm raising my standards. I'll take ambiguity--I'll take any carved-out space I can find. But I'm not sure I trust it anymore. I want explicitly platonic relationships with the level of love and devotion and care usually reserved for romance. I want to read and watch and listen to stories about people who are significant to each other without romance even being in the picture. I want love that isn't synonymous with romance. I'm going to stop feeling like I have to settle for anything less.

#stars has thoughts #aro thoughts #love as in significance #platonic love #amatonormativity #aphobia #sorry for not tagging this go2 spoilers but it's been a while and i think everyone's either seen it or given up avoiding spoilers #and i frankly don't want to put this anywhere near a good omens tag #also: as usual this is a complaint about broader media trends that can't be solved by a few counter examples #BUT i will still take media recs especially from fellow aspecs #i need more platonic love stories in my life

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aro-bird · 3 months

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I do have to say, as someone on the camp of "you could probably ship someone else who isn't non-partnering but honestly I don't care as long as you don't harass people over this", I think it's lost on some people that the reason why so many non-partnering aroaces may become defensive over these characters even if "it's just fandom" is the fact that a lot of aroaces who do fit these stereotypes and who may fall into this camp genuinely had horrible experiences about their social circles and yes, especially this fandom site, harassing them and saying they don't exist or that they're mentally ill and should "get fixed" among other things.

As common it is to see aspecs here on Tumblr, the queer social media site, you need to understand that there's still a lot of contempt for aroaces outside and inside this place. Hell, I received an ask calling aros and aces delusional just last Christmas Day 2023 that came with a wave of increased arophobia around that time. As much as that time period was definitely discourse against aroallo men, aphobes did not cherry pick on who they're sending hate to.

Besides this, a lot of non-partnering aroaces often receive this kind of dismissal in real life too and as much as some people may think it's not a big deal, it definitely fucks up your brain when people say you and your experiences not only don't matter but you are doomed to live a lonely and miserable life if you don't find someone. Even my otherwise very supportive relatives expressed this concern and it's absolutely out of care but it's fucking damaging to constantly hear that I will die alone if I don't find a partner (romantic, platonic, or otherwise).

This is besides dismissals like this or even non-acceptance had literally barred me from mental health care when I was a teenager because my specialist said I had a "distressed sexuality" and had specialists focused on that aspect rather than all my other issues.

The shipping of a non-partnering (typically romance repulsed or uninterested) character feels like another form of dismissal for someone like me, like my sexuality is not good enough or serious enough to be respected. The shipping of these characters sometimes reinforce the narrative that non-partnering aroace people can't find happiness on their own and do need someone (romantic, platonic, or otherwise) to be happy or they will become happier if they do find this someone. People are having fun with their ships but there are still many people who don't want to spend the time actually extending grace and understanding towards me and my experiences. I'm just another discourse topic and someone who's inconvenient to some of them.

This doesn't even account for how these fan communities aren't just filled with aspec people and do extend to allos who may take some of the discourse and actively apply it in real life to other real life aspec people. People who go and interact with real human beings and may hurt them or harass them. It isn't even accounting for the fact that even online things affect real people too.

Of course, I do understand that a lot more complex aspec identities often don't get the spotlight so they may express themselves through shipping fandom characters but non-partnering people should deserve more than these people isn't really the point of this post.

The point here is that there's a reason why a lot of non-partnering (typically repulsed or uninterested) aroace people get defensive about these things even in fan communities and it's very likely that it's because aphobia and especially against the stereotypical aroace™ still very much exist outside of our little community and they can be informed by media and the fans that consume it and this shit could genuinely have negative consequences. This of course extends to those who do have complex aspec identities as society does not treat those who don't live up to what is expected as "normal" in terms of romantic relationships and sexual attraction kindly.

Distancing yourself from these aroaces who do have frustrations with how media and fandom treat their sexuality because they're being "prudes" or are just affected by "purity culture" is unhelpful to say the least and honestly veers eerily close to shit I hear aphobes say about us.

Absolutely do stop people and block them if they're instigating and participating in harassment over shipping of all things, even these aroaces, but trying to say that every person who do have issues with shipping aroace characters are the same way with this is extremely lacking nuance and absolutely dismissive of other members of the community and why they may have the opinion they hold.

#mayaposts #shipping #ship #shipping discourse #aroace #aroace representation #aro #ace #aromantic #asexual #aromantic asexual #<- again sorry for tagging these it is relevant since the discussion is more community wide #the disk horse #<- tagging this here bc yes this is definitely related to that discourse too #amatonormativity #allonormativity

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exhuastedpigeon · 12 days

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Buckxtommy? Eww 🤢🤢 tommy is racist

I wasn't going to answer this because you're clearly a child without the ability to understand that characters, like real people, can grow, but actually I'm going to answer it and it's going to be LONG.

This got really long so I'm putting it under the cut but if you don't want to read it there's the TLDR:

Tommy was, at best, a passive member of the boys club at the 118 when we first meet him and at worst an active member who made Chim and Hen's lives harder when they first joined, but as the shitty people left the 118 and were replaced with less shitty people, Tommy starts to become kinder and more accepting and less of a toxic macho man.

He's friends with Chim and Hen when he leaves the 118. He's been away from the 118 for probably 7-8 years at this point and in that time he has clearly continued to grow.

People can change. People do change. Sometimes it takes meeting new people to spur that change and sometimes it takes a change in scenery. For Tommy it seems to have taken a mix of both to get him to where he is today - a funny, sweet, kind, queer man who is willing to STEAL A HELICOPTER and FLY INTO A FUCKING HURRICANE because someone he worked with for a few years almost a decade ago had a hunch. He believed Hen and Chim. He trusts them and they trust him.

So here's my question anon? Why don't you?

And now for the very long part under the cut...

When we first meet Tommy Kinard in Chimney Begins he is a part of the old boys club that is the LAFD and the 118. He's a person surrounded by shitty people and he adapts and behaves like them.

We don't know much about Tommy, but by the end of the episode he accepts Chim as a teammate and friend because Chim proves himself to Tommy. Do I think you should have to prove yourself to be accepted? No. But i understand the thought process because you're relying on people to have your back and save your life. We also find out Tommy's favorite movie is a romcom - not your typical toxicly masculine answer.

He shows growth in Chimney Begins and I cannot stress this enough, at the end of that episode Chim and Tommy are friends. We don't have an exact date at the end of Chimney Begins, but we can assume based on when Bobby joins and when Hen joins that it was at least a decade prior, if not more to where we are currently in canon.

In Hen Begins Tommy is still a part of the boys club at the 118, but you can see that he (and a lot of the team) don't actually agree with Captain Gerard, but he's their boss. They can't exactly call him out because that puts their own job on the line. You can see Tommy look at Gerard like 'what the fuck' when he calls Hen a "diversity hire" but he doesn't say anything in that moment - Chim does and Gerard brushes him off.

Sal makes a gay joke about Tommy in this episode and Tommy plays it off as a joke because what else is he suppose to do? Tommy looks uncomfortable when Gerard starts going on about female recruitment in the LAFD and him saying/implying that female firefighters aren't as strong, etc. He doesn't say anything, but I ask? Would you be brave enough to risk your job for someone you just met a few months ago?

When Hen gives her big speech Tommy looks back at Chim and sees him nodding. He looks at Chim because (I think) he's reminded of how they treated Chim when he first started. It's Tommy that says Hen's instincts are good after she disobeys orders and goes looking for another victim (who would have died if she hadn't). Tommy and Sal shake her hand and then Tommy pats her on the shoulder and says 'you're good'.

This interaction is both similar to and different from Tommy's 'moment' with Chim. Similar because it seems like Tommy needs new firefighters to prove they can be there before he trusts them and different because the Chim and Tommy moment is framed as the start of a friendship and that moment with Hen and Tommy is framed as the start of a good working relationships.

The next scene is Hen talking to their new interim captain about how her colleagues are impressed with her and how they've filed complaints against Captain Gerard. We can assume that Tommy was one of those colleagues.

Then we get Bobby Begins Again - Tommy is laughing and joking with Hen about how long the new captain will last. Tommy even asks to place a bet on credit and Hen jokingly says he better pay because she knows the bookie.

Tommy is shown to be a part of the team - the Hen and Chim team - on calls. Yes, he's still friends with Sal but he's much less likely to be at Sal's side when Sal makes shitty comments. Tommy even tells Sal to stop when Sal starts going off on Bobby.

The next scene we see Tommy in is him hanging out with Hen and Chim at a bar - when Hen tells them that Bobby didn't fire Sal, he suspended him and found him a new spot, Tommy takes that information and accepts Bobby because he finds out he's a good man and a good captain.

Then we see Tommy, Chim, Hen, and Bobby hanging out, sharing war stories. We even hear Tommy talk about 'scars helping him get women' because he's still not out with the team yet - he's still hiding that part of himself because he isn't ready yet (and because that wasn't a part of the storyline for Tommy at the time).

The rest Tommy's part in Bobby Begins Again is just showing how the 118 is becoming more than just a team - family dinner for example. Tommy smiles and is excited at the idea of 'family dinner'.

When he leaves the 118 Hen and Chim are happy for him and celebrate the move because it's a good career move for him. They even smash his face into the cake!!!

AND THEN in Broken Chim calls Tommy to ask him for a favour. A favour that saves the 118s asses.

That doesn't even touch on the Tommy of today - the Tommy who is brave and kind and trusting and funny. The Tommy that Chim is friends with, that Eddie is now friends with, that Buck has a HUGE crush on.

If you like the Firefam (which I'm hoping you do since they're the main cast of the show) I would hope you also trust their judgement. If they like a character who wasn't great in the past but has grown, we should see that growth and hopefully like them too.

You can dislike Tommy all you want, but don't try to tell me it's because 'he's racist' because that isn't true. He's evolved like people do. We should want more characters like Tommy because they remind us that just because we've done something shitty in the past it doesn't mean we can't grow too.

Anyone who says OOH TOMMY IS A RACIST HOW CAN YOU LIKE HIM clearly doesn't watch the show. Just because his development happened off screen doesn't mean it didn't happen.

#asked and answered #long post #i'm so annoyed at y'all #i went back and watched parts of all three begins eps for this #and YOU CAN SEE THE GROWTH IN EACH OF THEM #911 #tommy kinard

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themostineptthateverstepped · 6 months

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Obviously, I am very tense about the Loki finale tonight, so this post may not age well, but I just have to say this.

The kiss in the season 1 finale was super weird. Not just because it was some strange version of selfcest, but because there was no real chemistry there. It genuinely felt like Sylvie's last-ditch effort to distract/confuse Loki enough to achieve her goal of killing He Who Remains. And that is exactly what that was. She kissed him, he looked completely defeated during said kiss, and then she kicked him through a time door, killed Kang, and then went about her life.

She did not look at all pleased to see Loki again, and there has been no spark of anything between them the entire season. Even when they join hands to use their magic, it looks like siblings. THEY READ LIKE SIBLINGS. There really hasn't been any effort put into developing their chemistry or connection romantically. Even in their most recent interaction at the bar, Sylvie is playing the detached therapist, trying to guide Loki into admitting what he already knows, the true "why" behind his mission, and it isn't her. She even explicitly defines that she has her own story and path and advises him to write his own. Separately.

Now all of this is a long way of saying that, if they move forward and push Sylkie on us at the eleventh hour, I won't be angry because it's not my ship, I will be angry because they did absolutely nothing to grow it, to nurture it, to have it make any real narrative sense.

Yes, this is Tumblr, and we all love a good gay ship (because we are sad and gay and starved for representation), but Loki and Mobius actually make narrative sense. Not only do they each represent the other's turning point and catalyst for growth and change, but they are also two characters that have developed into something together. Their evolution is incredible, and we have been given scenes all season that parallel their growth, in the way Mobius doesn't hesitate to trust Loki, how he embraces Loki's mischief, how Loki comes back to Mobius again and again, defends him, comforts him. They have actively built the framework for Lokius, even heavily implying that Mobius is the "who" that guides Loki's time slipping.

However they choose to manifest Loki and Mobius' relationship, if they leave it ambiguous, if it's queer-platonic, if it's whatever, they at the very least need to make it abundantly clear that THIS is the fundamental relationship. Their bond is the heart of the show.

Loki needs to love Sylvie because he needs to be able to love and embrace himself as he is, all of his strengths, and all of his weaknesses. Sylvie, who is still so impulsive and bent on revenge, is an excellent opportunity for him to see where he came from and love her anyway. But we've seen him face her impulsive violence, and instead of him meeting her there and joining in, we saw him become calm and compassionate - we saw how Mobius had helped him to grow. We need Loki and Sylvie to love each other, because that is how they are going to heal, it's how they aren't going to lose. But it's self-acceptance, it's the love you have to have before you can truly love someone else, and I think given Loki's long arc as a character, we need to see him beak out of his narcissism, move beyond just loving himself, and truly love someone else.

They more than paved the way for Mobius and Loki, and if they through that away for Sylkie, it won't just be sinking a perfectly good ship, it would be horrifically ignorant, wasteful storytelling. And this is the God of Stories, so if you fuck this up... I mean. Just don't okay?

#loki #pre loki finale #lokius #loki season 2 #long meta post #i really just went for it #loki laufeyson #mobius m mobius #sylvie laufeydottir #sylvie #loki series #get ready clowns

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spicybylerpolls · 25 days

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All of the teenage relationships are sexualised from the get-go. Stancy's introduction was all about the trope where bad boy Steve just wants to try getting good girl Nancy into bed. Jancy is also immediately sexualised when Jonathan takes the spicy photos of Nancy. And Steve and Robin make booby jokes before Vickie is even introduced. Meanwhile for Stobin, we only really got Steve thinking that he and Robin would be a cute couple but no sexual innuendos whatsoever, hinting that the relationship will not happen because there is no sexual attraction there.

It is initially a bit different for Mileven/Lumax/Byler because they are actually kids at the start of the show. But Season 3 makes such a big fuss about them not being kids anymore and it is coincidentally also the time some of the characters start to make innuendos themselves. Which also means that who they liked as kids is not necessarily who they are eventually attracted to as teenagers.

In comparison to the other teenage relationships, Mileven seems to be a relationship free of any sexual implications. In Season 3 Hopper wants the door certainly not open because he is afraid of them kissing - however, Mike and El never overtly express a desire for sex, neither with each other nor for other people. Milevens like to say "Oh, this means that Mike and El only have eyes for each other" although the sexual implications are completely absent from their relationship.

Of course you could argue that the characters may be demi/ace, but I think especially in Mike's case it is made clear that he is not acespec but a repressed queer (with the Season 4 Episode 1 montage as biggest proof). Some people also insisted (and still insist) that Will is ace too because they are subconsciously so afraid to see any sort of queer attraction on screen. (As a person on the acespec myself, I really long for the day where asexuality is finally done justice on screen. But Stranger Things is clearly a show where they actively contrast lack of sexual attraction and actual sexual attraction with each other. Unfortunately, 99% of media does not include intentionally-accurate representation of asexuality, so right now Stranger Things is not under the obligation to be the show that is suddenly an exception)

This is all so true! People try to argue that Mike and El "making out all the time" is evidence that they have interest in sexual exploration, but A) the show very clearly draws our attention to the fact that he takes his hands off her when they're making out, B) Mike doesn't express sexual interest in the Phoebe Cates, the hot girl of the day, like his friends, C) the show draws our attention to how unnatural it is by having Hopper comment on it, and D) this doesn't progress or increase in any way. In fact, it decreases. In S4, they have one fairly awkward kiss and never show any signs of desire for each other. Instead, the emphasis is on Mike not being able to say ILY to her.

For a ship that's allegedly the main ship, this is all pretty unusual. When was the last time you saw a ship with teenage characters who "only have eyes for each other" yet never show even the slightest sign that they want to explore the physical side of things, even if only 2nd base? It's like Mike got to 1st base and immediately wanted to abort mission and backtrack and never do anything straight again.

Some Milkvans will say it's because Mike is a gentleman, but... come on. Lucas is a gentleman with Max, and the show goes out of its way to emphasize his sexual desire multiple times. Dustin and his girlfriend aren't even in the same state, and she's a devout Mormon, and still there's no doubt that Dustin would round all the bases multiple times in a heartbeat if he got the chance.

Meanwhile, everything between Mike and El looks like a weird, unnatural performance. And they don't even kiss in the desert!

Especially considering the fact that Mike and Will, who are allegedly just platonic friends, do show signs of physical desire. This is what they're like JUST touching arms ever so slightly. Get a room.

#spicy byler #byler #mike wheeler #will byers #anti mileven #no poll

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